Vehicle Stats for a Cruise Ship/Ocean Liner, SR4A Options

[Gamer6432]

Any thoughts? The SR4 Core book and Arsenal don't have anything even close, and I couldn't find something comparable in older edition books. My Shadowrun group is contemplating stealing one during our upcoming adventure that takes us through Miami.

[Makki]

there's no spirit big enough to use Movement...

[Yerameyahu]

What stats do you need, exactly? It's a building that floats.

[Gamer6432]

Mostly looking for Body (for mod purposes) and speed.

[Larsine]

Body = Big
Speed = Slow

[suoq]

There's the Marine Tech Sea Nymph. If you want something bigger just add as much body as you want and slice the speed down. A cruise ship will move at about 20 knots (roughly 10 meters per second or in shadowrun terms, a speed of 30) and has an insignificant amount of acceleration (I'd vote for a "1").

Feel free to check my math, rules interpretations, minimal research and blatant guesses.

Edit: For future reference it looks like 60 MPH is roughly a speed of 80. The Lone Star Mod. Honda 3240 will do 165 mph...

[Dahrken]

Speed of a typical ocean liner (the kind you find cruising today cruising the Carribean area, closs to 1.000 ft in length) is cruising around 20/25 mph with a top speed maybe 30/35 mph if pushing the machines hard and the ship is very lightly loaded - cruise speed is very close to top speed.

Acceleration/deceleration is sluggish - think miles to drop from full ahead to dead stop, and handling nothing to brag about, those vehicules makes wide turns.

What you player plan to do with such a naval beast is beyond me. It's too big to hide, too slow to run away, too expensive/distinctive to sell on the black market, and comes with a comparatively large crew (more than 1.000 persons for the largest, the majority taking care of the passengers) you need to take care of one way or the other.

Body for mods ? It's IMHO somewhat pointless. Engine or hull modifications are major engeneering tasks - the engine alone is the size of a small house and you need to cut the hull open to bring in spare parts for major repairs - that asks for a full-scale shipyard, and there is so much room that almost any number of minor mods can be fit inside.

[CanRay]

Think about how can you modify an office building.

Now put it on the ocean.

Have a nice day.

[Gamer6432]

The idea is to hide in plain sight. One character (rigger/hacker) has the idea to disguise the runner team as a movie production company. He also plans to replace the crew with Manservant drones where possible. I might try to convince him to scale it down some for a smaller boat (like a large yacht). And the team does include a character with engineering skills, so it's not outside the realm of the possible.

[CanRay]

A better idea might be a fishing boat or a freighter. There are a lot more of them on the ocean than a luxury liner.

[suoq]

The idea is to hide in plain sight. One character (rigger/hacker) has the idea to disguise the runner team as a movie production company.

The team will be stealing a Cruise Ship. taking it to Miami (Carribean League), where your goal is to attract attention to the stolen cruise ship by posing as a movie production company in what used to be a mob town run by Gunderson Corporation, a corporation that could use the money and favors of the kind of people who have enough money to afford a cruise ship in the first place and who probably won't be happy to discover they now have one less.

I can see why you need a cruise ship. A fishing boat isn't big enough to carry those big brass ones and stay afloat.

[simplexio]

I remember watching some tv show where they compared ocean liner and huge container cargo ship. Ocean Liner had something like 1000 crew member and cargo ship had 20 and we are talking one of the biggest ships in sea.

[Vertaxis]

Speed of a typical ocean liner (the kind you find cruising today cruising the Carribean area, closs to 1.000 ft in length) is cruising around 20/25 mph with a top speed maybe 30/35 mph if pushing the machines hard and the ship is very lightly loaded - cruise speed is very close to top speed.

The ships in the Carribean are Cruise Ships, not Ocean Liners. Ocean Liners are built stronger and to a higher engineering standard than Cruise Ships. Liners would have to ply the stormy seas of the North Atlantic and other open oceans, while cruise ships run for a safe port as in the relatively sheltered Carribean when severe weather is upon them.

[Mayhem_2006]

From Crackerjack's conversion pdf of SR3 vehicles:

Cunard "Princess Victoria" Liner: Handling -2 ACC 2/10 Speed 50 Pilot 4 Body 22 Armour 8 Sensor 3 Avail - Cost 40 million

30 Basic living facilities (for the crew), 200 improved, 100 high.

***

By the way, for a (slightly dated) account of how to hikack an cruise ship or liner, try "The QE2 is Missing" by Harry Harrison. How applicable it would be in the days of automatic satellite monitoring, IDK.

A short term hijack to rip off all the passengers might be worth pursuing, though - but then again, you have a ship full of people that can afford a luxury cruise, its an obvious target for pirates and you can be sure that the company *knows* that and have taken plenty of precautions...

