Shadows of Latin America?, Whats the story? Options

[JongWK]

So you could spill then? Montevideo?

Let me find what I wrote. Quite frankly, that section wasn't SoLA's finest (far worse things happened during the project, for sure, but let's not go there today), and there are better alt-scenarios just screaming to be written.

Bolivia, on the other hand, was quite entertaining to write.

Say, is there a free file-hosting service I can use?

Word from the official source doesn't say "not a single word of this book will ever be published by us". As a matter of fact, the opposite is true, they're using bits and pieces of it for the Sixth World Almanac.

Without even asking the original authors, but that's hardly surprising at this point.

[Demonseed Elite]

JWK: Use Box.net to put the files on. That's what I'm using. And let me know if you want me to make them into a read-only, printable PDF.

[Accel]

I just thought adding lots of 'v's and 'd's to a word and shouting like :
"Vhere is dee vodka!"
Counted as German.

On a side note and hopefully not too late: The interrogative pronouns "where" and "who" have quite similar German equivalents, "wer" und "wo". There's just a twist, each has vice-versa's meaning.

Saying something like that above with German pronounciation would inquire about who the vodka is...

[Stahlseele]

Furthermore, the stuff with the V instead of the W is used in Germany for russian/ukrainian and the such . .

[Rotbart van Dain...]

It's never too late for necromancy.

[Stahlseele]

Uuuh, right, i did not notice that O.o
Also, didn't we discuss this in another threat recently?

[SirBedevere]

Heh. I've been away from the boards for quite a while and I wonder what's happening about SoLA. I come on the boards to find some of it waiting. Thanks a lot guys (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

We are not waiting anymore. SoLA won't be coming out and possibly any material that it would have will now show up (hopefully) in Almanac's to the 6th World.

[Demonseed Elite]

We are not waiting anymore. SoLA won't be coming out and possibly any material that it would have will now show up (hopefully) in Almanac's to the 6th World.

The Almanac will not have all of the material from SoLA, simply because the word count devoted to the topic isn't as much. It will, however, cover some of the places that appear in SoLA.

[Synner]

I've got a couple of drafts to add to the ones Demonseed and Ancient have posted. If my plans for them don't pan out, I'll get them up some time in the not-too-distant future as well.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

The Almanac will not have all of the material from SoLA, simply because the word count devoted to the topic isn't as much. It will, however, cover some of the places that appear in SoLA.

Yeah, I imagined this would be so.
Now, talking as a true native, the Amazonian Kingdom doesn't make much sense taking Brazil as a whole. If you take the map shown here, the Amazonian Forest is practically everything to the left of a imaginary line connecting Belém to Rio Velho. The area around Cuiabá is Pantanal and you could even patch it together with the Amazonian Forest. My main concern is the brazilian shore. It is hugely populated, not only the Rio de Janeiro - São Paulo area. Then again, if all the people was relocated to Rio de Janeiro - São Paulo, it would explain why the Megalopole is SO DENSELY crowded.

Also, considering that Hualpa took over Brazil, this could be a great moment for the Paraguayan government try to negotiate with the new founded Amazonia a corridor to the Atlantice Ocean, since, you know, Brazil and Argentina took it from them on the 19th century and we killed 99% of their masculine population at the time...

Ecuador and Peru fighting with each other would be another thing.
Anyway, I'm going to lunch now, if someone wants to discuss this I would be glad.

[Bira]

Yeah, I imagined this would be so.
Now, talking as a true native, the Amazonian Kingdom doesn't make much sense taking Brazil as a whole.

I personally say the foundation of Amazonia was an elaborate coup d'etat against a wildly unpopular government, involving lots of dissidents amongst the "normal" urban population backed by Awakened rebel leaders. They took over the government and renamed the country from "Brazil" to "Amazonia" to show what they were all about. It sounds way more plausible than "three dragons and a bunch of shapeshifters walk into a bar and declare independence" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

The same thing goes for the breakup of the USA, really, but replace the dragons with "a bunch of native americans".

