Recruiting: Down in the Gutter - Second Phase, Life in Redmond's Newest Street Gang Options

[Meriss]

Actually Sly and Baby would make an excellent B&E team.

[Whipstitch]

I noticed that Ink's basically a Hardware+Maglock specialization away from being indispensable on B&E jobs with that 4 Logic and Lockpicking of his. We've got some sneaky gits in this crew (My guy included!) but so far none of us really combine much in the way of technical know-how AND stealthiness. I was going to tack it onto my build (it costs all of 6 bps, after all), but it just didn't quite seem worth it with Cuervo's underwhelming logic.

[Neuntöter]

ugh, i just popped in to explain my silence.
i have some pretty urgent, last-minute university stuff to take care of. Including moving to another city. So my internet access might be a bit shaky for the next few days.

[Dantic]

Actually Sly and Baby would make an excellent B&E team.

Hey, trying to get close to Baby is Twiggs' angle, Back Off! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

[Slipshade]

Baby is good at getting places quietly, but she has no B & E skills. What makes her useful is the combo of knowledges and skills she has. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Though she wouldn't say no to a little B&E. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Dantic - LOL! You poor boy.

Neuntoter - Thanks for the update.

[Slipshade]

Rico

Your numbers look good, but before we pass it on to WR1, I need you to work on Rico's background a little more. Questions 1-13 in your background are all one line answers that really need some work.

Also your personality and description on Rico's main page are only one or two lines. These things are very important. Not only for you, but for others to write takes on Rico and get to know the character a little before interacting. When you have worked on getting his background fleshed out more, then we can send it on to WinterRat1/

[Eyeless Blond]

I noticed that Ink's basically a Hardware+Maglock specialization away from being indispensable on B&E jobs with that 4 Logic and Lockpicking of his. We've got some sneaky gits in this crew (My guy included!) but so far none of us really combine much in the way of technical know-how AND stealthiness. I was going to tack it onto my build (it costs all of 6 bps, after all), but it just didn't quite seem worth it with Cuervo's underwhelming logic.

Whereas Drip has crazy-go-nuts Hardware, but only 4 dice to infiltration. If you could somehow combine all of us together you might get one good shadowrunner. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Havok]

Do you think an explosives skill would be justified given the fact that there are absolutely no explosives available within our starting availability? I'm working up a detailed history as I write this (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) And I think Sly would love Baby, in a Leon-Professional-esque manner. (I love that movie)

Dermal Plating 3, Muscle Replacement 3, Hand Razors, Handblades, and Spurs are allowed regardless of availablility (Shaped Dermal Plating (Augmentation) is not included in this exemption)

would that, in fact, then count as your single high-rating item? Or are they simply that readily available on the street, I.E. any ganger worth his salt at least has some scraped-from-the-bottom cyberware in order just to survive?

[Havok]

Whew. You asked for it, and here it is, three hours later lol. This history means that Sly would be a relative newcomer to the Ravens, I don't know if that would be a problem. I also have an extremely rough draft of a character sheet worked up. The only thing that MIGHT be a question is if the Muscle Replacement falls under the "one high rating item" rule, in which case I just need to replace the Chameleon Suit with a reversi-camo suit.

Sly

[ Spoiler ]

Appearance: Standing at just over 1.4 meters tall, and weighing in at a little under 50 kg, Sly is a small, slender elf with typical elven charm (although any elf would tell you he was ugly). He normally wears dull, indistinguishable black clothing when he's not sporting his Chammy suit. Quiet, yes. Withdrawn, certainly. But when he speaks, its usually worth it to listen, because he doesn't waste his time.

Stuph!(Wow!)
He typically carries a stun baton, shock gloves, a Yamaha Pulsar, and an Ares Viper for when things get really nasty. Included in his arsenal of delights are El Diablo, his Remington 990 (for when things get REALLY bad) and Whisper, the Ruger 100 that he recieved as a present from "Father" among others. He also has a multitude of BnE tools, and more importantly escaping tools "just in case." Also "just in case" he has a map of the kingsgate sewers and surrounding area (rating 4). Makes it useful to get stuff from point A to point B, as long as you don't run into any Ghouls.