[Dahrken]

The ships in the Carribean are Cruise Ships, not Ocean Liners. Ocean Liners are built stronger and to a higher engineering standard than Cruise Ships. Liners would have to ply the stormy seas of the North Atlantic and other open oceans, while cruise ships run for a safe port as in the relatively sheltered Carribean when severe weather is upon them.

The difference is somewhat blurred today. While a "pure" ocean liner is likely to be faster (cruising speed closer to 30/35 than 20/25) and more slender, the general outline is similar and stealing one pose the sames challenges.

Keep in mind that today one of those ships has a price of several hundreds millions of dollars, and is designed to carry over 1.000 crew members and 2.000 to 3.000 passengers.

Considering the amount of capital invested and the safety precautions likely to be included to protect it, stealing one is IMHO totally out of reach of what a team of shadowrunners can manage, even a very high-powered team.

[Dahrken]

From Crackerjack's conversion pdf of SR3 vehicles:

Cunard "Princess Victoria" Liner: Handling -2 ACC 2/10 Speed 50 Pilot 4 Body 22 Armour 8 Sensor 3 Avail - Cost 40 million

30 Basic living facilities (for the crew), 200 improved, 100 high.

Room for about 300 passengers ? This is defintively on the small side for a cruise ship or liner.

Also the crew seems rather understaffed, even counting on extra automation - most of the personnel on those ships is not here to operate it, but rather to pamper the passengers - today the ratio is more like 1 crew for 3 passengers, or even more for the most luxurious (and expensives).

[Gamer6432]

The team will be stealing a Cruise Ship. taking it to Miami (Carribean League), where your goal is to attract attention to the stolen cruise ship by posing as a movie production company in what used to be a mob town run by Gunderson Corporation, a corporation that could use the money and favors of the kind of people who have enough money to afford a cruise ship in the first place and who probably won't be happy to discover they now have one less.

I can see why you need a cruise ship. A fishing boat isn't big enough to carry those big brass ones and stay afloat.

Never said it was a good idea, or that it would work. Just asked for stats for a general idea.

And thanks, Mayhem_2006

[Yerameyahu]

You're going to mod a cruise ship? Oh jeez. It's a building that floats! You can do anything to it.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

You're going to mod a cruise ship? Oh jeez. It's a building that floats! You can do anything to it.

Indeed... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

Assume that you can do anything that doesn't affect the 'combat stats' (movement, armor, etc.), and that you can't do anything that does.

[Mooncrow]

Yeah, basically it comes down to SR4 vehicle stats not working well at edge cases, in this case, anything larger than a medium size yacht.

If you really want to go by rules, you're better off to converting to the rules from Rigger 3, and using the tables in the back to build your own. As mentioned earlier, the example liner in that book would be extremely tiny by today's standards at least. Probably go with a Heavy Merchantman as the base instead, and build from there.

[Mayhem_2006]

You're going to mod a cruise ship? Oh jeez. It's a building that floats! You can do anything to it.

Time to give it the "Walker" upgrade then sell tickets for luxury cruises in the Sahara!

[Yerameyahu]

Psh, that's what hover-land-ships are for. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Straight Razor]

just took a cruse actually. loads of fun. carnival cruse i just learned actually has a yearly cruse just for gamers.

i was on a "small ship" only 3K passengers, and ~800 crew. {majesty of the seas}

====

here are the stats for the current largest cruse ship. and as they are only making them bigger, by 2065 this will be a small ship.

lass and type: Oasis class cruise ship
Tonnage: 225,282 GT[1]
Length: 360 m (1,181 ft) overall[7]
Beam: 47 m (154 ft) waterline
60.5 m (198 ft) extreme[7]
Height: 72 m (236 ft) above water line[8]
Draught: 9.3 m (31 ft)[7]
Depth: 22.55 m (74 ft)[7]
Decks: 16 passenger decks[2]
Installed power: 3 × Wärtsilä 12V46D engines (13,860 kW/18,590 hp each)
3 × Wärtsilä 16V46D engines (18,480 kW/24,780 hp each)[8][9]
Propulsion: 3 × 20 MW ABB Azipod, all azimuthing[8]{electric motors drive the prop}
Speed: 22.6 knots (41.9 km/h; 26.0 mph)[2]
Capacity: 5,400 passengers at double occupancy; 6,296 maximum[2]
Crew: 2,165[2]

I could only think that all cruse ships in SR will have serious ani ship to ship weapons, and a rather well trained secruity team of 8 to 12 NPC's of higher than starting PC skill and well funded.

not even thinking of all the ships AI, and fail safe protocols for having the ship remote controlled.

[CanRay]

Psh, that's what hover-land-ships are for. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Giant Caterpillar Treads?

A massive rail line?

Pneumatic tube?

Just pulled across by an army of enslaved trolls?