Getting the most out of AR Options

[Tanegar]

I'm contemplating a combat hacker, focusing on hacking on the fly in AR while still having enough combat capability to be a lethal threat to the opposition. Obviously, my AR IPs are the same as my meat IPs; is there a way that I can make up for the other advantages of VR?

[Nifft]

Not being a helpless target is a pretty good perk, IMHO.

The fact that you can move around and shoot while hacking every other IP is huge, since that generally protects you from the "GEEK THE MAGE" behavior targeting protocol that's fed into every modern drone and CorpSec training manual.

Being an Adept is pretty sweet for this guy. You could nab 4 IPs right off the bat (even losing one point of Essence), or pump your technical skills with some VERY cheap skill enhancements. With the stuff in Street Magic, you can get more free actions (more useful for a mixed-mode Hacker than most characters).

[sabs]

Might I recommend being a magic 3 maybe 4 Adept?

Improved Reflexes 2 (2.5 PP)
Improved Ability - Hacking 2 (.5PP)
Improved Ability - Cybercombat 2(.5pp)

You have another .5 for something fun. You might even have more if you're using the ERRATA PP costs for Improved Reflexes.

Cracking group of 4
Be sure to pick up Trodes so you have a DNI.

(honestly, this is what I thought Technomancers should be.. technoadepts) and not what they ended up being.

[KarmaInferno]

You might even have more if you're using the ERRATA PP costs for Improved Reflexes.

Wait, errata?

SR4A has an errata?



-k

[Udoshi]

Might I recommend being a magic 3 maybe 4 Adept?

I think you might be slightly more effective using restricted gear and a synaptic booster for your IPs, with pirated software to make up for the cost.

Its expensive, but you're getting 4 passes for 2 essence, instead of using 4 essence's worth of magic to get 4 passes.

Multitasking and Enhanced Perception(0.25/lev) are also great for hacker-adepts, because they affect matrix perception tests. If you're already splitting your attention between AR-hacking and meatspace activities, you almost certainly don't want to waste simple actions on anything, and multitasking makes perception a free action.

Of potential note is Manual control interface, in Unwired on page 58 - physically using a commlink's controls is a simple action. Therefore, it ought to be possible for you to fire a SA gun at someone(simple), manually scan for hidden nodes(simple with manual), and a free to do something else. Behold, the combat texter. Like a medic, only with SMS.

Edit: Forgot to mention Nimble Fingers.

[Dhuul]

This thread is interesting to me, as i am planning to play a hacker/tm as soon as i get the chance (im gm'ing right now, so that might take a while)
But i have not yet thought about *just* playing an adept, specialized in hacking.

I have one question though, Udoshi:
Enhanced Perception (the adept power you mentioned) does grant extra dice for perception test, but it also gives a page reference for perception test, which states stat perception test are those that require the player (or gm in most cases) to roll for intuition+perception. Matrix perception is handled by rolling computers+analyze (don't know if i've got the translation right, i only have the german source-book in from of me right now). So i presume that the Enhanced Perception adept power only affects all rolls involving the perception skill, not matrix perception, as this is rolled with a totally different set of skill+attribute. As i only have the core book as reference, i might easily be mistaken, but please point me to the book where this is stated if so.

back to topic (or rather "less off-topic"), i always found starting-level technomancers to be quite weak compared to mundane hackers with the same bp, so building an adept suited for the matrix sounds quite intriguing. It is a totally new idea to me as i mostly played SR3 where Magic and Matrix didn't mix that well. This is true even more, if adepts may use their perception pool modifiers for matrix-related perception tests. Still, even without that, adepts seem to fit into a team that already has a rigger/decker (confined to his/her vehicle/home) pretty well because they can also participate in "normal" combat more easily then normal hackers/riggers.

Please apologize my (probably) bad grammar and spelling as it is 4:20 a.m. in Germany and i am not at my best, yet could not wait to post this until the morning. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Brainpiercing7.6...]

The adept hacker is an established concept by now, right? I'm thinking about making one, too.

I am also not decided about the perfect efficiency of either getting IPs via Powers, or via Bioware. I would want some meat-combat enhancing bioware and cyberware, too, so is it really worthwhile spending a full two essence and a crapload of cash on Synaptic Boosters? Especially with the harsh limit on available cash I'm tending to take the Geas-learned Adept power over the Synaptic boosters, which leaves me room to fill one point of essence with some other stuff and get 1-2 points worth of powers next to the Reflexes.

Has anyone calculated this?

[Mayhem_2006]

Might I recommend being a magic 3 maybe 4 Adept?

