War, HUH! It's out on pdf Options

[imperialus]

One other thing that I might point out is that War's power creep is largely focused on the mundane... It gives the non awakened PC's a chance to catch up to the spell slingers once they start skimming the upper edge of the power curve. Having played a few high karma games I think this fills an extremely important niche.

[Inncubi]

Hmmm interesting to see they finally started taking alook at Bogotá. I'm form here, and during the early 2000 late 90's some friends of mine published in the internet an unofficial reference guide to Colombia's shadows. Seeing the resurgence now its interestng. I'd like to see how they portray the city in the book.

As a little background intel, what used to be the world's most dangerous neighborhood was only two... yes /two/ blocks away form the presidential home (think the White House: el Palacio de Nariño). It was called "El Cartucho". They were the Barrens on steriods as not even the military forces were willing to go in there.

Also in Soacha, one of the most dangerous places nowadays, they managed to have a higher violent death rate than Sarajevo when it was a full battle zone.

That is prime material for Shadowrun. That, and the guerrilas, paramilitaries and drug cartels vying for political power and the drug trade money.

Throw in Amazonia's and Aztlan's mojo, Jaguar guards and awakened dragons and you have one hell of a place.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

One other thing that I might point out is that War's power creep is largely focused on the mundane... It gives the non awakened PC's a chance to catch up to the spell slingers once they start skimming the upper edge of the power curve. Having played a few high karma games I think this fills an extremely important niche.

Yeah, rrright – read the Mind over Matter adept power.

And why having an item made from specifically more processed components to increase it's OR needs capacity is beyond me.

[hobgoblin]

Makes one wonder why not remove the "caps" and just let the money talk on the mundane gear. Sure, once it passes some marker or other the price would square or cube for each point increase. But the theoretical possibility to keep up would be there.

The other option is sota style rules, having the rating drop unless maintained.

[imperialus]

Yeah, rrright – read the Mind over Matter adept power.

Oh crap! Right you are... Umm... wow. That'll be entering the dustbin of "crap not allowed in Imp's game". I might allow it as a metamagic power... Maybe.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

I might allow it as a metamagic power...

That would be worse, actually.

Did anyone notice that the SoftWeave upgrade for 10% of the armor cost completely obsoletes the Mobility Upgrade from Arsenal? Yeah, right, you get some dice for Running… great. As for "High Power Ammo"… No, just No. This is a really sad day, with the inside joke about munchkins and gun nuts becoming RAW.

[Stormdrake]

Got it this morning and went over it. For the most part I am pretty happy but do have a question on this:

Redundant Process Manufacturing: uses the same manufacturing or refurbishing technique as the vehicle upgrade of the same name, in which the armor is subject to more processing than necessary. As a result, the armor’s Object Threshold is increased by the rating of the modification.

I may have missed something in the other books but what good does this do? If a mage is using a inderect combat spell (say Flame strike) does the mage need to overcome the OT of the targets armor to affect him?

[Rotbart van Dain...]

No, this is for Direct Combat Spells and the like.

[Dahrken]

It won't help against indirect spells, as those don't target the armor but rather the environment around it.

But it will help it against spells like Shatter, Analayze Device or Fashion (making an armored pant one-legged may sound dumb, but will drastically hamper the target's mobility) that directly interact with the item - mostly Direct Combat and Manipulation spells.

[imperialus]

As for "High Power Ammo"… No, just No. This is a really sad day, with the inside joke about munchkins and gun nuts becoming RAW.

Again though... Availability of 20F for the ammo, a threshold 20 weapon mod that doubles the cost of the weapon and takes up two slots, the inability to use "regular" ammo including explosive or flechette and finally a -2 dice pool modifier due to recoil seems to balance it out. Again this isn't something that a starting PC is going to have. Just judging from the availability and my personal experience He'll be getting his hands on a regular supply of HP rounds at around the same time the mage starts slinging F7 or 8 fireballs as a matter of course.

By that point your PC's are probably taking on Red Samurai units, Cyberzombies, and penetrating into MCT Zero-Zero zones for their paycheques anyhow. The ante's been upped.

I'm more scared of the AP Flechette rounds personally.