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

I personally say the foundation of Amazonia was an elaborate coup d'etat against a wildly unpopular government, involving lots of dissidents amongst the "normal" urban population backed by Awakened rebel leaders. They took over the government and renamed the country from "Brazil" to "Amazonia" to show what they were all about. It sounds way more plausible than "three dragons and a bunch of shapeshifters walk into a bar and declare independence" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

The same thing goes for the breakup of the USA, really, but replace the dragons with "a bunch of native americans".

Well, even so, it implies that the urban population was completely or almost completely relocated to Rio-Paulo. Considering that about 80% of Brazil's population live at the shore, taking all of them or almost all of them to Rio-Paulo is A LOT of people in such a small territory, I think the best way would be to consider some other major cities like Salvador, Recife, Florianópolis, etc in extraterritory, just like Seattle is to the UCAS. This of course considering that Rio-Paulo is the a different country, instead of a "ghetto".

[hermit]

JongWK, did you ever upload your files?

[Bira]

Well, even so, it implies that the urban population was completely or almost completely relocated to Rio-Paulo. Considering that about 80% of Brazil's population live at the shore, taking all of them or almost all of them to Rio-Paulo is A LOT of people in such a small territory, I think the best way would be to consider some other major cities like Salvador, Recife, Florianópolis, etc in extraterritory, just like Seattle is to the UCAS. This of course considering that Rio-Paulo is the a different country, instead of a "ghetto".

I prefer it all as one single country, it makes more sense to me. I like the idea of a big ass cyberpunk city, too, so I don't object to Metrópole too much. Admittedly, it makes more sense if you ignore Shadowrun's canon population figures (which are smaller than the ones from the present day), but it doesn't mean you have to make the rest of the coast deserted.

[hermit]

Métropole (I hope I got the accents right) is the biggest sprawl in the 6th world by far. With all the dire implications. Oh, and the wilderness part of Amazonia is separated by a Korea-style DMZ from the City. Think of it as the bigger, smellier brother of the Gaza Strip, where Vampires and other creatures have every right to prey on metahumans. (Meta)humans are the lowest of the low in Amazonia's eco-friendly, sustainable, energy-efficient and carbon monoxide neutral society.

Sources are Aztlan SB, Blood Sport (novel), Wake of the Comet, and an article in WunderWelten fanzine from way back.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

MetrÓpole (I hope I got the accents right) is the biggest sprawl in the 6th world by far. With all the dire implications. Oh, and the wilderness part of Amazonia is separated by a Korea-style DMZ from the City. Think of it as the bigger, smellier brother of the Gaza Strip, where Vampires and other creatures have every right to prey on metahumans. (Meta)humans are the lowest of the low in Amazonia's eco-friendly, sustainable, energy-efficient and carbon monoxide neutral society.

Sources are Aztlan SB, Blood Sport (novel), Wake of the Comet, and an article in WunderWelten fanzine from way back.

Fixed 'Metrópole' for you.

@Bira, well, sure, overpopulated sprawls are part of the setting, true. I've seen a lot of people complaining on how the NAN doesn't make sense in the first place, while I do believe that an Awakened coup d'état in Brazil would actually work (specially if being backed out by a GD), my complaint is that some people would resort to terro-, erm, liberation fighters to prevent such a massive relocation and as far as I know (and I could as well be wrong), I've never seen any rebel group fighting to restore Brazil.

[Bira]

Fixed 'Metrópole' for you.

@Bira, well, sure, overpopulated sprawls are part of the setting, true. I've seen a lot of people complaining on how the NAN doesn't make sense in the first place, while I do believe that an Awakened coup d'état in Brazil would actually work (specially if being backed out by a GD), my complaint is that some people would resort to terro-, erm, liberation fighters to prevent such a massive relocation and as far as I know (and I could as well be wrong), I've never seen any rebel group fighting to restore Brazil.

