Unorthodox PbP game - an experiment, Discussion Thread Options

[Glyph]

Okay, I've joined RPOL.net and requested to join the wiki.

[Digital Heroin]

I'm still down with the eccentric game idea, but if it's gone to RPOL I'm out. Work restrictions, and I'll be living at work most of this year.

[Glyph]

I could live with RPOL, but I'll admit that I would prefer a few threads in this forum, kind of like the Divine Comedy game that was going for awhile. A main thread, an OOC thread, and spinoff threads as needed. RPOL looks like a bit of a steep learning curve, and is unnecessarily complicated for a game where the dice are going to be deemphasized.

For house rules, maybe we could do away with the last sentence for empathy software (where it gives a bonus to social skills)? It seems way too cheap, and way too much of a bonus, and all it does is add needless dice pool inflation to social skills, which already cap out higher than anything else in the game.

[Fuchs]

I am ok with banning emotitoys alltogether.

Having a few threads here would work, especially with links to all on the wiki.

Alternatively, I could set up a private forum myself on a free host.

[Fuchs]

Approved Glyph

[overchord]

I really like the idea of creating a complete environment in which to run and interact.
I've never played SR4, but have experience in all 3 previous editions, and have/am reading the SR4 sourcebook.
Is there room fro someone as a NPC-type? I don't have a huge amount of time, and since i'm pretty new to SR4 i thought this might be a good intro to it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Idea for NPC Char: Dexter Beaumont, Mechanic/rigger type laying low in the Carrib working for one of the yacht rental companies. His past makes the job a doddle, but it allows him to keep a low profile while still making a bit of a living by tipping off pirates on particularly lucrative parties setting sail. Will also do repair jobs for runners on most ground and water vehicle types from his shop.

[Divine Virus]

I don't mind if emotitoys etc are scrapped.
I don't think RPOL is worth loosing DH.
Would anyone object to some NPCs having special rules?
For example, I am considering putting together a NPC named "Helen" who is absolutely brilliant with cybertechnology, but overenthusiastic and not enterly mentally stable for this reason, if, when she is performing surgery to install a new peice of 'ware, a glitch is rolled, instead of the normal effect of a glitch, instead it reprisents Helen getting carried away and installing something additional. In effect, the person gains a 5 point mystery mod negative quality. On a critical glitch, the person gets a 10 point mystery mod. It is presumed that Helen's madness is countered by such genius that she would never actually have a normal glitch or critical glitch.

Also, I have noticed that the AI is slightly imbalanced in the karmagen system. For only 186 karma, an AI can have 3 stats at 5, 1 stat at 6. And thats all its stats (except for essence of course). In BP chargen, this would have cost 185 BP, and the player would have had to of spent an additional 110 BP on the AI metatype. Personally I have no objection, but if anyone wants to crack down on me, now would be a good time to speak up.

There are some other questions that come up with my idea as well.
1) If I am AI with 10 point piloting origen quality jumped into an Otomo body, do I use a targetting autosoft to fire a gun the drone is holding, or the firearms skill, or will either work? When running, do I use the maneuver autosoft, or the athletics skill, or either? Etc, etc, etc
2) Are AIs jumped into an Otomo ambidextrous?

Also, Fuchs already said we would work out a way to be able to afford and have access to the 250k, availibility 24 otomo body. How do we want to work this out? In my background, the body was stolen straight from the factory, which the AI had access to because thats where it came into existance.
Any idea how I should reprisent this in chargen?

Thanks!
DV

[Fuchs]

DV, the NPC sounds good.

I'd suggest a house rule of applying race cost in karma gen at double the BP. Restricted gear quality should cover the availability. I'd think using the indebt flaw, but considering the payments as maintenance costs for the body should be balanced. How the bidy was aquired is fluff, so the stolen explanation works out.

Overchord that sounds good, as PC or NPC.

Also, I think it's best to check characters once they are finished. In my pen and paper game, I don't really care about how something was built, only about how the end result looks.

[Divine Virus]

The problem with indept is it only gives up to 30k nuyen. Even if I used all my normal nuyen cap on just buying the thing, that doesn't leave much money for setting myself up as a runner.

EDIT: Huh. I was sure that a Otomo cost 250,000 but it is only 150,000. I should be alright then.

[BlackHat]

There is also the "born rich" quality that lets you use up to 60 BPs (or 120 karma) on money ,for starting cash of 300,000. (330,000, if in debt)

Of course, neither born rich or in debt are on the list of qualities AI may take - but I don't see any reason why it wouldn't make sense to houserule such a thing. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

*lurking*

Edit: Also, as mentioned previously by DV, restricted gear only allows up to availability 20 (and also isn't on the AI list of qualities they may take).

