Home much ammo do you carry on a run? Options

[Kyoto Kid]

...letsee, of the character's I am currently playing...

the Short One:

Casual meets: 2 concealed Taurus 6s with S&S, 2 Ceramic knives in boot sheaths, & her Fists (Critical Strike 3/Killing Hands/Elemental Effect Electricity).

Questionable meets the same, 2 preloaded Speedloaders (S&S), 2 Ceramic knives, & Her Fists

On the job: "Butch" & "Sundance" (her Warhawks) loaded with EXEX, 2 Taurus 6s as backup (also with loaded HP caliber EXEX), 4 preloaded speedloaders, Wakasashi, Her WF Katana, and her Fists.

all weapons are licensed (save for the EXEX of course)

For Violet:

Casual meets: Smartlinked Hammerli 650 with 1 extra clip S&S, Shock Hand implant.

Questionable meets/On the job: Smartlinked Hammerli 650 with 2 extra clips S&S (been used once), Yamaha Fubuki with EXEX (never yet been used), Shock Hand implant.

KarmaInferno: Nah, as long as you can carry it, you never can have too much Ammo. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

I'm of the school of thought that you can never have too much duct tape...

QFT.

[Siege]

Anyone who doesn't carry a gun and has never needed one, more power to you. I hope you never do. But you really don't have the right to critisize someone who does and choses to carry 29 rounds (which is only 3 mages).

Wow, I had this really disturbing visual with a troll and some seriously oversized pockets...

"Ah got two mages, one for each of ya."

Duct-tape a dwarf mage's arms and legs together and he'd just about fit...(IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

-Siege

P.S. - Is that a dwarf in your pocket, or are you just glad to see me?

P.S.S. - I can't stop giggling. I swear I'm sober.

[Shrike30]

IRL carry for me is a Glock 23 with two spare magazines: 13+1, with 2x13 on the other hip serving to counterbalance the 3-odd pounds of gun and ammo, for a total of 40 rounds of Speer Gold Dot (a hollowpoint design that, theoretically, folds inwards to act like an FMJ when it hits glass or sheet metal). Not exactly hard to carry. I've considered a second firearm, but decided that I'm happy with a folding knife as a backup... the Glock hasn't ever had a failure despite thousands of rounds going through it, and most of the scenarios that I can imagine where I lose it are at a range where a knife is a good choice.

Daily carry in Shadowrun tends to follow this pattern: Sidearm + 2 spares loaded with your ammunition of choice (usually Regular/APDS, or Explosive/Flechette/Frangible/Hollowpoint, depeding on the character and his concerns about overpenetration). Going to work might see some utility changes in this: the possible addition of a suppressor, and two more magazines of ammunition loaded with a secondary ammo type (be it Gel, SnS, or Regular/APDS if the first three mags are loaded with something that doesn't go through barriers well).

In situations where a longer weapon is doable, the AR/SMG will usually have anywhere from 6-10 spare magazines strapped onto the character's armor. Some of the smaller SMGs are concealable enough (in my mind) that you could try carrying them under a jacket... 4 spare magazines under the other arm are the order of the day here.

There's also the weirdies: sniper rifle and SMG combo will see a low mag count for each but a total mag count of significant proportions. Underbarrel weapons (lasers, shotguns, grenade launchers, whatever) will have a number of spare rounds or a few spare mags kept about. "Magazine" fed weapons (pump shotgun, hunting rifle, etc) will have spare rounds kept somewhere... I've seen box dispensers that'll hold 25 shotshells and take up about as much space as a 3-AR-mag holder, some slings and buttstocks can hold shells, there's bandoliers, and the ever classic "dump the box of shotshells into your coat pocket..."

And yeah, sometimes you get characters with odd tastes in weaponry. One of mine carries a pair of TMPs on his thighs when he's going places he's not likely to get asked questions, and his backpack (one of those nifty hard-frame, high-mounted jobs) has a rotary magazine holder built into the base of it that holds 8 magazines on each side. A half-dozen grenades on the pack, SMG with taped pair of mags, 8 spare SMG mags taped in pairs strapped to his chest, and a Redline running off a hip pack strapped in the small of the back with its holster attached to the battery. Weight when you're heavily cybered is less of an issue, and extensive use of autofire and suppressive fire means those magazines can get used up very, very quickly.

