20th Edition changes, List what you find is different here Options

[Zolhex]

Adept Improved Reflexes

Before it cost:

Level 1 was 2 power points

Level 2 was 3 power points

Level 3 was 5 power points

It now costs:

Level 1 was 1.5 power points

Level 2 was 2.5 power points

Level 3 was 4 power points


Next there is

Improved Physical Attribute

Before it cost:

1 power point per level

and 2 power points per level over natural maximum

It now costs:

.75 power point per level

and 1.5 power points per level over natural maximum



As you find more list away thanks.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Escaping certain Death now expressly suggests that characters should be out of action for the scenario.

Device Attributes like Firewall, System, Signal and Response can only be upgraded to +2 of the original rating. As Pilot is expressly treated like System, that would include it as... it sure limits Ultrawideband Radar to 1km range max.

Deycryption now uses Electronic Warfare + Decrypt.

[DWC]

When using a Track program, your DP is reduced by the Trackee's Stealth program rating. It's about time.

[Tycho]

attribut improvement conts "new rating"*5 karma instead of *3

cya
Tycho

[Angier]

The Intervall for object resistance is 1,2,4,6+ instead of 1,2,3,4+.

Direct combat spells now have an additional drain value of +1 per used net hit

[Rotbart van Dain...]

attribut improvement conts "new rating"*5 karma instead of *3

Recalculating every existing character... yay. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohplease.gif)

[crizh]

Seriously?

Tell me they are just three weeks early.

Last year they were a day late and nobody was laughing.

These are major changes. Like SR4.5 changes.

They better be an April Fools.

[hobgoblin]

Device Attributes like Firewall, System, Signal and Response can only be upgraded to +2 of the original rating. I'm wondering what this means for Pilot... it sure limits Ultrawideband Radar to 1km range max.

so no more turning a low grade comlink into a cheap fairlight knockoff?

[darthmord]

attribut improvement conts "new rating"*5 karma instead of *3

cya
Tycho

So everyone is getting pooched here... mages just a bit more.

Costs.....Old...New
Magic 2...6......10
Magic 3...9......15
Magic 4...12....20
Magic 5...15....25
Magic 6...18....30
Magic 7...21....35

All this change will accomplish is making everyone be high-attribute, low-skill monkeys.

I will need to talk with my GM.

[Critias]

Yikes. Those are some major changes for what I thought was just a fancy print-run.

[Fuchs]

So everyone is getting pooched here... mages just a bit more.

Costs.....Old...New
Magic 2...6......10
Magic 3...9......15
Magic 4...12....20
Magic 5...15....25
Magic 6...18....30
Magic 7...21....35

All this change will accomplish is making everyone be high-attribute, low-skill monkeys.

I will need to talk with my GM.

Actually, no. It'll encourage (a bit at least) rising skills instead of attributes. And the cap on the amount of BP/karma you're allowed to spend on stats at character generation will help too with that goal.

[Blade]

Funny, all the tables I've played on have been using that 5*rating rule (or rating²) since SR4 came out.

[Zen Shooter01]

Don't you mean high skill, low attribute?

I like this change in the cost of attributes, and I like it a lot. Raising attributes was always the first and usually the only thing my PCs did with their karma. If you were a Magician, raising your Magic was almost always, far and away, the best karma investment across the board. For shooters, it's Agility. For Faces, it's Charisma.

And then there was Edge. Say your Elf Rigger has Pilot Ground Vehicles 5, Edge 2. In SR4, Raising the skill would have cost 10, raising the attribute 9. Edge was clearly the better investment. Even if it was a matter of raising Edge from 4 to 5 for 15, Edge's versatility almost always made it the better investment.

Now, with SR4A, that's not nearly so clear cut. Now maxing a stat out at character creation starts looking more sensible.

Including a table listing these changes in SR4A would have been very handy.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

so no more turning a low grade comlink into a cheap fairlight knockoff?

That seems to be the point of said rule - as well as preventing you from putting a Rating 6 Firewall on everything.

[Synner]

There will be an errata/changes reference document posted at some point in the not-too-distant future.