[Divine Virus]

Well, for an AI, reaching sentience in a position of control in an otomo factory probably counts as being "Born Rich"

Now, another question. The rules stat that most vehicles and drones have a six hour batter life, but that it is not always the case. Some have more. The Otomo strikes me as a drone that probably has more, as its very purpose is to function as a prosthetic body. To me it seems reasonible to have at least 16 hours of juice (average human wake cycle), probably 18 or 20 for a safety margin. Does this seem reasonable?

[BlackHat]

Well, for an AI, reaching sentience in a position of control in an otomo factory probably counts as being "Born Rich"

Agreed. That is one of the few situations where it would be used literally. I think those quality restrictions are silly in most cases anyway.

[Fuchs]

That sounds reasonable.

[Fuchs]

Approved Overchord.

So, proposed house rules:

- No emotityos
- Restricted gear goes above Availability 20 (subject to GM approval)
- Racial cost (BP*2) in karma gen

[overchord]

Quick question - Being a mechanic for boats and having a day job working on parts for a yacht rental company i'll buy a facility for that kind of mechanics. Is that restricted to water crafts of can the same facility be used for ground-type vehicles? I'm happy either way, jsut thinking that thee will be a lot of common tools for motors, but also some deviation for e.g. hull repairs vs. body work on ground vehicles.

[ReverendMo]

Quick question, how do you all tend to look at cyberspurs? As in, is the nuyen/essence per individual spur, or would that be a set of two?

[ReverendMo]

Overchord, I could personally see a lot of similar tools used on the internal mechanics such as engines, though some of the vast differences would make most heavy work undoable. It's doubtful the facility would have a carlift when it's built more for drydocking ships, but touch-ups, tune-ups and minor to moderate work wouldn't be too tough I'd think. Just my 0.02 nuyen.

[Fuchs]

Off-hand I'd say that the facility can serve as a toolkit or such for ground vehicles, but not as a facility for ground vehicles.

Equally off-hand, I think that like with hand razors, as long as the spur's effect is not changed (no dual-wielding effect or such), it can be on both hands without additional costs.

[Divine Virus]

That reminds me of another question. The mechanical arms that the Otomo have can apparently be upgraded with cyberware as if it were a cyberarm, but there are no specific rules for doing so. Shall we just say it has capacity as a normal obvious cyberlimb (or synthetic cyberlinb with the mimic vehicle mod)?

[ReverendMo]

Divine, that was my rough understanding of the drone/cyborg chassis limbs, though for the Otomo it'd be the synthetic capacity due to mimic coming standard. Keep in mind that also means the limbs have the same base stats too though, so that's another potential starting nuyen sink if you want better than 3 in physical attributes, and that does tend to work best if all limbs match attributes.

[Divine Virus]

It does specifically state the limbs have a strength equal to drone body (6).
The rules do not say these are cyberlimbs, only that they can be given upgrades as if they were cyberlimbs.
At least, that is my interpretation.

[ReverendMo]

Aha, took cracking about in Augmentation but I found the attributes...
Strength = Drone's Body rating
Agility = Vehicle skill + Handling
Reaction = Response rating
Initiative = Intuition + Response
4 IP
Perception = Sensor or Intuition, whichever is lower
Movement rate = Drone's speed

while this is listed for a cyborg with integrated commlink, I don't think it'd be much different at all for an AI inhabitant. You'd just have the jarhead space open (maybe for storing a muffin? Thank you Gir).

[Divine Virus]

Damn, now I actually might need to keep a muffin in there. I could have sworn that agility was always response. I will need to investigate that myself

[BlackHat]

You're not crazy. I thought the same thing when I played an AI in a drone - never saw the above stuff in Augmentation, though.

In Arsenal, it does say that a drone using mechanical arms to do things (Blades is the example) uses response + skill rating + handling.

Obviously, an AI has no trouble getting its response to 9 or 10 - which means it would do EVERYTHING well.

Using the rules for cyborgs are probably more balanced (AI can still dodge like a mother-f-er, but will likely have agility in the 5-8 range, with the option to go higher if handling or the skill is maxed out)

*shrugs* Probably a GM call.

[ReverendMo]

It likely is a balance issue between drones and cyborgs, given the notion that both have to work around the restrictions of their physical forms but a cyborg would be considered more of a front-stage player rather than a support role that most drones end up being used for.

From a mechanical/rational standpoint, there'd be no difference between the two, regardless of whether or not the cyborg had an AI or a brain in it, as a drone can be jumped into just the same. But drones seem to be looked at as second-fiddle autonomous helpers, so their attributes/skills didn't get quite the attention they deserve.