Biowire and the Skillwire Expert System, Why Writers need to cross check. Options

[Marcus]

Official FAQ is BS it contradicts RAW and such in places. In some it can be read as self contradictory. It's hardly gospal its more like surgested house rules that soem people involved with CGL had.

I think the Errata is best for everyone. It's pretty clear.

[Dumori]

I think the Errata is best for everyone. It's pretty clear.

True the offical errata reads

p. 149 Emulation
Add the following sentence to the end of this section:
“Memorized Complex Forms emulating skillso s are
limited to the rating of the original skillso and cannot be
improved either by  reading or Karma-expenditure.”

I recall the FAQ/dev chat line being yep you can thread you skill over 7 if you want.

[Yerameyahu]

On the face of it, that just sounds bad, Dumori. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I like the clear limitation of the Errata (which I apologize that I didn't really read before participating in this thread).

[Udoshi]

edit: oops. Didn't see page 4. someone beat me to it.

[Yerameyahu]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Right. So, that pretty much answers all my questions, I guess?

It only leaves #4: is it a fair price to CF-ize ActiveSofts+Options at a cost of 1 Karma per Rating/Option? Given that that max out at 4 (with 2 options max), that'd be 8 Karma per Rating 4 pseudo-Skill (with Personalized and PlusCode 3; just 4 without those). A real skill costs the same 8 Karma just for level 2, and 22 Karma for level 4. Should it be compared to level 5 (32 Karma), though, because of Personalized?

Hmm. If you wanted to make it a little more expensive, there are two good options: double the list cost, or 2 Karma per Rating and 1 Karma per Option. Double is 16 (half of a real Skill 5), while the split version is 12 (about half of real Skill 4). Yes, everyone would always get Personalized this way, but still; they would anyway.

[Marcus]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Right. So, that pretty much answers all my questions, I guess?

It only leaves #4: is it a fair price to CF-ize ActiveSofts+Options at a cost of 1 Karma per Rating/Option? Given that that max out at 4 (with 2 options max), that'd be 8 Karma per Rating 4 pseudo-Skill (with Personalized and PlusCode 3; just 4 without those). A real skill costs the same 8 Karma just for level 2, and 22 Karma for level 4. Should it be compared to level 5 (32 Karma), though, because of Personalized?

Hmm. If you wanted to make it a little more expensive, there are two good options: double the list cost, or 2 Karma per Rating and 1 Karma per Option. Double is 16 (half of a real Skill 5), while the split version is 12 (about half of real Skill 4). Yes, everyone would always get Personalized this way, but still; they would anyway.

I do think its fair to point out the personalized is going to make acquiring said software difficult, the wording on personalized is that it has to be customized specifically for your character. I can totally buy finding base rating soft on the net, i can even buy pluscode on the net. But I can't buy that someone happens to have personalized activesofts sitting around waiting for you. Which isn't to say you can't get them, just that you will have to ether program them yourself or lay out the cash for them.

[sabs]

You're a technomancer with software skill, you can probably program them yourself.
Or you can lay out the cash for them pretty easily. It's like 48K per skill.

What else are you spending your money on as a technomancer.
Drones?

[Marcus]

What else are you spending your money on as a technomancer.
Drones?

Beer and Pizza? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

[Dumori]

On the face of it, that just sounds bad, Dumori. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I like the clear limitation of the Errata (which I apologize that I didn't really read before participating in this thread).

Same I think its the ONLY errata. CGL put out before a a reprint of the book. Why can't they fix the others too.

[sabs]

Beer and Pizza? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

you spend money on beer and pizza?
you are a horrible technomancer!

[Marcus]

you spend money on beer and pizza?
you are a horrible technomancer!

LOL fair point.

[jakephillips]

Hey when the same guy delivers pizza to your place and the names on the account are never the same twice. Might send up a couple of real world flags.

[sabs]

Hey when the same guy delivers pizza to your place and the names on the account are never the same twice. Might send up a couple of real world flags.

am I not spoofing Lifestyle, and changing locations every couple of weeks anyways?

[Udoshi]

Which isn't to say you can't get them, just that you will have to ether program them yourself or lay out the cash for them.

TM: Hey! registered machine sprite! You have the Software autosoft, cause the resonance cheats like that. Make me a personalized program option, and rush the job because you have stability.

*two weeks of occasionally reregistering two sprites*
TM: "Hey! now use Patching to add it into this pirated autosoft before it degrades."
*one week later*
TM: Emulates a newly-personalized skillsoft, and learns it.

Additionally, if you're looking to really optimize your emulations, grab Pluscode 6, not 3.

3 may seem like the sweet spot, because it lets you run a r4 with only 1 'skillwire slot' taken up.
However, sprite assistance adds the sprites rating to the rating of the complex form. Which means its suddenly going to hog a lot of memory on your biowires if you use this trick.
There's -usually- no reason to have an Optimized 6 option, but as a Rated complex form, it does go up that high.
For a technomancer, being able to reduce a R4 emulation boosted to r7 down to 1 slot may be worth planning for.

[Yerameyahu]

I still don't think anything should be allowed to use Software, but oh well. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

*Can* you use anything (including Sprites) to raise an ActiveSoft (emulated into a CF)? Can an Option exceed the rating of its program?

