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> Double Defense, A Real Combat Shotgun
Zen Shooter01
post Jul 3 2009, 03:38 AM
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Don't you want one?

http://www.stoegerindustries.com/firearms/...ble_defense.php
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Adarael
post Jul 3 2009, 03:43 AM
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I... can't bring myself to be excited about it.

If I'm gonna sport a home defense shotgun, I'd want it to be gas operated with a 5-round magazine, and be between 16 and 12 gauge.
Less ammo is dangerous when in a panic situation, and reloading a double barrel during a home invasion is a bad thing.
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KCKitsune
post Jul 3 2009, 04:08 AM
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I would much rather have a pistol. .40 cal or better and 10 rounds in the magazine. Sure I won't splatter my target all over the wall, but with 10 rounds, and a easy way to reload... I don't need to.
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Doc Chaos
post Jul 3 2009, 04:12 AM
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Tactical sights. Who on earth needs tactical sights on a SHOTGUN??
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CodeBreaker
post Jul 3 2009, 04:20 AM
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What I would look for in a home security weapon -
High Ammo Capacity
Reliable
Easy Safety
Easy to Store

What I dont really need in a home security weapon -
A Reflex Scope...
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Maxwell Silverha...
post Jul 3 2009, 04:52 AM
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As a home personal defense weapon..... a solid MEH.... do not want. The point of an old fashioned doubled gun is cheap simple and reliable. That gun may be reliable, but cheap and simple its not. For a home defense shotgun I would much more prefer a simple 870 cut down. A red dot sight for a shotgun WTF?? its a freaking shotgun, in gaming terms think "Area of Effect" .

It is a very nice gun, don't get me wrong. But as an "emergency grab whats close and squeeze the trigger while pointing in the general direction of bad person" it falls short.
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kzt
post Jul 3 2009, 05:50 AM
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QUOTE (Maxwell Silverhammer @ Jul 2 2009, 09:52 PM) *
It is a very nice gun, don't get me wrong. But as an "emergency grab whats close and squeeze the trigger while pointing in the general direction of bad person" it falls short.

Um, have you ever patterned a shotgun at 15 feet? Unlike what various games claim the shotgun is going to make a less than 2 inch sized hole in whatever you aimed it at. If you'd miss them with a pistol you'd miss them with a shotgun.
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Shrike30
post Jul 3 2009, 06:09 AM
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The really simple math for shotgun spread, unless you've done something ridiculous to the weapon, is vaguely around an inch of spread per yard of travel. The point isn't that you can't miss... it's that you're hitting someone with a whole lot of pellets, which individually aren't that powerful but they've got a noticeably higher chance (at a dozen or so pellets of 00 buck in a 2.75" shell) of passing through something important inside the target.

I'm amused at their marketing effort, though (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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kzt
post Jul 3 2009, 07:48 AM
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Pellet spread varies wildly by the gun and the ammo used. I have one that will keep all the pellets from federal LE low recoil on a man sized target at 35 yards and the same shotgun has fliers from Fiocci LE ammo at 20 yards.

And yeah, a 00 buckshot is similar to a .32 caliber FMJ bullet. A .32 FMJ is not the most lethal of bullets. However getting shot by 9 .32 bullets in a 4 inch circle centered on your heart or your nose is not conducive to a very good day.
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Omenowl
post Jul 3 2009, 07:59 AM
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I prefer an over and under shotgun rather than a side by side. I also don't need a lot of ammo with a shotgun. A narrow hallway is more than sufficient to make up for lack of rounds.
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resident-securit...
post Jul 3 2009, 08:11 AM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9U-qjYiMU6I

i pitty the fool who walks down that corridor
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Doc Chaos
post Jul 3 2009, 10:49 AM
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Comparing the Metal Storm System to a shotgun is kind of like comparing a ship-mounted railgun with a juryrigged potato cannon (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
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Naysayer
post Jul 3 2009, 10:52 AM
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I pity the fool who has to reload that turret.
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resident-securit...
post Jul 3 2009, 11:37 AM
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QUOTE (Doc Chaos @ Jul 3 2009, 08:49 PM) *
Comparing the Metal Storm System to a shotgun is kind of like comparing a ship-mounted railgun with a juryrigged potato cannon (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)


lol bloody gold, i was just putting it out there....rofl omg tater cannon ftw

ok this is more in line with the post http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mu965sVymMs...feature=related

guy is kinda creepy the way he talks about his toy.....*shivver* eeeh
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Larme
post Jul 3 2009, 12:24 PM
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QUOTE (Doc Chaos @ Jul 3 2009, 05:49 AM) *
Comparing the Metal Storm System to a shotgun is kind of like comparing a ship-mounted railgun with a juryrigged potato cannon (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)