[Frosty Medic]

My current character doesn't carry very much ammunition. His primary weapon is a Colt Manhunter loaded with standard rounds, and a back-up magazine of gel rounds. His back-up weapon is a snubnose .38, no extra ammo. For anything really serious, he has an HK 227, though he hasn't had a chance to use that yet. Last line of defense is a survival knife.

The reason he doesn't carry too much ammo is because he is the team's medic, and most often isn't up in the thick of combat. Instead, he's lugging around the medical kit and any other gear the team may need.

[Clyde]

Pistol and two spare mags always.
On the run add in a long gun with two spare mags, although these may be mixed types. On rare occasions, there'll be two long guns (suppressed SMG and assault rifle, for example).

Only really worried about ammunition load once, but my character is an adept with Killing Hands, so it's not like I can't get more. I figure that by the time I run out there'll be someone else's gun lying around . . . .

[Ed_209a]

I have my characters balance two sayings:

"Too much ammo is _much_ less fatal than too little"

and

"Don't carry a weapon that will get you into more trouble than it will get you out of."

My Sams usually go with a primary weapon with 6-8 mags, and a sidearm with 2-3 mags. On particularly low-profile runs, I might cut both mag counts in half.

The primary is a AR/SMG/Machine Pistol depending on how low profile I need to be. The sidearm is a heavy pistol when I can get away with it. Light otherwise.

Add holdouts & less-lethals to flavor, and my char is ready to roll.

[Lionhearted]

you need three bags.. one for the nastier guns and melee weapons, two for the ammunition.. and you will still not have enough read my sig (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[kigmatzomat]

Hmmm, I base my quantities on time, not ammo per se.

On urban in-and-out runs I want to be able to maintain at least one full minute of sustained fire from my primary weapon. IMO if I'm firing for 60 seconds, thats at least 50 seconds too long but I'd rather be 50 seconds too long than 3 seconds too late. That's only 40 rounds for a pistol but 200 for full automatic. After that I pack one or two additional weapons that serve an alternate role, with at least one weapon carrying non-lethal rounds. That usually ensures I've got 2-3 minutes of total fire time.

Where there's the distinct possibility of a running battle, I triple the fire time, usually by selecting an alternate weapon appropriate to the character and fight and carrying more ammo for that. If possible, I try to stash spares in a vehicle or at various rallying points.

Out of town (either away from my contact net or in the bush) I go for as much as is feasible to bring along.

The day-to-day weapon is generally a pistol with 1 or 2 spare mags (depending on overall concealability), one of which is non-lethal (depending the character that might be the one in the weapon). That gun is intended to provide just enough fire-time to get me to my vehicle, where there's more ammo, usually a heavier weapon (or three), and the ability to move faster than at a run.

[Siege]

This thread prompted another idle question - how many people actually pack "Light" pistols? And do you find them even remotely effective in the day-to-day lives of Runners?

-Siege

[Drogos]

I usually carry 4 extra clips for my primary weapon, 2-4 loads for my secondary and if I pack a third just a spare clip for that. I am usually very lethal, so the third weapon only often comes into plays if I need a LTL alternative for some specific reason.

As for light pistols, they are often secondary or tertiary weapons for my characters, but usually loaded with Flechette (or used to) or EXEX. Basically something that makes them more like Heavy Pistols but have the better concealability. Pretty much all of my characters who have the pistols skill will own one for day to day (as in completely non-Runner) life. They are easily concealed and ubiquitous. Makes for an easier time to hit the stuffer shack than your combat shotgun.

[Wounded Ronin]

This thread prompted another idle question - how many people actually pack "Light" pistols? And do you find them even remotely effective in the day-to-day lives of Runners?

-Siege

In SR3 I just used them to define the NPCs who were wannabe pretender types, like clueless corp execs who thought they were bad because they carried a light pistol. Comic relief really.

[Whipstitch]

KK and I think alike in regards to light pistols. Prior to the release of Arsenal, the Hammerli 420s loaded with stick and shock was a great sidearm for characters primarily intended as non-combatants like a dedicated Face or Hacker/Rigger. It's a light pistol so it's easy to conceal but it uses the heavy pistol range table. It also comes with an internal smartlink and enough integral recoil compensation to offset the penalty attached to your second shot in a pass. This made it perfect for characters with crappy dicepools who really only wanted the thing in case they had to put down Joe Mall Cop or a particularly inept ganger. It's only real fault was the tiny magazine. Now that we have Arsenal though I'd probably take stick and shock loaded SA holdout instead, or perhaps some other light pistol with a larger ammo capacity, since getting a custom grip for your piece is very reasonably priced, which makes the recoil compensation less of a selling point.

