Basic question about Recoil in 4th..., Cumulative? Options

[Athenor]

Hey guys. I know this is Shadowrun 101, but it came up in last weekend's game, and checking over the 20th BBB didn't help clarify things.

In 3rd edition, recoil modifiers were cumulative across the action phase -- IE burst fire would have +2 TN for the first burst and +5 for the second, each being negated by RC separately.

In 4th, it isn't so clear.

Quoteth the 20th BBB, page 152:

Burst-fire weapons receive a -2 recoil modifier for the first burst fired in that Action Phase and -3 for the second. Long bursts suffer -5 (first burst in phase) or -6 recoil (second). Full auto bursts suffer -9 recoil.

The chart on page 152 backs this up .

However, on page 153...

The firing character can choose to fire a narrow burst or a wide burst, each described below. Both use up three bullets. The first burst fired in an Action Phase inflicts a -2 recoil modifier, the second inflicts an additional -3 recoil (neutralized by recoil compensation, if any).

Emphasis mine.

Maybe I'm missing some quirks in the rules, or something, but I can't decide if this is closer to 3rd or something new. The fact that these pages are right next to each other doesn't help, nor does the fact that the page 152 chart is copied verbatim in the GM screen.

So. Is this up to my discretion, or has there been a ruling on this? Am I going insane?

Also, unrelated, but do dog-brained drones have to lock onto a target before firing? My rigger keeps going full VR into his drones, dropping into a heap right there on the spot, which is starting to get annoying.

[Malicant]

Yes, it still is cumulative. The BBB will try to confuse you a lot. Be on your guard!

[Athenor]

Yes, it still is cumulative. The BBB will try to confuse you a lot. Be on your guard!

Oh, fun. Thanks, I figured the old 1 penalty for each additional bullet was what they were working on.


Hey, guys, the 20th book hasn't gone to print yet... You can still change this! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Malachi]

Oh, fun. Thanks, I figured the old 1 penalty for each additional bullet was what they were working on.


Hey, guys, the 20th book hasn't gone to print yet... You can still change this! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I'm fairly certain it has gone to print, it just hasn't finished printing yet. I've heard that full-colour books take twice as long or more to print.

[Athenor]

Aww. Ah well.

So many questions, though. Turns out the group's mage was built with 121 fewer build points than she should've had.. no wonder she was having problems! So now all these questions are running through my mind, such as if availability affects starting foci, if invisibility is an AoE... okay, well, 2 questions.

[Malicant]

[...]if availability affects starting foci[...]

Yes, it does. They are just another type of equipment.

[...]if invisibility is an AoE[...]

Well, no. But kinda yes. It makes one person invisible to everyone else.

[Kingboy]

Turns out the group's mage was built with 121 fewer build points than she should've had...

Yikes! How the heck do you miss not spending over a quarter of your available points? I could see a few BP slipping through the cracks here and there for new players, but that many? Sheesh...

Where was the GM's head who appoved this?

[Athenor]

Yikes! How the heck do you miss not spending over a quarter of your available points? I could see a few BP slipping through the cracks here and there for new players, but that many? Sheesh...

Where was the GM's head who appoved this?

*meekly raises hand*

I figured her boyfriend checked it over.



While we are on the subject, can you use power foci as sustaining foci?

[Malicant]

No. They "only" add dice to every single test involving Magic (attribute).
They also do not work as "Magic Weapons" even if made in the shape of say a sword, or dagger, or whatever.

[Falconer]

No, a power focus can only be used whenever the 'magic' rating in dice is used by a magician or mystic adept.
EG: Casting a spell, Magic + Spellcasting... power focus can add dice.

They errataed it out of some focii, but lots of people ignore that errata... you'll note in the original book that spellcasting and spirit foci give the option to withhold their dice and use them for drain instead.

You can only use one focus for a single die roll.
So the trick there is you use the power focus for the casting roll (if you have one, they're expensive!), then use the spell focus to add dice to your drain soak roll.

A sustaining focus is special... you cast a spell into it, and it removes the need to take -2 to sustain the spell yourself. There are a few drawbacks in this as well though.

Weapon focus is also a special type.. if you have street magic you'll find a few other 'special' types related to a few of the metamagics.

[Athenor]

If I may, just so I'm 100%, what exactly is the drawback of a sustaining focus?

[Falconer]

It can be attacked and deactivated in astral space.
It counts against your logic limit of active foci.
It limits the force of the sustained spell, and force limits the hits allowed for spell effectiveness.

W/o improved masking advanced metamagic, it sticks out like a sore thumb on the astral and is a fairly easy astral perception check to notice.

Again w/o improved masking, it will stop you from going through wards and set them off.

Sustaining spells over force 2 (IIRC) can get you in trouble w/ the authorities.

Having anything sustained in astral clearly marks you as a mage and as someone to knock out of the fight early to any other mage or spirit.

If you are trying to be stealthy... it takes valuable time to activate, then cast a spell into it.

[Malicant]

I wouldn't know any besides "costs too much money and still quite much karma". You can get addicted to them, too. Focus addiction is regular addictions mean brother.

Those things Falconer said are drawbacks of sustained spells in general, not sustaining foci specifically. They can be annoying if you forget them, but your GM does not.

[Athenor]

Hah. Okay, this has been really illuminating, as my char makes her talismonger/illusionist the best. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) She's looking into watcher spirits now as a hedge witch.

[Falconer]

If she's working as a talismonger... the Arcana and Enchanting skills become absolutely necessary. You can't design (arcana) or bulid (enchanting) magical items w/o them. Plus there's more skills to actually find the raw reagants, if you don't just buy them.

They were added to the core book w/ the SR4A errata/update. You can find them in Street Magic though.

[Athenor]

Yeah, she had those back before we re-calculated. She should be using them soon, as they are about to go on the run outside Seattle. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Crusher Bob]

There should be an excel based character generator over in the 'projects' section of Dumpshock that should make your character gen much simpler.