IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

39 Pages V   1 2 3 > »   
Reply to this topicStart new topic
Dumori
post Sep 9 2010, 02:39 AM
Post #1


Dumorimasoddaa
******

Group: Members
Posts: 2,687
Joined: 30-March 08
Member No.: 15,830



I know for one spirits can't by RAW leave the astral. What other parts of RAW are clearly not RAI or just don't even work and why? Enlighten me Dumpshock and alos maybe we could get some errata(Fat chance I know but it's worth a try). Lets not go for rule that are ambiguous but do actually work by RAW however you read it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neurosis
post Sep 9 2010, 02:42 AM
Post #2


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 935
Joined: 2-September 10
Member No.: 19,000



This is pretty bone-headed, but I heard somewhere that "Grunts can't talk because they have no language skills". I think that's gibberish, and I don't consider it to be RAW, RAI, or a rule at all. It's too nonsensical and stupid. But it is something I've heard.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Kid Chameleon
post Sep 9 2010, 02:51 AM
Post #3


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 251
Joined: 17-March 10
From: Bug City
Member No.: 18,315



I'm sure that the deadliness of mid 21st century car crashes will be noted.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Darkeus
post Sep 9 2010, 02:55 AM
Post #4


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 210
Joined: 15-May 06
Member No.: 8,562



Stick N Shock.

Too broad in its description and better off left out of your game. It will save you headache as a GM.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Yerameyahu
post Sep 9 2010, 02:59 AM
Post #5


Advocatus Diaboli
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 13,994
Joined: 20-November 07
From: USA
Member No.: 14,282



Psh, Darkeus, that's obviously not what the OP asked for. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neurosis
post Sep 9 2010, 03:09 AM
Post #6


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 935
Joined: 2-September 10
Member No.: 19,000



QUOTE (Kid Chameleon @ Sep 8 2010, 09:51 PM) *
I'm sure that the deadliness of mid 21st century car crashes will be noted.


I don't know car crashes are pretty deadly right now?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Cain
post Sep 9 2010, 03:15 AM
Post #7


Grand Master of Run-Fu
*********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 6,840
Joined: 26-February 02
From: Tir Tairngire
Member No.: 178



QUOTE (Neurosis @ Sep 8 2010, 08:09 PM) *
I don't know car crashes are pretty deadly right now?

High speed car crashes are pretty dangerous, yes. But in SR4.5, crashing at something like 25 mph will result in instant splatter for all occupants, no matter what protective measures the car has.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neurosis
post Sep 9 2010, 03:19 AM
Post #8


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 935
Joined: 2-September 10
Member No.: 19,000



Really? Can you cite examples. I have heard of this problem but not seen it demonstrated.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Garvel
post Sep 9 2010, 03:58 AM
Post #9


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 194
Joined: 12-August 10
Member No.: 18,926



Spirits are vulnerable to toxin. They can do combat drugs too.

Pixies get +1 reach if they take the Elongated Limbs metagenetic quality. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Cain
post Sep 9 2010, 04:02 AM
Post #10


Grand Master of Run-Fu
*********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 6,840
Joined: 26-February 02
From: Tir Tairngire
Member No.: 178



QUOTE
Really? Can you cite examples. I have heard of this problem but not seen it demonstrated.


OK. I don't have a 4.5 rulebook handy, so I can't provide any page references. But basically, the problem is this: any vehicle that crashes rams itself, and does full damage to its passengers.

So, let's put our family in a Mercury Comet, going along at 65 meters/turn, or a sedate 48 miles per hour. Suddenly, a squirrel jumps in the way, and the car crashes. The passengers now have to absorb a base 20P damage, instantly killing anything but a maxed-out troll.

See the problem?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Sep 9 2010, 04:04 AM
Post #11


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



Heck, pixies. They're smaller than gnomes but have more health and the same reach as humans and elves. This is a 1.47 foot tall creature that can miraculously strike people two to three times its total size away from itself.

Also - (cross)bows cannot Fire, as that action is reserved for firearms. I think I heard that 4A fixed that, but I don't have a copy to double check.

I'll get to thinking on more.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Cain
post Sep 9 2010, 04:10 AM
Post #12


Grand Master of Run-Fu
*********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 6,840
Joined: 26-February 02
From: Tir Tairngire
Member No.: 178



QUOTE
Also - (cross)bows cannot Fire, as that action is reserved for firearms. I think I heard that 4A fixed that, but I don't have a copy to double check.

Nope, AFAIK 4.5 didn't fix that. I think it's page 147 on the pdf, but my copy is acting up.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Sep 9 2010, 04:16 AM
Post #13


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



A minor point, but AIs can have SINner, but they're not allowed to have Day Job or In Debt. So they're allowed to exist in a given society, but not able to contribute at all? In fact, they'd be a drain on society, as their Home Node requires a lot of upkeep (equivalent to a lifestyle), and on top of that, they can be addicted to things.

How does that work? They can take Addiction. What? Synthahol? Sex? What would they be addicted to, and how would they satisfy that addiction? The best answer I have is Addiction (BTL) in the form of studying the code for it since they don't have the nervous system to actually interpret it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Yerameyahu
post Sep 9 2010, 04:17 AM
Post #14


Advocatus Diaboli
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 13,994
Joined: 20-November 07
From: USA
Member No.: 14,282



I don't see the problem. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Use 'Throw Weapon' or 'Use Simple Object'.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Sep 9 2010, 04:20 AM
Post #15


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



If you "Throw Weapon" then you'd be using the arrow or bolt as an improvised weapon, not at the listed damage.