[kigmatzomat]

This thread prompted another idle question - how many people actually pack "Light" pistols? And do you find them even remotely effective in the day-to-day lives of Runners?

The Fichetti 300 tends to be my characters' "daily wear" pistol for a couple reasons. Being a light pistol it doesn't get the same reaction the heavies do from bouncers and the like (in our games light pistols and non-lethal ammo results in a less rigorous SIN/license check by 'Star). Loaded with stick'n shock it's pretty effective, if short ranged and expensive. Gel doesn't suck, at least, even if the errata took away it's boost. And you can't discount the massive (30 round) magazine for those unanticipated running firefights.

Unless I'm planning on tasering a lot of people, it's never the primary sidearm on a combat run.

[Shrike30]

I've got one character whose daily carry is a Colt America (yay, slimline light pistols!) and who upgrades to a pair of Fichettis for runs. 60 rounds between reloads and a "Light Pistols" spec helps. He's also got an Elan for those dressy occasions.

Compared to SR3, the Light Pistols are actually viable in SR4, although they still don't do the best against body armor. I can select them for flavor reasons and not feel totally screwed. IMO, the heavies are a little overpowered, as opposed to the Lights not being worthwhile.

[CircuitBoyBlue]

I've seen a lot of people mention that they don't want to carry around weapons on a run that call too much attention to themselves. But that cuts both ways. When my characters are on a run, and they see a group of guys with ARs and SMGs, and then one dude with a light pistol, they usually think "mage!" And you ALWAYS geek the mage first. I think I read that in Emily Post.

[Kyoto Kid]

...even with the larger selection from Arsenal, Vi still prefers the range of the Hammerli. At least it uses a clip and not a cylinder which with a Smartlink is a much faster reload. Also, as mentioned, for more dangerous situations she has her Fubuki with EXEX which though it is listed as an LP, is kind of is in a class by itself in that is really would not as concealable as other LPs (for that I'd put it in the HP or Machine Pistol category).

Though de-powered a bit, Gel rounds still have the one advantage of knocking opponents down easier. In some situations (like on a pier or ledge), that can have an added effect. Narrow Burst DV modifiers also apply to Gel rounds whereas it is debatable whether S&S can gain this benefit (but let's not derail this thread on the topic of whether S&S DV can be staged up or not (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif) )

[Earlydawn]

Haven't done a serious run that I knew was going to turn into combat yet, but I can't see myself carrying more then two or three mags of SMG ammo. Shadowrun is a stealth game. Fights are either going to start so stealthily that they're over in two bullets, or last so long that it'd be better saving your ammo and looking for a way out.

[Whipstitch]

Like I said, it's all about having the right tool for the right job with me. I prefer to roll with a mag of stick and shock and a mag of APDS or else I just let other people handle it. I'm usually the mage though, so letting others handle it is my preferred option 90% of the time. I don't whip out the mojo unless it's something like a couple high powered Spirits attacking us, in which case I roll out an Edge fueled Mana Static as a welcoming mat so the Samurai can more properly introduce them to the wonders of the Ares Alpha. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Cthulhudreams]

I had a street sammie that regularly used that squeezebox pistol that was immune to MAD detection. Afantastic gun for all occasions being in that no-one knows you have it.

[Whipstitch]

heh, I hope you don't mean the Raecor sting since it's expressly limited to flechettes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Of course, now you can just use the Elan to do it, except it's undetectable and semiautomatic. I plan on having one that's chameleon coated on my next character. Power creep ftw!

[Siege]

Nah, I just use thought Elan was a better performer, overall. [/oots humor]

-Siege

[Critias]

This thread prompted another idle question - how many people actually pack "Light" pistols? And do you find them even remotely effective in the day-to-day lives of Runners?

-Siege

Almost all of my gunbunny characters owned them. But I don't think anyone every actually, y'know, used one. Or carried it anywhere. Or told his friends he had them. It was more of a "sense of completion" thing, owning enough guns to call it a "collection." If I wasn't using a full-sized Heavy Pistol (or larger), it was because nothing but a Hold Out would be small enough to get the job done.

