Pimp my Gunbunny, In the spirit of Cyntax! Options

[DreadPirateKitte...]

http://fallen-from-grace.wikispaces.com/Street_Sam

A couple of quick words about a few of the design decisions:

We're corporate types, so etiquette: corporate and SINner are mandatory. Records on File would be cool too, but Bad Luck and Amnesia were in first, and the GM already has stuff done for the amnesia.

The Barrett sniper rifle is totally not worth 5 bp for restricted gear. I know. But, I'm keeping it, cuz I likes it!

For the rest, especially skills, lets hear it!

[ElFenrir]

Hmm, doesn't look too bad over all. With the skills...you have both Blades and Unarmed(cyber-implants) for this. Now, you could save some points here; since it seems Blades are your deal(at 4(+2)) and you only have a shock-hand for unarmed/cyber-implants, you COULD lower your Unarmed skill to 1(+2). Honestly, with a 9 Agility, 12 dice to shock someone is plenty if you are disarmed from your blades, and since you have a Barret Model and a lot of firearms(max Skill Group you can get at the start), I'm guessing you use guns a lot, too. (since the unarmed seems like a more or less last-ditch thing or a subdual method, judging from the shockhand and the high scores in guns and blades.)

Lowering unarmed to 1(+2) [hell, you DEFAULT at 8 dice and you could still do that] would free up 8 BPs for, say, a better Etiquette skill or some Negotations so you aren't caught flat if the face isn't around(or perhaps a Con skill). Again, even if you took out Unarmed it wouldn't be a big loss, you still have plenty of dice for guns and blades, and if for some reason you need to do the shocky-shock, rolling 8 dice is still really good. (Our table doesn't play with Availability limits, so we've had some pretty nice attributes before. I've found defaulting at a 9 agility usually works.) But leaving it at 1(+2) and getting some Con might help, just my 2 nuyen.

[DreadPirateKitte...]

I floated better etiquette/con with the GM earlier, but he basically told me not to steal the face's thunder, I had etiquette at 4 originally.

As to your other points, it *is* primarily a subdual method, but, Gunbunny aims primarily for non lethal combat, too, so she wont use blades/ex-ex bullets unless all other options have gone to heck, so I see her starting with the shockhand and gel bullets. If something gets lethal or crazy, expect the full auto smg, or crazy blade skills to come out, though!

Oh, also, its 9 agility +3 agility for the cyberlimb(the hand is part of the limb, of course) for 12 agility + 3(+2). So yes, even more DP inflation!

[Mäx]

Oh, also, its 9 agility +3 agility for the cyberlimb(the hand is part of the limb, of course) for 12 agility + 3(+2). So yes, even more DP inflation!

That's not how it works, the cyber arm has a base stats of 3 so +3 to agility makes it an agility 6

[DreadPirateKitte...]

Thats incorrect. The Cyberarm has base stats of: Body 4, Str 4, Agility 9, and is modified for +3 agi,+1 str, +2 armor, Gyromount, Shock hand.

Total Cyberlimb Values: Body 4, Str 5, Agility 12, Armor +2/+2.

You'll find the rules for Customized Cyberlimbs in Augmentation, pg. 44.

[Mäx]

Thats incorrect. The Cyberarm has base stats of: Body 4, Str 4, Agility 9, and is modified for +3 agi,+1 str, +2 armor, Gyromount, Shock hand.

Total Cyberlimb Values: Body 4, Str 5, Agility 12, Armor +2/+2.

You'll find the rules for Customized Cyberlimbs in Augmentation, pg. 44.

I now the rules, you should list the customisations so the are now missunderstandings. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
As a human you can't have an agility higher than 9, cyberlimbs still have to adhere to augmented maximums.

[DreadPirateKitte...]

See, this is why I started the thread. Can't go over augmented maximum. What was I thinking!

[Fritzs]

Mäx: I think you can enhance cyberlimb beond it's maximum with cyberlimb enhancements (which aren't customization), so it's possible for human character to begin game with cyberlimb with agi 12...

[ElFenrir]

Unless, of course, you A. get the bonuses with the Genetic Optimization(+1 agl), and Exc. Attribute: Agility(+1 agl), in which case, you can have an 8(12) Agility.

Now, at our table, we houseruled away a lot of the hard caps(of course, going beyond the regular caps costs a lot of Karma, so no one really does it anyway unless they have a killer idea that utilizes it), but it does allow one to go beyond the maximums with cyberware.(I know it's pretty powerful, but honestly, it's very rare that someone actually *Does* this because of the amount of points that have to go into the stat in the first place to get there. I think I've seen a small handful of characters with stats that went beyond the book-max modified. It's just the option is there just incase you want to play a Human Super Body Man or The Super Reaction Dwarf something, as we like to open up as many concepts as possible at our table. So yeah, if a player of a Dwarf wants to hard-max Reaction to a 5 and then get a Superthyroid and 3 Enhancers for a 9, they're more than welcome to. We are strong believers in ''don't tell us we can't, say we can but just make it difficult if necessary.'')

