Type O system Adept, Always thought this was a bad concept but now not so much? Options

[Mäx]

If so, it is not unreasonable to assume the SR4A name change for the grade simply wasn't caught.

There's no name change in SR4A, the list of grades can be found in the page 303 of the BBB(non A) and its the one i provided in post 89.
Also could you actually quote your proof about Type-O working with Cultured bioware instead of just posting a link to a 100+ post topic, becouse i dont even see the rlevance of that topic as the FAQ says nothing about Type-O and i'm 99.9% sure that neither did the previous FAQ.

[KarmaInferno]

Ack, getting my threads mixed up. I blame posting at 3 inna morning. Nevermind the FAQ, I guess.

I'll hunt for the dev chat quote.

In any case, Page 84, BBB, non-A edition:

"Players should consider the grade of the cyberware or bioware when choosing it. Two grades are available to starting characters: Basic and Alpha."

So at one point, "Basic" was BOTH an implant grade AND a bioware type.



-k

[Glyph]

That's how it has always been. Cyberware and bioware are available in four grades, and bioware is further differentiated as either basic or cultured bioware.

By the way, while Frank's opinion may only be that, despite having worked on the book, he does back it up by pointing out how the shadowtalk he quotes only makes sense with his interpretation of the quality.

[Mäx]

By the way, while Frank's opinion may only be that, despite having worked on the book, he does back it up by pointing out how the shadowtalk he quotes only makes sense with his interpretation of the quality.

And Synner confirmed that Frank's post is correct about how it works and he was line developer at the time.

[KarmaInferno]

What doesn't jive is why there are grades of bioware AND basic/cultured types, though, given all that shadowtalk.

And the metabolic vs neurological explanation feels like so much sophistry and obfuscation to me. It sounds very pretty and logical but I could probably make up some bullcrap about bioware integration needing pink fuzzy bunnies that also sounds very pretty and logical. Either way it's an attempt to cover up inconsistencies.

"Cultured" means "grown from your own bodycells and custom tailored to you."

"Deltaware" means "grown from your own bodycells and custom tailored to you."

Really, what is happening is a bad mesh of two pre-existing rules, in an attempt to preserve both.

Which shouldn't have been done at all. Either the cyberware grades should never have been applied to bioware, or my personal preference the cultured bioware rules should have been dropped entirely.

Perhaps if you wanted to preserve the "cultured bioware" concept for nostalgic or historical reasons, simply have some bioware only be available as Alpha grade or better.

Note by the way I never mentioned Type O in that. But making some bioware not available as Standard grade, and then changing Type O to only work with Standard bioware, also prevents Type O from using that bioware same as Cultured would.

Streamlined, simpler, clearer, and more elegant.



-k

[darthmord]

I would dare say that basic bioware uses type owen cells for its structure.

Cultured Bioware does the same but also uses your own protein markers during the growth process. Thus resulting in cultured bioware that is type owen based but somewhat customized for you. That would allow for having grades of bioware as the better the grade, the more of your DNA was used (& tweaked) and earlier on in the process.

It somewhat analogous to having a 10% tolerance for one part and a 1% tolerance for the same part that gets used a slightly different way. Same part, made the same way, the QA on it for the second use/function is tighter and thus more costly.

Perosnally, I apply it to both based on the above viewpoint. Never run into any problems over it.

[naga-nuyen]

I think it makes allot of sense for me because the last time I played there was no Bio-ware, just cyber-ware...I mean there might have been a book published, it was back in the 93-95 time frame, but we had none in our games. I think all we owned was the basic book, and the city box set, NAGTRL, and that is about it.

[Tyro]

Yeah those are the posts i was refferring to(the ones from Synner).
But i would still want to see this so called "proofs" that Tyro and Karma Inferno are preferring to that show devs intention to be opposite to what those posts state.

In light of the quotes from Frank and Synner, I revise my position: It appears that RAW/RAI is that Type O doesn't work on Cultured. I maintain, however, that it [i]should[i].