Improved Reflexes 2 (2.5 PP)


You have another .5 for something fun. You might even have more if you're using the ERRATA PP costs for Improved Reflexes.

Wait, what? Which errata is this? My core says cost of 3 for level 2, and I can't find Improved Reflexes in the Errata at all.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Wait, what? Which errata is this? My core says cost of 3 for level 2, and I can't find Improved Reflexes in the Errata at all.

Page 196, SR4A... in the Base Book itself... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smokin.gif)

[KarmaInferno]

My SR4A still has Improved Reflexes 2 costing 2.5 Power points.

Which is why I was confused, as the post in question was implying the cost might be even lower in some errata.




-k

[Nifft]

The nice thing about the adept power is that it only costs a little karma to get you up to 4 IPs. If you go with Synaptic Boosters, you can have 3 IPs right out of the gate for only 1 Essence, but you won't be able to squeeze 4 IPs into that 1 Essence until you can afford deltaware (millions of ¥).

The other thing is that a combat hacker can benefit from some other 'ware, and buying SB 2 costs your entire Essence budget. Reception Enhancers, for example, or a cyberfoot with a nanohive. If you're going to split your focus between hacking and shooting -- which is a fine split IMHO -- you may want to think about Muscle Toners.

Do you want cybereyes with an integrated Smartlink? Do you want an in-head datajack so your PAN can't be jammed? Do you want to leave room for deltaware encephalon II? (Probably not, but it's less than a million ¥.)

I'm a fan of Bone Density Augmentation 2 -- for only 0.6 Essence, you get +2 resist damage, +1 unarmed damage, and your unarmed damage is physical -- as a subtle yet practical augmentation.

[Yerameyahu]

For the datajack, you don't need it. You can still skinlink everything, including trodes.

[sabs]

You really don't need cybereyes with integrated smartlink.
put smart link on both your glasses and your contacts.
and if your GM hoses you one day with an ambush while you're in bed.. suffer the loss of 2 dice for long enough to get your glasses from the bedside table.

[Udoshi]

This thread is interesting to me, as i am planning to play a hacker/tm as soon as i get the chance (im gm'ing right now, so that might take a while)
But i have not yet thought about *just* playing an adept, specialized in hacking.

I have one question though, Udoshi:
Enhanced Perception (the adept power you mentioned) does grant extra dice for perception test, but it also gives a page reference for perception test, which states stat perception test are those that require the player (or gm in most cases) to roll for intuition+perception. Matrix perception is handled by rolling computers+analyze (don't know if i've got the translation right, i only have the german source-book in from of me right now). So i presume that the Enhanced Perception adept power only affects all rolls involving the perception skill, not matrix perception, as this is rolled with a totally different set of skill+attribute. As i only have the core book as reference, i might easily be mistaken, but please point me to the book where this is stated if so.

The answer to that is somewhat buried in the rules regarding perception tests. Perception tests aren't with the skill itself, but rather a broad category of tests(much like Matrix tests or Vehicle tests), all governed by the Observe in Detail action, which is used both on the matrix and in real life. Also, there are numberous other qualities and ware that add to Perception tests, but call out non-physical types of perception as being included in the bonus. For example, the Perceptive quality adds to perception tests, and benefits astral and matrix perception equally. I've gone over them here, and in the following posts. You are also going to want to look at the relevant sections for Matrix perception and Astral perception before going ahead and saying 'you're not rolling Perception(the skill), therefore it isn't a Perception Test). Also, that thread has some good information for AR-hackers in general, so its worth a read.


On the Improved Reflexes Power Cost issue:
All the people using the old expensive costs need to get Anniversary edition. There's been no change within anniversary edition(to my knowledge), but it HAS been changed between 4th Edition and Anniversary edition. Yes, they're different.
Course, i wouldn't be surprised if catalyst did something retarded like include unpublished errata files in the limited edition. Under the latest edition of the rules I have, Improved Reflexes is 1.5/2.5/4 power points for each level

[Mäx]

I think you might be slightly more effective using restricted gear and a synaptic booster for your IPs, with pirated software to make up for the cost.

Its expensive, but you're getting 4 passes for 2 essence, instead of using 4 essence's worth of magic to get 4 passes.

That's highly debatable, with Improved Reflexes 3 you still have room for 2 essence worth of ware.
You can get some really nice stuff into that, especially as that ware getup doesn't have to include very expensive(in essence or nuyen) IP booster.
.

[klinktastic]

Cram or Jazz is another way to add a IP if absolutely needed. Just an option.

