Bows Options

[Doc Byte]

Forget the bow and use a bigger version of this crossbow! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lick.gif)

[hobgoblin]

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/w...le:Ballista.jpg

[Teryon]

At that point, Im reminded of Sgt.Detritus. Go ahead and name it the Piecemaker and be sure to have 'When Mr.Safety Catch is not on Mr.Siege Crossbow is not our friend' stenciled somewhere.

Mechanically, yeah firing that kind of rapid fire from a bow and arrow is more than a little ridiculous. Though considering the chinese managed to come up with an automatic crossbow, I dont see why you couldnt end up with a tech version. Ammo feed would be a pain in the ass though.

[hobgoblin]

Not just the chinese, ol' da Vinci had plans for such a "monster" (mostly a multi-shot bow, but with a reloader on hand i guess one could get it to fire "continuously").

[Janus]

Seeing how this is meant for single person operations:
it works with one bow and 2 arrows.
and why should it not?
a good bowyer can shoot up one arrow and shoot the first arrow out of the sky with a second arrow.

Only in the movies. I have several friends who are master bowyers and they laughed when I showed them this

You can if you leant Krav Maga(Arsenal, p. 157).
You have a readied arrow, and shoot it(a Simple Action), ready second arrow(a Free Action) and shoot it(a Simple Action).
So you will have two shots in same Action Phase.

Edit: the limitation is same Combat Turn(not Action Phase). So without Krav Maga, anyone with 2+ IP(by augmentation or bought with Edge) can do it.

[Tycho]

the really stupid thing about MRSI is, that it does not work with the wepons, for that it was created in RL. Howitzer and Heavy Motars cannot use MRSI because they dont fire 2 shots in one CR. So by RAW it only works with the redicoulos weapons like Bows an Grenate Launchers and not with the weapons it is intended for.

cya
Tycho

[Stahlseele]

What, no SA Artillery? O.o

[Dahrken]

With a tacnet, can you synchronise shoots from multiple interlinked MRSI equiped weapons, thus bypassing the CR problem ?

[Medicineman]

What, no SA Artillery? O.o

No,MRSI works only when you can Fire both Arrows in the same Round !
An Adept with Quickdraw f.E. might be a good Idea
I personally don't like Krav Maga for Bows because that Martial Arts is for Pistols or SMGs (Maybe) but i won't be practised with Bows.
This kind of "Exploiting the Rules" leads to gluing a Monowhip to your Feet to get a Reach 3 Weapon

with an exploitation Dance
Medicineman

[Tycho]

bows have no problem, if you have 2 or more IPs (other methode Quicktraw, Krav Maga works as well).

but the heavy motar and the howitzer both state, that they can only fire 1shot every Round, so no MRSI usage possible...

cya
Tycho

[Quake]

It seems that 12P is not the highest damage a bow gets...

Bows have minimum Strength ratings that indicate the minimum Strength a character must have to use that weapon.

Strength rating is the first element in the "(STR Min +2)P" equation. This can go from 1 to 12 (see below).

Then we have the following :

Material science limits high-tech bows to a maximum Strength rating of 12. The maximum Damage Value an arrow fired from the bow can inflict is equal to the bow’s rating x1.5.

Bow's rating with maximum Strength rating = 12
Maximum damage = 12*1.5 = 18

A character with 12 STR does 12+2 = 14P damage

If you take explosive arrowheads, this becomes 15P. Add net hits, and you get up to 18P in total.

[Tycho]

It seems that 12P is not the highest damage a bow gets...



Strength rating is the first element in the "(STR Min +2)P" equation. This can go from 1 to 12 (see below).

Then we have the following :



Bow's rating with maximum Strength rating = 12
Maximum damage = 12*1.5 = 18

A character with 12 STR does 12+2 = 14P damage

If you take explosive arrowheads, this becomes 15P. Add net hits, and you get up to 18P in total.

you dont have the right book....

in the final SR4A version Min STR is limited to 8.

cya
Tycho

[TheWanderingJewe...]

WAR! has a piece of MRSI(Multiple Rounds Simoultanous Impact) Software.
It does exactly what it says on the Label. Works in RL with Artillery.
In Shadowrun it works with Artillery and Grenade Launchers.
And it specifically mentions, that it works with Bow and Arrow too.

hmm missed that one. That sounds like a sophisticated Time On Target Attack Assist Software

[Stahlseele]

Basically, it is something that a smartlink should have been capable since SR1 . .
It's more or less simple mathmatics

[InfinityzeN]

That is exactly right, it is sophisticated Time on Target Attack Assist Software.

Oh, and bows in SR4A are limited to a max strength of 8.

[Quake]

you dont have the right book....

in the final SR4A version Min STR is limited to 8.

cya
Tycho

How do you access that version ? My version shows 12, not 8. How come there is no errata ? I'm surprised to say the least.

[shon]

Its actually better than that when comparing it to hardened armour: a lot better. That bow kills spirits like a knife though butter

Can anybody explain why bows are better on hardened armour? I mean better than a normal weapon dealing the same DV?

[Tycho]

@Quake:

You must have the beta pdf of the SR4A Book, because there it was 12 but they changed it in the final pdf and the print, irrc.

cya
Tycho

[Hida Tsuzua]

Can anybody explain why bows are better on hardened armour? I mean better than a normal weapon dealing the same DV?

The reason why is that for most firearms, a major source of damage is firing Burst Fire or Full Auto mode. This can increase your damage by +2 to +9. However, this bonus damage doesn't help to pierce hardened armor. So while a bow doing 12P damage pierces hardened armor 11 or below, an AK-97 firing a long burst doing 12P -1AP can only pierce hardened armor 7 or below. This is because 5 of the AK-97's damage is from the long burst which doesn't factor into getting though hardened armor.

Edit- Fixed grammar

[shon]

The reason why is that for most firearms, a major source of damage is firing Burst Fire or Full Auto mode. This can increase your damage by +2 to +9. [...]

Thanks! I knew I was missing something

[Doc Byte]

With a tacnet, can you synchronise shoots from multiple interlinked MRSI equiped weapons, thus bypassing the CR problem ?

Battleships have done so for decades without any computer (in the modern meaning) at all. They fired up to 4 main turrets (with 2 or 3 barrels each) simultaneously at the same target. Sure, they hit more of an area than a single spot but it was sufficiently accurate to hit a ship with several grenades of a full broadside once they got the range. They could even unite the fire of multiple ships.

Should be no problem in SR.

[KarmaInferno]

Yeah, "Time on Target" used to mean some guys bent over charts calculating firing solutions very quickly. With slide rules.

I find it hard to believe Smartlinks are incapable of this all by themselves.

I could understand if they'd written it from the out-of-game perspective of "Most Shadowrunners don't need these tactics in their day to day lives, but here's some new rules if you want to feature this in your games". But making it actual "new technology" is a little silly.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)




-k

[Yerameyahu]

Well, the problem is the way armor works. Regardless of the intent here, this *shouldn't* be any more effective against armor, damage resistance, ItnW, etc., and it almost certainly *should* apply the multiple attacks defender penalty. I'd let it all stack for Knockdown, though. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Draco18s]

Yeah, "Time on Target" used to mean some guys bent over charts calculating firing solutions very quickly. With slide rules.

Hey. Slide rules are awesome.
*Has one, not that he uses it*

[Cain]

Hey. Slide rules are awesome.
*Has one, not that he uses it*

Even I've retired mine. And I did use it.