Skillz: Obviously from the name, Sly has a fairly good handle on stealth skills, BnE skills, and running-away skills. He's also an excellent sniper\shotgunner and he knows a lot of debateably useful stuff. I mean, living in Kingsgate, who REALLY needs to ask someone where the local crooks hang out?

History:Some kids have it easy, with loving parents and a family that cares about them. Some kids have abusive families, with parents that beat the shit out of them. Given the choice, Sly would have taken the second option. See, Sly never knew his parents, they were gunned down when he was three. It was simply a matter of wrong place, wrong end of a shadowrunner's bullet hose.

So they did what they do with all the SINless babies nobody wants: they stuck him in an orphanage. Unfortunately, or perhaps you could say fortunately for him, Sly (dubbed John Abraham Steele) was small, and in an orphanage with over a hundred other children that meant he got the shit end of the stick. He grew up on little to no food, since there wasn't enough to go around and the others beat him up for his. It became apparent that he needed to become better at them.

By the age of five, John had become adjusted to the new life, and hated every minute of it. No warm, caring mother was there to hold him at night, and there was no father to teach him the ways of baseball, and riding of bikes. They didn't even have a TV. Somewhere out there, he just knew it, kids were having a great time without him. So he did what any normal kid would do when locked away for two years... he tried to escape. Except unbeknownst to him, the orphanage was collecting a nice little government grant check for him, and of course they couldn't just let their stipend walk out the door.

That day was the worst day of his life, and at the same time it changed him. Scolded, spanked, and sent to bed with no supper, John still managed to steal some food from one of the other kids. It was in that moment he decided that he could either be small and weak, or he could use his smallness to his advantage. Being small meant he could go places and do things the bigger kids couldn't do, and so he learned all he could about that.

John waited, and he practised sneaking up on people, and one day, about 3 years later, his chance came. There was a big inspection lady coming down, she did it every year to "check on things". John hated her, she asked all sorts of questions like how he was doing and then when he told her she just laughed and patted his head. At least she gave him a lolly. Anyways, this time was different, because he saw that they changed the bedsheets every time she came. John was smart, and earned his nickname by hiding in the bedsheets which were taken outside to a cleaning place. By the time they figured out he was missing, John was long gone.

The next phase of his life was by far rougher than the previous, but it was there he learned most of his life skills. The streets were a lot different than he thought, but John adapted better than most with his keen intellect. He quickly learned that as long as he didn't get caught, stores were a great place to get free food. And he didn't get caught very often. So for awhile, he ate well.

Then one day, he did get caught. But not by a shopkeeper, a cop, or even an average citizen. By an old man who for some reason couldn't stop smiling. The man told John to call him "Father" and wouldn't say a word as he dragged the child, kicking and screaming, to a seedy Kingsgate apartment. Once there, he told John to sit down and shut up while he explained some things. He told John that there were winners in life, and there were losers. And sometimes the losers could be winners, but not by being losers.

For some reason, John trusted the man, the first person in his life he'd trusted. And in turn, Father taught him a great many things, about life and also the taking of it. John, who took his new name as Sly, learned that there were ways to kill a man without him even knowing you existed. And if he did know you existed, and was trying to kill you instead, there were other ways to make him not kill you. And more importantly, there were men that needed to be killed, men who deserved to die. But most important of all rules did Father teach Sly, and that was there were people who didn't deserve to die. People who deserved to be protected.

Sly learned well, just as he had learned well at things before this. Who knows what happened in the end. Maybe Sly learned too well, or maybe Father had spent too much time watching Sly's back to watch his own, but one day he came home and Father was simply sitting there, cross-legged on the floor with his arms folded, a clean bullet-hole in his head and holding the ace of spades. Having learned the most important lesson of all, Sly gathered up as much gear as he could, turned around and walked out.

He spent some time in the streets, making do off of what money he had taken from Father's house, but that didn't last long. Eventually, he happened to be wandering through an area controlled by one of the smaller local gangs when he got asked for toll. Laughing and joking with them, Sly coolly pickpocketed the local thugs and handed them their credsticks back. They were so impressed they invited him to come back with them and "hang out" (Will decide what gang later, I'm thinking either the 410 Crash or Side Street Rollers). After that, he just sort of fell in with the gang. They made sure he was well-fed and taken care of (albeit on soyfoods), and in turn he made sure their neighbors didn't get too cozy. He was sneaky, quiet, and could put the eye out on a sparrow a hundred yards away while breaking into a securely-locked house and taking the jewelery. Always a good addition to any gang.