[Stormdrake]

How does this help a grunt wearing the armor against direct spells? Sorry, I may be missing something but direct spells bypass armor or are you saying that it will help agaisnt spells that target the armor and not the wearer?

[Dahrken]

Option 2 I think : it helps the armor against spells that target it, but not if they target the wearer.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

The ante's been upped.

It was upped before – is not like this mockery called HPA really needed to be.

I'm more scared of the AP Flechette rounds personally.

Those are worse indeed. Added fun about all those "flechette only" weapons.

[Stormdrake]

While there is some power increase I can accept it in military hardware and abilities. This simply plays to the idea that corporations and nations can always pull out bigger guns than the runners can ever hope for.

I really do like the Redundant Process Manufacturing modification as it makes drones and vehicles a heck of a lot harder for mages to kill.

As Atzlan and Amazonia are the ones throwing down I was surprised at the lack of magical insanity included in the game masters section. Was fully expecting some insane blood magic rituals.

[Mäx]

I really do like the Redundant Process Manufacturing modification as it makes drones and vehicles a heck of a lot harder for mages to kill.

Only if your stupid enough to try to wreck vehicles with direct combat spells, witch isn't exactly a good plan even with out that mod.

[bluedragon7]

Reading it feels strange, in the rules section the authors showed, they do not know the existing rules, sometimes even reinventing the wheel but just calling it different.
And other parts as well do not look like whoever designed it knew what he was doing.

The only thing i found so far i would consider good is the mechanics for large pool sizes, nice idea!

[Rotbart van Dain...]

I really do like the Redundant Process Manufacturing modification as it makes drones and vehicles a heck of a lot harder for mages to kill.

Did you see the cost? Basically, you can have an additional drone/vehicle out there for each level. Not worth it.

[Sengir]

Oh crap! Right you are... Umm... wow. That'll be entering the dustbin of "crap not allowed in Imp's game". I might allow it as a metamagic power... Maybe.

May I ask what prompts this ammount of "holy shit"?

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Let's just say this Adept Power gives the term "dump stat" a whole new meaning.

BTW: The Dragon Fly "mine" is great… for poor people living in the area – gather the mines without wearing metal and sell the six drones inside.

[Method]

I find it humorous that people are worried about "power creep" in a source book about military operations in the SR world. That kinda is the whole point.

Or perhaps we have forgotten all the bitching there was when Arsenal came out and people were crying "Wherez teh tanks?! I needz stats for tanks!!"

[Sengir]

Hmmm, what's the most ridiculous thing I can think of involving dumb stats...replace all physical stats with your magic rating?

[Stormdrake]

Did you see the cost? Basically, you can have an additional drone/vehicle out there for each level. Not worth it.

Yes you could have an additional drone in the field but the modification makes it nearly impossible for a mage to use illusion or manipulation spells on the drone. In a heavy magic conflict that addition makes up for not having that additional drone. After all if you can't find the mage or the troops he is covering what good is an extra drone?

A more simple application would be to use it on camera's or other sensors which would accomplish the same thing at a much lower price.

[Nath]

As a little background intel, what used to be the world's most dangerous neighborhood was only two... yes /two/ blocks away form the presidential home (think the White House: el Palacio de Nariño). It was called "El Cartucho".

Massachusetts Avenue in Washington DC is not the safest track in the US either (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
(been only once to Washington, in 1996, and the room was next to George Washington U. Hospital...)

[Rotbart van Dain...]

I find it humorous that people are worried about "power creep" in a source book about military operations in the SR world. That kinda is the whole point.

No, it's not.

Or perhaps we have forgotten all the bitching there was when Arsenal came out and people were crying "Wherez teh tanks?! I needz stats for tanks!!"

Tanks, sure. Big guns? Fine. Special purpose equipment and vehicles? Please.

Tossing aside the general rating scale, that included military stuff? Not so much. More powerful ammo? Please, no. Software that's either unnecessary or simply crazy? Archery-synchronizer, I'm looking at you.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Yes you could have an additional drone in the field but the modification makes it nearly impossible for a mage to use illusion or manipulation spells on the drone.

No, it doesn't for illusions, since Sensors have a seperate OR and there is no such mod for them.

A more simple application would be to use it on camera's or other sensors which would accomplish the same thing at a much lower price.

Just that is not possible.