Yeah, who would want a naval railgun when they could have a potato cannon? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/eek.gif)

As for shotguns, seems to me you'd want something more like a combat shotgun for home defense. A double barreled gun is kind of scary, but it also kind of makes you look like Elmer Fudd. If you've got something that looks like a SPAS-12, you'll cause people to piss/shit/run away much more reliably, I think (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
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Critias
post Jul 3 2009, 01:38 PM
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Never before have I seen such a blatant, obvious, ridiculous, example of the "paint it black, call it tactical, double the price" marketing ploy.
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MKX
post Jul 3 2009, 01:46 PM
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QUOTE (Doc Chaos @ Jul 3 2009, 02:12 PM) *
Tactical sights. Who on earth needs tactical sights on a SHOTGUN??


I was wondering the same thing.
Quasi-useful if you're running slugs through it, but if you're main use for it is being paranoid and occasionally blowing a hole through family members going to the fridge late at night you probably don't need it.

Or just buy an autoloader and do it properly (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)
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Zombayz
post Jul 3 2009, 02:06 PM
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QUOTE (Critias @ Jul 3 2009, 05:38 AM) *
Never before have I seen such a blatant, obvious, ridiculous, example of the "paint it black, call it tactical, double the price" marketing ploy.


Welcome to the world of HIGHSPEEDLOWDRAG OPERATORS.

Welcome to my own personal hell.
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KarmaInferno
post Jul 3 2009, 04:50 PM
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For home defense, I would want a shotgun with ten barrels.

Just for the "Don't fuck with me" effect.



-karma
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Doc Chaos
post Jul 3 2009, 07:03 PM
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QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ Jul 3 2009, 06:50 PM) *
For home defense, I would want a shotgun with ten barrels.

Just for the "Don't fuck with me" effect.



-karma


I second that
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Zen Shooter01
post Jul 3 2009, 07:34 PM
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I see that in my original post I failed to convey the intended irony. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

As a home defense gun, it's crap. The Remington 1100 autoloader, 870 pump, or the Mossberg 500 are all superior for their larger ammo capacity. I posted this just because I thought it had a real sprawl ganger, future dystopia feel to it.

As for red dots on shotguns, yes, they're useful. It is possible to miss with a shotgun in combat, especially at ranges of twenty feet or less. The red dot lets you know where the center of the pattern is going to be. I, though, prefer light/laser combos. You can shoot the gun from the hip while using the laser, and you only need to flip one switch, not two, to get the electronics going. Besides that, the light/laser unit is usually hundreds cheaper than a tactical light and a red dot sight.

As for the debate about the effectiveness of 12 gauges - are you kidding me? Remington Express is nine .33 caliber spheres going downrange at 1325 ft per second.
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Larme
post Jul 3 2009, 08:17 PM
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QUOTE (Zen Shooter01 @ Jul 3 2009, 03:34 PM) *
As for the debate about the effectiveness of 12 gauges - are you kidding me? Remington Express is nine .33 caliber spheres going downrange at 1325 ft per second.


Yeah, I dunno much about guns, but when they test them on Mythbusters, they test a bunch of pistols that don't do jack, and then a shotgun totally annihilates whatever they were shooting at.
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Screaming Eagle
post Jul 3 2009, 10:05 PM
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It was the shooting a lock to open a door test...
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cREbralFIX
post Jul 3 2009, 11:20 PM
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Why use a double barreled shotgun when you can use one of these:

http://www.motivatedphotos.com/?id=578

or use an AR-15 homie style:

http://www.motivatedphotos.com/?id=20836

or homie shoot your AK:

http://www.motivatedphotos.com/?id=18048
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Shinobi Killfist
post Jul 3 2009, 11:43 PM
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Unless you are defending your home against the government or a dedicated assailant, a pump action is probably the best choice. It is a very recognizable sound, most thieves etc. have better things to do than keep coming when they hear it. Even if a burglar is stupid enough to keep coming for you and somehow kills you, after people start firing off shotguns you really can't stick around to loot the place. Now if you have some perverse need to kill people who invade your home and chasing them off isn't enough sure use a shotgun that gets ready in a quieter fashion.
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