On that fateful night, Sly did his best to help his new friends out, but he just couldn't do anything but watch in dispair as his comrades were mowed down one by one by a rival gang. At the last moment, he managed to slip out into the sewers with his gear and somehow miraculously avoided being gunned down or blown up. After having lived semi-comfortably for a time, there was no way Sly could go back to being a gutter-rat. Hearing that the Ravens were recruiting from members of the old gangs, Sly decided to head over there to see if they could use his services.

Whew, I'm going to sleep now. Everyone have a good night ^_^ I really like what I have here because the concept and character sheet I have so far comes across as a well-adjusted 310 point character instead of a toned-down 400 point character. I couldn't imagine taking this character and simply adding 90 bp, I wouldn't know what to do with it right away.

[Vegas]

Do you think an explosives skill would be justified given the fact that there are absolutely no explosives available within our starting availability? I'm working up a detailed history as I write this (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) And I think Sly would love Baby, in a Leon-Professional-esque manner. (I love that movie)

would that, in fact, then count as your single high-rating item? Or are they simply that readily available on the street, I.E. any ganger worth his salt at least has some scraped-from-the-bottom cyberware in order just to survive?

They're allowed regardless of availability so they DO NOT count towards your 1 Rating6/Avail. 12 item.

Nice start with Sly. I saw you applied for the wiki, let Silp, WR and I talk about the concept you've presented and if it's accepted we'll give you access to the wiki (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) At that point you can build up his sheet (which is sounds like you've got already) work on answering the 30 Background questions, do the takes for the characters and gangs and then you can submit him for first stage and then final review. Lots of hoops, but they're necessary and we've all jumped through them.

As for the demolitions/explosives skills... I'm personally somewhat on the fence on that one.. I mean if you can "justify" him knowing/learning it somehow in his background and you want to blow the points on it with a chance that it may not come into play much (or at all) in game depending on WR's thoughts on obtaining/making explosives.. go for it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Vegas]

Havok

Did you edit more of Sly's background after your original post, because I swear there's some stuff in there that I don't remember reading first thing this morning when I commented. (A lot of the Assassin/Father stuff).

A few things are sticking out to us after a bit of discussion between WR1 and I this afternoon. Namely, the character you've created is an assassin-in-training and not a ganger per se. You've emphasized his skills at killing people stealthily which is more shadowrunner "lite" than gang campaign (even with a 310 bp cap) and you've also talked about a character that is almost bordering on the "anti-PC" type (with his "untrustworthy to watch your back if you stole his simchip last week" type comments) which really doesn't have a place in this game, a vindictive streak against PC's (directly or indirectly) is just flat out not allowed . There is NO PvP violence in this game without very very very (did I say very?) heavy moderation involving the GM and PC's. If that's the basis of your character concept, I'm thinking he's not a good fit for this game. You've got a literal arsenal of weapons compared to the rest of the gang. PC's have maybe one gun, some have none. Having three as you've suggested he's got is a sense of "overkill" here in my eyes.

If we'd even let this concept fly, I can guarantee we are going to expect a lot more fleshing out of "Father" without question. I understand you really love the movie The Professional, but this character seems to be a rip of Mathilda towards the end of the movie. Not trying to stomp all over your character, but there's not the same "suspension of disbelief" in this game as there is in movies. We are going to expect a lot more info on Father's motivations and reasoning behind randomly "kidnapping" a street kid and teaching him everything he knows about professional assassination.

[Spike]

And here I was thinking 'Assassin' with Stallone...

What with Sly and El Diablo and so on...

[Slipshade]

And I think Sly would love Baby, in a Leon-Professional-esque manner. (I love that movie)

I love how everyone puts Baby as the one in need of protection or the sidekick role. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Havok

I have to admit, when I read your background I thought the same thing that WR1 and Vegas did. Not really a ganger and man this guy really loves The Professional.

I would say dop the guns back downa little. Remember, you will not have a lot of money in this game to buy ammo anyway and drop "Father". Make him a sneaky guy that learned so slit throats to survive not because he had a teacher, but learning from trial and error. I don't mind the trust issue so much myself as long as it is tempered quickly once he gets into the gang. If you are a mistrustful, paranoid, they wouldn't let you in the gang to begin with.