Other changes that have yet to be mentioned include: the combat mechanics of cover (now a defensive modifier), sensors (which now have ratings and can take a limited number of mods), bow ratings and damage have been capped (though can still be impressive), customized cyberlimbs and advanced skills from Street Magic and Arsenal have been incorporated into the core rules.

[darthmord]

I made my post from the perspective that during character creation, it would be better to have as high of attributes as possible and buy up your skills later. Thus you avoid the impending crush of cost later on with attributes.

It'll certainly encourage skill increases during game play.

At the same time, it won't help the disparity between magic advancement and mundane advancement.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Like back in SotA64, the Adept Power Improved Ability now supports Vehicle Skills, again.

Likewise, Kinesics is capped to Level 3.

bow ratings and damage have been capped (though can still be impressive)

Is the Damage Limit to x1.5 rating rule intended to cap the DV increase through Hits? That would be a slippery slope...

[DWC]

There will be an errata/changes reference document posted at some point in the not-too-distant future.

Other changes that have yet to be mentioned include: the combat mechanics of cover (now a defensive modifier), sensors (which now have ratings and can take a limited number of mods), bow ratings and damage have been capped (though can still be impressive), custom rules

I'm really confused about moving Cover to the Defense test, since it now means that when shooting at an unaware target, it doesn't matter whether he's standing in the middle of the street, or 90% obscured by a passing bus. Can you clue us in on why this way changed?

[Shinobi Killfist]

I'm really confused about moving Cover to the Defense test, since it now means that when shooting at an unaware target, it doesn't matter whether he's standing in the middle of the street, or 90% obscured by a passing bus. Can you clue us in on why this way changed?

I can think of two good reasons. One it reduces the you have 0 dice roll situation a bit, and two cast manaball, 3 people have varying cover, roll....

Adding dice is just flat out easier than saying oh against him I roll 6 dice, him I only had 4 dice, and that dude i get my full 8 dice.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Perhaps it would have been to easy just to go from -0 for plain sight, -2 for partial cover, -4 for good cover to -6 for full cover/blind attack. The latter still is an attack modifier...

Adding dice is just flat out easier than saying oh against him I roll 6 dice, him I only had 4 dice, and that dude i get my full 8 dice.

That is still the case for visibility modifiers.

[Shinobi Killfist]

I made my post from the perspective that during character creation, it would be better to have as high of attributes as possible and buy up your skills later. Thus you avoid the impending crush of cost later on with attributes.

It'll certainly encourage skill increases during game play.

At the same time, it won't help the disparity between magic advancement and mundane advancement.

Maybe, but I've seen too many characters built with overly crappy stats because it was so cheap to raise. I just gotta survive a couple runs then my agility will be better and I'll reign supreme. Bleh.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

The ranged combat Range Modifiers are now -0/-1/-3/-6.

[Shinobi Killfist]

Oh, and you may get the cover dice even if you are unaware fo the attack. I'm not sure on this since the unaware penalty says one thing then the opening paragraph says another. Basically the opening paragraph says even stationary or inanimate object may get a defense pool if they have cover, then unaware target mod says unaware targets can't defend.

I'm also still a bit unsure of how cover works vs non-direct combat spell AoEs. If Sam targets Bob who is not behind cover and nails bob with 0 scatter, what happens to Homer and jane who are both behind cover. Does the answer differ if Homer is behind cover in relation to Sam but not the grenade, and Jane is behind cover in relation to the grenade but not Sam. What If a previously unknown Frank is behind cover in relation to both Sam and the grenade.

As I read it the only one getting a defense roll is Bob. everyone else just gets a soak damage roll.

Side note, grenades do not increase in damage from extra successes past bringing the scatter to 0.

[Draco18s]

Statistically adding 3 dice to one pool or removing 3 dice from the opposing pool is statistically identical, except in the case where one pool would be reduced to 0 or fewer dice.

[Shinobi Killfist]

Statistically adding 3 dice to one pool or removing 3 dice from the opposing pool is statistically identical, except in the case where one pool would be reduced to 0 or fewer dice.

Don't forget about how removing dice increases the chance for a critical failure. Though since I have not read everything that may have changed as well.