However, I digress...the RAW are not like that, and if that's what your GM follows...yeah, a human can't go above 9.

[BullZeye]

Ok, few rules nitpicks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

*Recoil compensation from an auto-adjusting weight, bipod,
foregrip, gyromount, sling, tripod, or underbarrel weight are
not cumulative with each other (except that the compensation
from a foregrip and sling can be combined into an overall
recoil compensation of 2).

*Gas-vent systems can be built into machine pistols, SMGs,
assault rifles, and machine guns

*Armors don't have 12 slots if they got 6 armor.

*One can't have more attribute on a cyberlimb than the augmented max of the metatype. Redlining the cyberlimb is possible to get it beyond that point...

*Martial arts maneuvers cost 2bp each

And then character-wise question: How does amnesia affect the character, other than bringing 10bp more?

[Heath Robinson]

Thats incorrect. The Cyberarm has base stats of: Body 4, Str 4, Agility 9, and is modified for +3 agi,+1 str, +2 armor, Gyromount, Shock hand.

Total Cyberlimb Values: Body 4, Str 5, Agility 12, Armor +2/+2.

You'll find the rules for Customized Cyberlimbs in Augmentation, pg. 44.

Each customized cyberlimb may have a starting Body, Strength, and Agility attribute of up to the character’s natural attribute maximum

Emphasis mine. Are there any houserules in effect to countermand this?

[DreadPirateKitte...]

Ok, few rules nitpicks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

*Recoil compensation from an auto-adjusting weight, bipod,
foregrip, gyromount, sling, tripod, or underbarrel weight are
not cumulative with each other (except that the compensation
from a foregrip and sling can be combined into an overall
recoil compensation of 2).

Eep! And to think, I had this section open when I first started modding the guns.

*Armors don't have 12 slots if they got 6 armor.

Fixed.

*Gas-vent systems can be built into machine pistols, SMGs,
assault rifles, and machine guns

Fixed.

*Martial arts maneuvers cost 2bp each

The point cost of the martial maneuvers is listed under costs. I paid 2 bp for each, I think you'll find.

And then character-wise question: How does amnesia affect the character, other than bringing 10bp more?

The game starts with us as Corporate types, I'm a corporate lead security detail type, like NSA bodyguard, or whatever. When things go bad, and we Fall From Grace, the idea is that I get clonked over the head, or whatnot, and lose my memory. Least, thats where I think the GM is going with it.

If I wanted an easy points grab, I'd go with Records on File, since...you know, my Records ARE on file, and whatnot. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

*One can't have more attribute on a cyberlimb than the augmented max of the metatype. Redlining the cyberlimb is possible to get it beyond that point...

Yeah. Cyberlimb needs fixin'

[DreadPirateKitte...]

Emphasis mine. Are there any houserules in effect to countermand this?

None that I know of, but I clearly need to make big changes with the cyberarm, since its a waste of money! =)

[Dash Panther]

"Don't steal the face's thunder?"

Lame. Does the face have any combat skills at four? If so, the Face shouldn't be stealing the Street Sam's thunder. If not (and for the same reason), that's still lame.

One character does not do all the combat. One face shouldn't do all the social stuff. Look at Ocean's 11-13. HUGE shadowrunner team, all with some social skills (even the Chinese greaseman pretended to be a high-roller).

Is the face male? Sometimes a female face will do better even if she's not as skilled (ie seduction). See if you can get Influence 1. You wouldn't be stealing the face's thunder. You would be another option, or a smaller role in the face's mastermind frame job. Then bumped up etiquette along with maybe leadership ("yes, ma'am, lieutenant colonel, ma'am"). Intimidation 1 would be nice too with all your scariness.

With your skills and Influence 1, you could sneak into a facility (infiltration, perception, security procedures as a complementary skill if you use those rules), convincingly dress and talk like a guard (disguise, etiquette, con, security procedures as a complementary skill), follow the guard with the info/item you need (shadow), obtain it (non-lethal combat, palming) and get out (infiltrate).

I think skills make a more fun character than gear. I'd trade the Barrett for a Walther and Influence 1. Maybe also Armorer 1 (take a bit of care with your guns, etc. and the team's) and/or Demolitions 1.

Overall, I like the character, but it seems like it's getting pigeonholed into the face's bodyguard instead of something infinitely cooler, like the face's assistant.

If you really want to learn about security, check out SOTA:2063, which has a great chapter on security, "Keeping the rabble out." There's are good chapters on mercenaries and culture also.

[ElFenrir]

To be honest, I had seemingly missed that part about the Face's thunder. Now that I think about it, that is mighty lame to force-pigeonhole your players. I learned LONG ago it was best for everyone to have a smattering of skills. A sam with a few social skills and a 3-4 charisma throwing 4-7 dice for 2-3 social skills is NOT stealing the face's thunder, it's HELPING, and realistic that they would have these skills.