[Havok]

Lol the funny thing is I wasn't even thinking about The Professional when I was making this character. I was mostly just thinking that the gang could use someone good at BnE with some sniping ability (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) And on further thought, I gave him 1 point in explosives, "just in case" (I have a feeling this character is going to say that a lot for some reason) I think that improvised explosives could be interesting, like Molotov cocktails and whatnot, homebrew thermite and guncotton.

Ok so Father is out (I was thinking he was some sort of old-school shadowrunner with nothing to lose who wanted to "pass along" his wisdom before getting taken out. Hence the shadowrun-esque nature of the character.)

He really only has 3 guns, a pistol a shotgun and a sniper rifle. I can get rid of either the pistol or the shotgun if you like, or both. Probably the shotgun, even though he has a higher skill with the shotgun the pistol makes more sense to carry around. I'd like to keep the sniper rifle though.

I can get rid of all the nonlethal stuff and replace it with knives and/or ammo. I really like the idea of him using the nonlethal methods though on account of he's actually a decent fellow, and it is all rechargeable as long as you plug it in. And all definately less than availability six.

Vegas I'm not sure if I edited anything after I posted. The stuff about "Father" was in the post when I first put it up though. I did add the appearance, gear, and skillz sections after I posted the initial background, but that was at 2 am this morning.

And as far as the trustworthiness issue, as long as the gang doesn't stab him in the back (in his opinion, I know this wouldn't actually happen) he'll do whatever he can to support it. He absolutely refuses however to hurt children in any way (sorry, that's my own personal morals, I won't roleplay anything of that nature)

Ammo is going to be expensive, yes. But Sly doesn't plan on using his guns except as a last resort, in which case the price of ammo is going to be outweighed by the need for survival. He'd much rather use defensive measures and get himself and whoever's with him the hell out of there. Now that's not to say that he'd run at the first sign of trouble, just that he's smart enough to know that when surrounded by Spikes, dive for the nearest manhole. I'm thinking I should rework his history so he was in the Brickhouse Boys and came across with them, eliminating the trust issue and thus fostering the idea of "He may be a sneaky bastard that creeps you the frag out sometimes, but dammit he's YOUR sneaky bastard. And he just might have saved your life that one time at the quickie mart, but you're not sure, you couldn't see him."

Also, if he was in BBs, that would definately explain him picking up a talent for longarms. That place was perfect for sniper ambushes: tall buildings, easy access, high windows facing street level. And the rifle he has is acutally a hunting rifle I think. Its only availability 4R, which means any kid with a firearms permit could land one. It says in the book it's a sniper though. Hmm.

My main question is... how do you force a kid into a situation where he has to slit someone's throat to survive? And how do you get good enough, fast enough that you dont get killed yourself?

Edit: Got rid of pistols entirely, made him more survivalistic by raising dodge and disguise. He's mostly going to focus on using blades and longarms for combat, with a definate hit-and-run mentality. He's not sturdy enough to survive even a decent hit by a troll with a spear, and so there might be times where running away and surviving to make a counter-attack might be his only option =/ If I could keep both the shotgun and the sniper rifle, I think that might do a lot to increase his survivability by keeping people at a distance. I might have to get him a lined coat to hide the shotgun in.

Further Edit: I just realized that I'm asking for a lot with the sniper rifle, even though it all falls under the rules of the game, just for a ganger to have a sniper rifle means he's going to fawn all over it to the exclusion of all other guns. Which means I'm definately giving up the remington and the ares viper.

[Havok]

Somehow I completely forgot to post this. So here it is:

Sly, 2.0

[ Spoiler ]

Appearance: Standing at just over 1.4 meters tall, and weighing in at a little under 50 kg, Sly is a small, slender elf with typical elven charm (although any elf would tell you he was ugly). He normally wears dull, indistinguishable black clothing covered by a lined coat when he's not sporting his Chammy suit. Quiet, yes. Withdrawn, certainly. But when he speaks, its usually worth it to listen, because he doesn't waste his time.

Stuph!(Wow!)
To be determined. Definately a ruger 100 with an external smartgun system, as well as a chameleon suit.