[Marcus]

TM: Hey! registered machine sprite! You have the Software autosoft, cause the resonance cheats like that. Make me a personalized program option, and rush the job because you have stability.

*two weeks of occasionally reregistering two sprites*
TM: "Hey! now use Patching to add it into this pirated autosoft before it degrades."
*one week later*
TM: Emulates a newly-personalized skillsoft, and learns it.

Additionally, if you're looking to really optimize your emulations, grab Pluscode 6, not 3.

3 may seem like the sweet spot, because it lets you run a r4 with only 1 'skillwire slot' taken up.
However, sprite assistance adds the sprites rating to the rating of the complex form. Which means its suddenly going to hog a lot of memory on your biowires if you use this trick.
There's -usually- no reason to have an Optimized 6 option, but as a Rated complex form, it does go up that high.
For a technomancer, being able to reduce a R4 emulation boosted to r7 down to 1 slot may be worth planning for.

Your concept is a fair point, and it will work. But your still are looking at 3 months even with stability to preventing things from becoming an epic screw up. The patching is fine in general but if you check unwired 114 you will find a program can only be equipped with number of options equal to half its rating. So, you can get R4 Autosoft, with Personalization and Pluscode 1 if you feel so inclined. (All be it you add another month to the process, but thats not huge deal.) Its worth mentioning that the bigger downside imo is the karma cost.

[Laughing One]

TM: Hey! registered machine sprite! You have the Software autosoft, cause the resonance cheats like that. Make me a personalized program option, and rush the job because you have stability.

*two weeks of occasionally reregistering two sprites*
TM: "Hey! now use Patching to add it into this pirated autosoft before it degrades."
*one week later*
TM: Emulates a newly-personalized skillsoft, and learns it.

Additionally, if you're looking to really optimize your emulations, grab Pluscode 6, not 3.

3 may seem like the sweet spot, because it lets you run a r4 with only 1 'skillwire slot' taken up.
However, sprite assistance adds the sprites rating to the rating of the complex form. Which means its suddenly going to hog a lot of memory on your biowires if you use this trick.
There's -usually- no reason to have an Optimized 6 option, but as a Rated complex form, it does go up that high.
For a technomancer, being able to reduce a R4 emulation boosted to r7 down to 1 slot may be worth planning for.

http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?s=&a...st&p=817120

[Yerameyahu]

See, exactly what I asked. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Thanks!

[Dumori]

So did I but the ability to long time serrise a sprite or just reregister it while it programs you some skill softs that still dont cost you much to emulate karma wise isn't a bad deal.

[Marcus]

So did I but the ability to long time serrise a sprite or just reregister it while it programs you some skill softs that still dont cost you much to emulate karma wise isn't a bad deal.

I agree that it is a good deal. And if i ever make TM i promise i'd pick that echo up around 2nd or 3rd. The only real downside is the time. Software hacking and creation isn't a huge deal programming wise, the difficulty isn't very high, but intervals are big, programing environments can cut that in half. But even so activesoft are 6 months! Not a lot you can do about it, and if you don't score 8 hits on that test well your not gonna like it. (Not that 8 hit should be hard, given all the ways to modify it.)

[MuscaDomestica]

Can you use a Tutor Sprite to run the skill soft as a service?

Can you then learn it off them and then buy it as a CF?

[Yerameyahu]

It appears that you have to have access to actual ActiveSofts to emulate them.

[Udoshi]

Well, it appears the devs have put their foot down on boosting emulation. Oh well. Putting that in the 'should have been errata but isn't, cause Catalyst is lazy' files.

but if you check unwired 114 you will find a program can only be equipped with number of options equal to half its rating. So, you can get R4 Autosoft, with Personalization and Pluscode 1 if you feel so inclined. (

Minor nitpick: Options, not option ratings. An option, if present, can be rated from 1-6 unless its says it has its own cap, or if its unrated, in which case it counts as rating 3.
The slots you have for an option don't care about the rating of the option inside it. Just thought I'd clarify that. The only thing using a higher rating on an option does is increase the cost.

It appears that you have to have access to actual ActiveSofts to emulate them.

Yes you certainly can do that, but is there any reason you can't use threading to make one up from scratch?

Can you use a Tutor Sprite to run the skill soft as a service?

Can you then learn it off them and then buy it as a CF?

To the first, I don't think so. you need an echo in order to share complex forms and widgets with your technomancer group - or have a networking resonance bond with a free sprite.
To the second, I think you actually can, because one of the mainpurposes of sprites is to aid study, and learning a complex form directly from a sprite bypasses the emulation rules by using the generic 'learn a new complex form' rules.
However, a tutor sprite only has access to Technical, Vehicle or Knowledge skillsofts. Datasprites have Linguasofts
Machine sprites, sadly, don't work - they have autosofts, but those aren't activesofts.

I don't get it, though. Limiting technomancers to the hardware-equivalents of a ware-limited sammy doesn't seem right, when sprites just WHEEE and fly past the rating 4 limit on activesofts and programs all the time (except on expert defense and expert offense, oddly, such as on paladin sprites).

[Yerameyahu]

Yes you certainly can do that, but is there any reason you can't use threading to make one up from scratch?

Yes. The rules. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Udoshi]

Yes. The rules. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

would you kindly point out where it says you *must* do that?