"Use Simple Action" isn't a bad one though.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Yerameyahu
post Sep 9 2010, 04:33 AM
Post #16


Advocatus Diaboli
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 13,994
Joined: 20-November 07
From: USA
Member No.: 14,282



I dunno. Projectile Weapons *are* Throwing Weapons, and vice versa. Check the category listings. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (There's a stupid rule right there. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) )
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Sep 9 2010, 04:39 AM
Post #17


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



No. Projectile weapons and Throwing weapons get lumped together in gear listing and ranges for Combat Rules, but that's not the same as "they are the same." That's why there are two different skills for using them. The operative word that distinguishes this is "and," as in, "Projectiles and throwing weapons."
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Yerameyahu
post Sep 9 2010, 05:25 AM
Post #18


Advocatus Diaboli
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 13,994
Joined: 20-November 07
From: USA
Member No.: 14,282



They're also together in the rules, as I said. Blades and Clubs are different skills, but they're still both Melee.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Critias
post Sep 9 2010, 05:30 AM
Post #19


Freelance Elf
*********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 7,324
Joined: 30-September 04
From: Texas
Member No.: 6,714



QUOTE (Cain @ Sep 8 2010, 11:02 PM) *
OK. I don't have a 4.5 rulebook handy, so I can't provide any page references. But basically, the problem is this: any vehicle that crashes rams itself, and does full damage to its passengers.

So, let's put our family in a Mercury Comet, going along at 65 meters/turn, or a sedate 48 miles per hour. Suddenly, a squirrel jumps in the way, and the car crashes. The passengers now have to absorb a base 20P damage, instantly killing anything but a maxed-out troll.

See the problem?

According to the vehicle customization/expanded vehicle rules in Arsenal, if they've got seat belts on and allow all the vehicle's standard crash protection (airbags, etc) features to work (rather than going out of their way to disable them, like apparently some Shadowrunners, somewhere, might foolishly do)...they take no damage. Otherwise, they take the same damage as the vehicle, resisted by Body and 1/2 Impact (like you posted).

To me the bigger issue is that it's resolved as a ram attack -- so that the more Body your vehicle has, the more damage you take (by quite a bit). Something's a little off when you're better off crashing at 100+ kmh on your motorcycle than in the back of a riot control vehicle.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Yerameyahu
post Sep 9 2010, 05:31 AM
Post #20


Advocatus Diaboli
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 13,994
Joined: 20-November 07
From: USA
Member No.: 14,282



Indeed. The ramming rules in general are a big mess, but at least there are seatbelts. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neurosis
post Sep 9 2010, 05:36 AM
Post #21


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 935
Joined: 2-September 10
Member No.: 19,000



QUOTE (Neraph @ Sep 9 2010, 12:16 AM) *
A minor point, but AIs can have SINner, but they're not allowed to have Day Job or In Debt. So they're allowed to exist in a given society, but not able to contribute at all? In fact, they'd be a drain on society, as their Home Node requires a lot of upkeep (equivalent to a lifestyle), and on top of that, they can be addicted to things.

How does that work? They can take Addiction. What? Synthahol? Sex? What would they be addicted to, and how would they satisfy that addiction? The best answer I have is Addiction (BTL) in the form of studying the code for it since they don't have the nervous system to actually interpret it.


So AIs are essentially welfare cheats?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Redcrow
post Sep 9 2010, 06:17 AM
Post #22


Moving Target
**

Group: Members
Posts: 213
Joined: 11-October 09
From: Des Moines, IA
Member No.: 17,742



One rule that seems to be a bit contradictory is... most spells require LOS, but since Astral Perception technically isn't 'sight' but some sort of magical 'extra sense' Mages shouldn't be able to cast spells while using Astral Perception/Projection that require LOS. Of course the RAW describe doing just that, which is why there is a bit of contradiction. At least IMO, YMMV.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Neraph
post Sep 9 2010, 06:35 AM
Post #23


Great Dragon
*********

Group: Members
Posts: 5,542
Joined: 30-September 08
From: D/FW Megaplex
Member No.: 16,387



QUOTE (Neurosis @ Sep 8 2010, 11:36 PM) *
So AIs are essentially welfare cheats?

As they're written now. I'm resisting comparing them to a certain group that exists today.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Cain
post Sep 9 2010, 07:07 AM
Post #24


Grand Master of Run-Fu
*********

Group: Dumpshocked
Posts: 6,840
Joined: 26-February 02
From: Tir Tairngire
Member No.: 178



QUOTE (Critias @ Sep 8 2010, 09:30 PM) *
According to the vehicle customization/expanded vehicle rules in Arsenal, if they've got seat belts on and allow all the vehicle's standard crash protection (airbags, etc) features to work (rather than going out of their way to disable them, like apparently some Shadowrunners, somewhere, might foolishly do)...they take no damage. Otherwise, they take the same damage as the vehicle, resisted by Body and 1/2 Impact (like you posted).

Now I'm going to have to be the one asking for a page reference. All I could find in the customization section was an advanced passenger protection system, that adds 1-6 dice to the test to soak damage. Did I miss it?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Mäx
post Sep 9 2010, 07:19 AM
Post #25


Prime Runner
*******

Group: Members
Posts: 3,803
Joined: 3-February 08
From: Finland
Member No.: 15,628



QUOTE (Cain @ Sep 9 2010, 09:07 AM) *
Now I'm going to have to be the one asking for a page reference. All I could find in the customization section was an advanced passenger protection system, that adds 1-6 dice to the test to soak damage. Did I miss it?

Page 103 "SAFETY SYSTEMS AND CRASHING"(also seriuosly it took me 30s to find that and i havent even read it ever before.)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

39 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 
Reply to this topicStart new topic

 

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 5th January 2025 - 06:35 PM

Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.