Skillz: Obviously from the name, Sly has a fairly good handle on stealth skills, BnE skills, and running-away skills. He's also an excellent sniper\shotgunner and he knows a lot of debateably useful stuff. I mean, living in Kingsgate, who REALLY needs to ask someone where the local crooks hang out?

History:Some kids have it easy, with loving parents and a family that cares about them. Some kids have abusive families, with parents that beat the shit out of them. Given the choice, Sly would have taken the second option. See, Sly never knew his parents, they were gunned down when he was three. It was simply a matter of wrong place, wrong end of a shadowrunner's bullet hose.So they did what they do with all the SINless babies nobody wants: they stuck him in an orphanage.

Unfortunately, or perhaps you could say fortunately for him, Sly (dubbed John Abraham Steele) was small, and in an orphanage with over a hundred other children that meant he got the shit end of the stick. He grew up on little to no food, since there wasn't enough to go around and the others beat him up for his. It became apparent that he needed to become better at them.

By the age of five, John had become adjusted to the new life, and hated every minute of it. No warm, caring mother was there to hold him at night, and there was no father to teach him the ways of baseball, and riding of bikes. They didn't even have a TV. Somewhere out there, he just knew it, kids were having a great time without him. So he did what any normal kid would do when locked away for two years... he tried to escape. Except unbeknownst to him, the orphanage was collecting a nice little government grant check for him, and of course they couldn't just let their stipend walk out the door.

That day was the worst day of his life, and at the same time it changed him. Scolded, spanked, and sent to bed with no supper, John still managed to steal some food from one of the other kids. It was in that moment he decided that he could either be small and weak, or he could use his smallness to his advantage. Being small meant he could go places and do things the bigger kids couldn't do, and so he learned all he could about that.John waited, and he practised sneaking up on people, and one day, about 3 years later, his chance came. There was a big inspection lady coming down, she did it every year to "check on things".

John hated her, she asked all sorts of questions like how he was doing and then when he told her she just laughed and patted his head. At least she gave him a lolly. Anyways, this time was different, because he saw that they changed the bedsheets every time she came. John was smart, and earned his nickname by hiding in the bedsheets which were taken outside to a cleaning place. By the time they figured out he was missing, John was long gone.

The next phase of his life was by far rougher than the previous, but it was there he learned most of his life skills. The streets were a lot different than he thought, but John adapted better than most with his keen intellect. He quickly learned that as long as he didn't get caught, stores were a great place to get free food. And he didn't get caught very often. So for awhile, he ate well, even though he had to keep to the sewers to avoid being caught.

One day, as he was robbing a store, the shopkeeper did catch him, and blocked his way out. Without even thinking about anything except escaping, the young John panicked, and stabbed the man to death. Blood on his hands, blood on the ground, he could hear sirens in the distance; he ran. So far and so fast did he run, first going back into the sewers that pretended to be a home, and then further, further away. It seemed like he ran forever, until he finally collapsed, exhausted.

A killer had been born, for once you take a human life it is no longer sacred. He practised his art, perfecting it to a sense. He found that killing became easier the less people saw of you. During this time, he fell in with the Brickhouse Boys, and life became easier. With people to look out for you, you didn't have to always hide in the sewers, and with a place to run to you didn't have to just disappear. For the first time in his life, Sly had friends, comrades, people he could trust.

So he got really good at what he did. They liked cars, but he didn't really care for them. He could get them into almost anything though. He loved the thrill of climbing up the side of a building, gently cracking a window and easing himself through it, and taking the sweet, sweet valuables so carelessly displayed. And then one day he saw it, the most beautiful thing in his life. "It" being a fully-functional chameleon suit on display in a gun store in touristville. He'd just gone in to buy a new knife, but there it was, so lovely, calling his name.

He had to have it. So later that week, when the neighborhood was absolutely silent, he snuck back into the shop and went to work. When he was done, he came back to the BBHQ with an armload of guns, a shitty grin on his face, and wearing what is still today one of his most prized posessions, a Chameleon Suit. The suit was everything he'd ever hoped for, and allowed him to do things he'd never dreamed possible.