At one point, my long-running street sam was threatened (from inside a car) by someone with a light pistol. He elbowed the glass into a zillion pieces, hauled the guy out of the car with one hand, smacked his head on the pavement to knock him out, and then snickered about his "woman's gun" before kicking it towards a sewer drain.

6L. Pfft.

[Shrike30]

I've heard people say, more than once, that they'd be better off spending their time looking for an exit than returning fire, so they don't bother with more than a couple of magazines of ammo even when they're carrying a bigass gun.

I'm pretty good at looking for an exit while providing suppressive fire, and most magazines don't let you get more than 1-2 IP's worth of suppressive in before they run out. Looking for an exit is all well and good, but unless you've got a reason along the lines of "I can't hide any more on my body without it being obvious," only bringing a couple of magazines to a situation where you might have to keep a few heads down while the hacker spends multiple turns getting a door open, getting a car hacked for your escape, or whatever is pretty short-sighted, IMO. Waiting 15 seconds for an elevator has never felt so long...

Guy I used to play with once said "Don't bother with the rifle... if we have to go loud, we're fucked," and proceeded to bring a pair of suppressed Predator 3's and nothing else into a run. 30 rounds should've lasted him through the run easily, right? A few hours later, partway through my sixth Steyr magazine, he managed to drag his bullet-riddled ass out of the hallway I was suppressing so that the guards that'd nailed him didn't get in any more shots, and we shut the door. It's possible to run through a LOT of ammunition in a VERY short time in Shadowrun, and to do so while still making good time towards an exit. Even without going suppressive, if you're a big user of burst fire or full auto and have a few passes, one mag will last you 3-5 seconds, tops. Your PLAN may be going out the window if you end up having to fire off a bunch of rounds... but there's no reason to handicap yourself in the major firefight that ensues by not having enough rounds to effectively contribute.

[CanRay]

Well, I don't play, and working on GMing a campaign soon. But I do write!

I have two main characters so far:

Jon "Money" Johnson, a Street Johnson who gets dirty at times. Sometimes very dirty. His usual carry piece is a modified Browning Ultrapower with Smartgun Link in .45 ACCP, and three spare magazines (NOT Clips!) which he carries at all times, being a good little SINner and having a legal Concealed Carry Permit (CCP). So that's a combat load of 10+1 rounds, with 30 in reserve. All rounds are Steel-Jacketed Ball rounds. (He used to carry a classic Glock 86C, but had to drop it in the ocean a few years ago.).

When he's hitting the street, he puts on his armoured duster that contains concealed pockets that allow for quite a number of switchblades and straight razors (He's lost count).

In his heavily modified Jackrabbit, he has a pair of .45 ACCP Colt Cobra TZ118 SMGs in Door Holsters, with ten magazines each secreated around the car when expecting trouble (Three each when not), one mag of Gel, the rest Steel-Jacketed Ball, including the loaded magazines. Concealed in the trunk is a broken down, customized 7 mm Russian Caseless AK-97, with provision for a Drum Magazine, and a 100-round drum of the finest Winchester Steel-Jacketed Ball Rounds.

For the other character, Nas the Elven Wheelman, his usual carry piece is a S&W Model 650 (Same stats as the Ruger Super Warhawk) with an shortened barrel (Barrel Reduction), and carries 30-rounds of .500 S&W (Two Speedloaders, rest loose in a zippered pocket.) as an "Around Town" gun, with the ammunition being whatever is on special.

When expecting trouble, a pair of .380 AutoCaseless Ceska Black Skorpions with the folding stocks removed, and gas porting installed, and as many magazines as he can cram onto his person or vehicle.

Nas did have some nice weapons built into his Mitsuhama Tengu, but... Well...

You'll have to read to find out what happened to that.

And I think I have just proven that I have put entirely too much thought into this!

Oh, and as for the RL carry, I live in Canada and have been diagnosed with Depression. I'll likely never be able to even legally hold a firearm in my life now. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[O'Donnell Heir]

I usually carry an Ares Predator on my mage, again, never fired a single shot. More recently I have a few extra concealable holsters to carry the guns I "borrow" from the enemy.