I don't think there has been any forced relocation. Metrópole had 40 years between the Amazonian coup and the present to grow to its current size, and I imagine a lot of people who lived away from large urban centers figured that's where most of the money is, and moved in on their own through those decades. As for the coup that created Amazonia itself, I imagine it would have had about as much popular support as the regime change from our real-life military dictatorship into a proper democracy had - you don't see many people who want that back, either. Just imagine what the previous government must have looked like (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

our real-life military dictatorship into a proper democracy

It wasn't a dictatorship, we had rotating presidents and we had an opposition party after all (IMG:style_emoticons/default/silly.gif)
Also, people may believe in anything with the right actions/words. The '64 coup was embraced by the population at large for fear of baby-eaters communists it wasn't until later that MOST people who weren't communists/socialists in the first place, started complaining about the government.
If, let's say, Hualpa simply took over power with others Awakened, promised food and health care to all with the single condition that most people would be relocated to other areas so they could use Magic™ to grow back native fauna and flora to prior or close-to-prior colonization times, then yeah, I can see a huge support. Of course, crime would flourish inside hugely dense sprawls.

[bernardo]

It wasn't a dictatorship, we had rotating presidents and we had an opposition party after all (IMG:style_emoticons/default/silly.gif)

And we had no torture chambers, the mainstream media and the economic elite did not support the dictatorship and we should be thankfull to the military because they saved us from a socialist dictatorship (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead.gif)

As for the coup that created Amazonia itself, I imagine it would have had about as much popular support as the regime change from our real-life military dictatorship into a proper democracy had - you don't see many people who want that back, either. Just imagine what the previous government must have looked like .

I started to imagine a very anti-democratic, unpopular and corrupt government beeing overthrown by a coalition of awakened forces, traditional peoples (native brazilians, quilombolas and others) and the MST!

About Metrópole, well, I think that, to get an sprawl from Rio to São Paulo, this monster would grow also to the north of Rio de Janeiro state (lots of oil there!) and west of São Paulo state (at least to the region around Campinas). That would be like 800km wide!

And it would be bordering Mantiqueira Mountains. That place is kind of awakened today, imagine in the 6th world! BTW, things that would become awakened in the 6th world are very common here. I mean, just in the block where I live there are two talismongers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) (you brazilians know what I'm talking about, those small shops where you can buy candles, umbanda and candomblé artifacts, images of saints, etc).

EDIT: because my written English é uma merda...

[JongWK]

JongWK, did you ever upload your files?

Bolivia is almost ready for posting, and there's more coming after that. I'd like to find a basic legal statement that makes it clear that my material is not intended for any commercial purposes. Do you happen to have one? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/spin.gif)

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Creative Commons has a nice wizard.

[bernardo]

Bolivia is almost ready for posting, and there's more coming after that. I'd like to find a basic legal statement that makes it clear that my material is not intended for any commercial purposes. Do you happen to have one? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/spin.gif)

creative commons?

edit: Rotbart draw first! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cyber.gif)

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

And we had no torture chambers, the mainstream media and the economic elite did not support the dictatorship and we should be thankfull to the military because they saved us from a socialist dictatorship (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dead.gif)

No sir, you must be wrong, there were no torture chambers and we should be thankful for the military to save us from baby-eaters communists. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rotfl.gif)

I started to imagine a very anti-democratic, unpopular and corrupt government beeing overthrown by a coalition of awakened forces, traditional peoples (native brazilians, quilombolas and others) and the MST!

Because no group is more democratic than the MST, right? (To summarize the wikipedia link, the MST is a pro-peasant movement who wishes to create a communist goverment similar to Cuba and old URSS in Brazil)

About Metrópole, well, I think that, to get an sprawl from Rio to São Paulo, this monster would grow also to the north of Rio de Janeiro state (lots of oil there!) and west of São Paulo state (at least to the region around Campinas). That would be like 800km wide!

And it would be bordering Mantiqueira Mountains.

Yep, but as you pointed out, a lot of this land is really hard to live (with mountains and stuff), which leaves the living area quite reduced

[bernardo]

Because no group is more democratic than the MST, right? (To summarize the wikipedia link, the MST is a pro-peasant movement who wishes to create a communist goverment similar to Cuba and old URSS in Brazil)

I disagree in some aspects. MST is more about land reform and is based in constitutional rights about land use, they don't have a revolutionary agenda to take the power or something, but yeah, you can find (lots of) old-school communist aspects in their speech and actions (that is obvious, which capitalist organization would fight for peasants anyway? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif) ). But this kind of discussion is complex, really controvertial and would go way off-topic...

Anyway, I'm glad to find other brazillian dumpshockers! That must be rare since all we got in portuguese are four 2nd edition books and three novels...