The next item he obtained was an old Ruger 100, one of the oldest, most worthless sniper rifles available, but it finally gave him what he'd been looking for: a way to kill without ever being seen. He can often be seen cradling his rifle, or polishing its various parts. He takes religious care of both items, often bringing them to the techie for a "checkup" as though they were living things and he was a doctor. All was good, he'd finally found someplace he belonged.

Of course, his luck just couldn't last. Trouble was brewing on the horizon, things he couldn't even begin to anticipate. Red October was almost upon them, and it would be merciless. On that fateful night, Sly did his best to help his new friends out, but he just couldn't do anything but watch in dispair as his comrades were mowed down one by one by rival gang members. At the last moment, he managed to slip out into the sewers with his gear and somehow miraculously avoided being gunned down or blown up.

When the firing stopped, he was one of the first out of the wreckage, searching for any trace of his former friends.

How's that?

[Dantic]

As for the demolitions/explosives skills... I'm personally somewhat on the fence on that one.. I mean if you can "justify" him knowing/learning it somehow in his background and you want to blow the points on it with a chance that it may not come into play much (or at all) in game depending on WR's thoughts on obtaining/making explosives.. go for it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I had actually given this a thought at one point, using Chemistry skill with a specialization in explosives, you'd use fertilizer to make the explosive, it's actually manageable with the restrictions of char building DITG. It may take a few hours, or days even to make the extended test, but should be do-able add demolition at a rating 1, specialized in improvised devices pack some pipe bombs, and if you're feeling really ballsy add throwing weapons skill, specialized in lobbed. add a dose of instability and you've got a whacked out ganger, hanging out the passenger window, slinging pipe bombs and molotov cocktails in a drive by from hell. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif)

[Havok]

Thats a crazy-cool concept, but its not this character hehe. I was thinking explosives more along the lines of rigging up the propane tank underneath the enemy quickie mart to explode while they're on a food run, or setting up an improvised mine to explode underneath one of their trucks. I was thinking about making a crazy chemical specialist that can whip up everything from drugs to BTLs to explosives, but decided that the chance of blowing up the new Ravens HQ was probably a BAD idea.

[Vegas]

Neuntoter, lkim, Bearclaw, Eyeless

Guys, here's the deal. I know life gets the best of all of us and time for gaming can be in short supply, but to light a fire under your butts you now have a deadline for getting your characters finalized for review on the wiki. You have until Sunday, April 13th at Midnight CST to get everything complete. If they're not complete by then, I can't promise when your characters will be reviewed and how much time we'll be able to devote to any further questions that arise. Please post here when you guys are good to go so that we can start the review process.

Everyone in this thread (minus those above and Havok)

Ok, in an attempt to help the remaining guys get their stuff in order and ready to go for review can we please refrain from "ganging up" on anyone posting questions unless it's Slip, WR1 or myself? Only because this thread has a tendency to move VERY fast and important things get lost in the abundance of posts. If you've got stuff that needs to be addressed for your characters please do so on the OOC thread and not here. You guys are all live players and while we appreciate the help you guys are offering here, we'd like to unclutter the thread a litte (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Thanks guys!

[Bearclaw]

OK, I've added a bunch, and I'll keep adding today. Whenever you're ready, Rico's ready.

[Slipshade]

Bearclaw - Great I will take a look on my lunch.

[Slipshade]

Bearclaw

I am ok with passing you on to WinterRat. I would still like you to work on some more of the 30 questions, but you have noted that you are currently doing so. Make sure you finish them up. I like the extra information you have added. I can see more of Rico's character coming through which is what we want.

WR1

He's all yours!

[Havok]

Heya, just checking in (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Are there any improvements I can see that need to be made in my concept? Also, I wanted to leave an encouraging note for the DMs. I'll admit when I first posted on this forum I was just looking for a down-and-dirty pbp shadowrun game, without any hope for more. However seeing the amount of effort WR-1, Vegas, and everyone else has put into this game is amazing. I have actually run PBP games before, and I've DMed tabletop shadowrun, and I can say with certainty that in my 5 years of gaming\dming shadowrun I've NEVER seen this level of polish and detail before. This isn't just a game, this is a story being told by multiple points of view. The events that are going to take place in this game could easily make the next shadowrun novel by themselves. So, mad props to WR-1 for putting the whole thing together. If you wanted to make a game of truly epic proportions, you've succeeded. This is so much more than the characters involved, and its more than the dms too. I really am lucky to have gotten a chance to be a part of something this intense and realistic. Let me tell you, I've never felt more in touch with a character, and I haven't even finished making him yet! But I'm already having to put myself in his brain just to hope to have some possibility of doing WR-1's storytelling justice.