Yeah, I'd talk to your GM about the whole pigeonholing bit. A team of runners who are only good at ONE thing each doesn't last very long.

[DreadPirateKitte...]

The face is female, and in fact has no pistols skill at all, unless chipped(She does have R5 skillwires, and a pistol R4 skillchip) so, I guess she's not stepping on combat toes either, unless chipped.

I kinda like the idea of a character that can do the whole shadowrun themself, too, but I dont mind needing help here and there from my teammates, either.

[ElFenrir]

Well, there is a difference between being able to do a whole run alone, and just having a smattering of other skills to help. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) A Cha 4, Influence Group 2 character is not out-facing any faces anytime soon, BUT they can at least A. throw down teamwork dice with the Face, and B. If worse comes to worse, are able to at least TRY to talk their way out of something without saying something aboiut dead whales, grandmothers, and combat boots. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[DreadPirateKitte...]

Well, do note my charisma isnt 4 =P

If I drop etiquette from 2: Corp to Influence 1, then I get 4 dice on all influence skills, which is pretty poor, I've seen a Sam with 4 social dice try to do social, and it generally got the team in deep trouble.

[ElFenrir]

Oh, Charisma: 3 and Etiquette: 2(+2) is pretty decent...5-7 dice is a good backup. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I wasn't necessarily saying you need a crapload of skills, i was just more or less saying that someone that threw 6 dice in all social skills wasn't walking on a Face.

Otherwise, though, with the critique, the character is looking quite good. And I agree about the Barret Model, btw. That gun IS freaking sweet. Hell, with a 9 Agility, a Barret Model and a good skill in the gun, you can probably find your way as Team Sniper in a tick.

EDIT: Btw, did you draw that character, or is it a character from somewhere that gives a ''good idea'' of what they look like?

[DreadPirateKitte...]

*grin* She was a sniper in the military!

Its actually one of the wallpapers from Starcraft: Ghost. I agree, its gorgeous! I have no artistic talent, but a lot of skill at google image searching =)

[Squinky]

Looks like everything is covered. The only advice I would give is mostly a personal opinion.

I would either go fullbore on cyber-limbs, or go full out on non cyber-limb benefits like the muscle toner and augmentation. Seems like having both is a waste of resources and essence. You can do some amazing stuff with a human in 4 customized cyber-limbs, but it kinda precludes subtleness (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[ElFenrir]

Cost-wise it can be prohibitive, as well. Personally I think it's cool to have a limb here and there for character purposes. but 4 custom limbs are...20k each MINIMUM, with no adjustments, I believe. MT4/MA2 is a mere 46k for the whole deal. I DO know what ya mean though, Squink, cyberlimbs ARE fun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

That, and going 4 limbs would need a LOT of retooling nealry from the ground up. First, Wired Reflexes would have to be toned down to 1, unless all 4 limbs would be Alphaware...AND the Reflexes Alphaware, which comes to a sweet 40k per limb and 64k for Wired 2, with little room for anything else(total essence cost: 2.4+3.2=5.6.) Nuyen wise, you'd have already 224,000 spent and the limbs haven't even had ANYTHING added to them yet. (a 9 Agility, 5 Strength would be more money, and Now, 2 cyberarms would be doable, but yeah...the subtlety thing goes out the window. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif) )

For a skilled sniper, I do think you have the important things(gun skill, Agility, Stealth).

[DreadPirateKitte...]

I was under some wacky impression that cyberlimb agility could go over augmented max. No idea why. Now that I have looked at it, I realize I'm a fool, so this:

Customized Left Cyberarm, Chromed | 12 1.0 | 35,600Â¥ +3 agi,+1 str, +2 armor, gyromount, Shock hand

* Radar Sensor 4 | Std. | 12 - - | 12,000Â¥ Sees through up to 4 rating 5 walls!

Is currently up for replacement. Not sure what I am gonna replace it with, maybe muscle aug 4 and 30,000Â¥ of stuff? maybe I'll claw back some bp and buy another rank of skills.

[ElFenrir]

Honestly, Musc Aug 4 is another +5 BP positive quality much better spent on something else, to be honest. (You'd need another Restricted Gear quality for that, as it's separate from Muscle Toner.)

I would say ditch the arm, take the nuyen. Your whole body would be Agility 9, which is awesome.

Get some more nice stuff with the nuyen(fake IDs, and the like). Perhaps a point of Negotation, or Con, or even more Stealth is always good, too. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[DreadPirateKitte...]

I already have 2 fake SIN's and a buncha licenses, and, I bought Con up to 2 already. I cant claw back enough to get stealth up 1, as its 10, but, I am not really finding much cyberware/bioware that interests me, aside from False Front.