[Nifft]

Cram or Jazz is another way to add a IP if absolutely needed. Just an option.

Agree. That's exactly why, for me, the 'ware (and magic) options start at rating 2.

No way is one of my characters going to blow essence on one extra IP, when that's the kind of bonus I can get from drugs which are effectively free.

Getting TWO extra IPs... now we're talking.

[Mayhem_2006]

Page 196, SR4A... in the Base Book itself... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smokin.gif)

Yay, thanks. My adept now has an extra level of Kinesics and an extra level of boosted strength (due to another cost reduction made in SR4A)

[Udoshi]

That's highly debatable, with Improved Reflexes 3 you still have room for 2 essence worth of ware.
You can get some really nice stuff into that, especially as that ware getup doesn't have to include very expensive(in essence or nuyen) IP booster.
.

Yeah, it is debatable.

However, magic 6( 4 for IPs, 2 random points for hackey-related things) costs you, in total, 40(mag5)+25(mag6)+5(adept) so 70 points.
A r3 synaptic booster adept costs you 5(restricted gear)+ 48(240k nuyen)+5(adept)+30(mag3)=87 points.

So, while it is more expensive by 17 points (42 if you hardmax magic), you still get +3 reaction, +3 passes, half a point of essence to play around with(which can be a full point of cyber, due to halving lesser), and have 1-2 more points to spend on adept powers.

There are other minor advantages, like not losing your passes in background count or when a mage decides to pop a mana static.
A far cheaper(bp-wise) solution is to just suck the 5 points up and go mystic adept with improved reflexes(the spell). Its a viable alternative, but has some downsides: It adds to Initiative, not Reaction, and can be counterspelled, and needs to be recast every time you pass through a ward/mana barrier.

A method I'm more fond of is saving half a power point during character creation, because adepts can do that, and just using improved reflexes 2. Next time I get a power point(whether through raising magic, or convincing a GM that the optional rule for adepts to trade an initiation metamagic for a powerpoint), you suddenly have enough to jump straight to improved reflexes 3. I mean, your first initiation's only 13 karma.

[Mäx]

A method I'm more fond of is saving half a power point during character creation, because adepts can do that, and just using improved reflexes 2. Next time I get a power point(whether through raising magic, or convincing a GM that the optional rule for adepts to trade an initiation metamagic for a powerpoint), you suddenly have enough to jump straight to improved reflexes 3. I mean, your first initiation's only 13 karma.

Thats what i do for most of my Adept builds too, there's not much need for having 4IP:s straight out the gate.
Of course if your GM allows it, in karmagen you can spent that 13karma to initiate during chargen, which allows you to get 4IP.s as well as some other adept powers and still burn a couple of points of essence for ware.

[Brainpiercing7.6...]

Yeah, it is debatable.

However, magic 6( 4 for IPs, 2 random points for hackey-related things) costs you, in total, 40(mag5)+25(mag6)+5(adept) so 70 points.
A r3 synaptic booster adept costs you 5(restricted gear)+ 48(240k nuyen)+5(adept)+30(mag3)=87 points.

So, while it is more expensive by 17 points (42 if you hardmax magic), you still get +3 reaction, +3 passes, half a point of essence to play around with(which can be a full point of cyber, due to halving lesser), and have 1-2 more points to spend on adept powers.

But isn't the money angle REALLY restricting you, here? I mean, without taking In Dept or even a positive quality, you've just blown almost all your cash on the Synaptic boosters.

[Nifft]

But isn't the money angle REALLY restricting you, here? I mean, without taking In Dept or even a positive quality, you've just blown almost all your cash on the Synaptic boosters.

I don't think there's any easy way to get +3 IPs at chargen, and I think this is a good thing.

You're either investing a ton of ¥ or you're investing 4 PP worth of Magic.

(... or you bind a Force 4 Spirit of Man, but let's not talk about that right now ...)

[LurkerOutThere]

The laternative for combat hacker is going the ware route, encephelon and move by wire gives you more power when you can afford to go full VR and more versatility in the meat world. Additionally it means you don't find most of your stuff shutting off when you hit background count. If you get an internall link your stuff can never be taken away. Remove a adept hackers link or even his trodes and he/she cries like a little girl.

[sabs]

put a headjammer on the hacker with an internal link and he's crying too.

[Tanegar]

This may be a completely insane idea, but I'm gonna throw it up against the wall and see if it sticks. What do you think of summoning a Task spirit and having it do the hacking? A spirit hacker would fit in very nicely with the urban shaman concept that's been kicking around in my head for three-quarters of forever.