In summation, after reading my eyes off for the last 3 days, I have to say you guys have succeeded beyond my wildest expectations. (The eyes!!! They're meltinnggg...) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif) I'm glad to be in some way a part of this, and even if I'm not accepted I look forward to reading some awesome roleplaying and storytelling.

[Slipshade]

Havok

Thanks. It is very much appreciated by everyone involved in the game.

As for your character, we (WR1, Vegas and I) have some serious concerns.

1. Sly is still way too much of an assassin. His personality is borderline psychotic from what we can see. Even Legion isn’t a cold blooded killer. Other than Red October, most of the gang violence doesn’t necessarily involve killing. Sure rumbles occur, but mostly they are with fists, sticks and blades. Someone who can kill without remorse is actually a danger to small time gangs in my opinion, let along someone willing to blown up other gangs if they are slighted.

Personality has to change. When I first read Sly, I thought “Cool. A sneaky street kid, who was so down in the dumps that he had to learn to survive by ambushing other gutter trash for food and such.� Then he turned into something very different than what I expected and what the other GM’s expected.

2. No demolitions more than a Malatov at this point.

3. Stay focused on the small time gang aspect of this game. Anything that remotely smacks of Shadowrunner, or a professional at any type of crime is gonna be a no. We are all amateurs or not even that.

Do you think Sly can be modified to fit these guidelines and still be enjoyable for you to play?

Vegas and WR1 - Anything else to add?

P.S. Yes I know Grack is different, but he is faggin’ insane!

[WinterRat1]

I just want to clarify no one is saying he can't be a sneaky fighter. We're not saying you have to make a straight-up fighter.

The issue is the attitude/mentality, which is nearly amoral with respects to killing. Even the most hardcore characters in Kingsgate aren't amoral. They might be jaded and cynical, but they haven't reached a point in which all life is completely irrelvant to them.

I just don't see one knifing and accidental killing as being sufficient to suddenly transform someone into a stone cold killer.

Additionally, it really hurts your ability to bond with your fellow gangers. Who wants to trust someone who could knife them in the back without blinking an eye? We the players know that's not going to be allowed, but the characters themselves don't know that and would react accordingly.

I really liked your 'sneaky B&E' original idea; if you want to expand that to say he fights sneaky too I have no problems with it, but the nonchalant icy killer thing has to go.

Does that make sense? The key issue is not mechanics or tactics, it's personality and mental attitude. Beyond that change, I think the rest of the concept is pretty solid.

[Havok]

Maybe I'm going at this the wrong way, and instead of providing you with a laid-out concept I'm trying to write a history explaining the concept in my head.

My idea for Sly is not of some uber-professional, sniping people down and racking up confirmed kills (I even bought gel rounds for the sniper rifle lmao) My idea was of a kid just trying to stay under the radar because that's where he's safe, being forced into situations where he had to kill just to survive - wanting to survive so he got good at it, and finally finding a "family" who will not only take him as he is, they'll actually see him as useful. And then he has to watch that family get wiped out (Red October). He'd be happy if he could just chill with the October Ravens and steal stuff for them\help them get into places, that's what he's really good at. But if he has to, he's got the skills to put the hurt on anyone trying to mess with his family.

Completely ignoring the histories I've posted for him, does the concept itself make sense?

I've just been trying to figure out ways to make him not have to run away every time a fight breaks out, I guess it came off sounding a little too coldly professional. Because I also understand that if you dont have your homies' backs, its not the other gangs you have to worry about.

--Edit--

I decided that it might be a good idea if I put a list of preliminary skills up for you, so here it is (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[ Spoiler ]

Skillgroup: Athletics 1
Escape artist : 1
Inflitration : 3
Shadowing : 4
Palming (Shoplifting) : 1
Disguise (Camouflage) : 1
Dodge : 3
Longarms : 3
Locksmith : 3
Hardware (Maglocks) : 1
Blades : 3
Perception : 3