Bows Options

[Stahlseele]

Wait . . if this does indeed work then . .
does something like this work too?

[Fatum]

Of course. And all the arrows strike the target at the same time, doing... what, 72P?

[Mardrax]

Just remember to divide dp per arrow, and don't forget the multiple target penalty either. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Stahlseele]

Shooting them all at one Target means 72P Damage and no multiple targets either though O.o

[Kronk2]

Wait . . if this does indeed work then . .
does something like this work too?

Well its possible to do up to 3 on a line, beyond that is just silly. And you can hit multiple targets, but aiming gets hard for all. i would apply the multiple targets penalty to all 3 arrows. I might award a die if edge was spent, for being awesome. I mean this is what combat pool was for.

[Yerameyahu]

On the contrary, Edge is *for* being awesome, if they want that die. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Seth]

I suppose, I figure if you ARE going to attempt MRSI, then you better be taking aim at least once.

Massed archery fire: and I stress again by elite troops who are trained from birth managed to accomplish these sorts of rates: about 1 ever 2 or 3 shadowrun rounds. They don't aim. They fire into the middle of the pack. Aiming takes time, and probably costs you 1 or 2 arrows per minute

[KarmaInferno]

On the contrary, Edge is *for* being awesome, if they want that die. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I propose we re-name Edge dice to Awesome dice.

Anyone second?





-k

[Doc Chase]

I propose we re-name Edge dice to Awesome dice.

Anyone second?





-k

Seconded.

"Burning one to be completely Awesome."

[ProfGast]

Massed archery fire: and I stress again by elite troops who are trained from birth managed to accomplish these sorts of rates: about 1 ever 2 or 3 shadowrun rounds. They don't aim. They fire into the middle of the pack. Aiming takes time, and probably costs you 1 or 2 arrows per minute

Mm a couple things. "Elite troops" simply means an archery rating of 4, 5 or 6. 7 would be people like Perseus, Yoichi, or other such legendary figures. not that difficult to achieve all told for a SR character.

Secondly. They do aim. My example wasn't a speculation off of aftermaths of a battle or anything like that
My example is based off of the rate of fire of a single man, who holds the record for most arrows fired in a 24 hr period as part of a competition. His aim clearly did suffer as a result of firing 9 shots a minute, but he still managed an accuracy of roughly 5 shots per minute, averaged over the course of 24 hrs. These numbers are not a matter of speculation, or guesswork. The man fired over 13000 arrows at a target (that's aimed) and hit over 8000 times. This was recorded. His fire rate was 9/min averaged over 24 hrs. My count did a little bit of adjusting upwards, but that's because I feel personally if you only have to fire for a minute at a time, you can probably fire faster than you could given a sustained 24 hr rate. I don't think that's unreasonable.

And yes, the man does hold a record for the Toshiya competition. I realize this. But just because he's "elite of the elite" doesn't mean a Shadowrunner can't match his skill.

[Yerameyahu]

That's still 1 shot per 2 SR4 turns, even fudging in favor of faster.

[ProfGast]

That's still 1 shot per 2 SR4 turns, even fudging in favor of faster.

Aye, and that's unaugmented. In my other post I demonstrated how 2-3 shots per combat turn were possible with full IP augmentation.

[Draco18s]

And the Time To Target is still less than that, so you're never going to get two shots to hit at the same time.

[Yerameyahu]

Indeed: can you think of a more massive waste of IP investment? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Stahlseele]

Still.
This is Shadowrun.
It's either a Troll or an Adept(either way, it's magic) using a smartlinked bow with special software(either way, it's technobabbel) to do it.
And the book(as bad as it is) clearly states: it - does - work - with - bows.

[Yerameyahu]

So we've learned a valuable lesson about trusting strange new books.

[Stahlseele]

even if they have candy.
especially if they have candy.

[Mardrax]

Rate of fire depends vastly on the type of bow used, the way arrows are kept/held and the use of a thumbring. Agincourt-style longbows are not meant for speed. They're meant for great power/distance.
Composite recurves are. They known for reaching an RoF approaching 1 arrow per 1.5 seconds in the hands of an expert user. On target. That firing rate justifies readying and firing an arrow in a simple action, based off real world results.
If you're going to be doing the reality thing, which tends to conflict with RAW and game balance, at least use numbers that have any bearing on the subject matter.

The video linked on the previous page shows you an expert recurve bowman in action if you want a source.
This one does a proper job as well in the second section of the video, about 1m20 in. He's a tad slow, but he's obviously done nocking long before the target's thrown with each arrow.

[Doc Chase]

Just make sure the arrowheads are made out of glass and tattoo "POOR IMPULSE CONTROL" on your forehead.

You'll be fine.

[Kronk2]

And the Time To Target is still less than that, so you're never going to get two shots to hit at the same time.

At under 150M I would agree with you, Outside of that, I would say totally doable.

[Yerameyahu]

Yeah, that thought occurred to me, but god forbid I suggest that something is unreasonable. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

If it ever comes up at my table, I think I'll say that it works for bows… using explosive tips, and only at long ranges.

[Kronk2]

On an added note: I have been watching many of these speed shooting demonstrations and most are done using bows under 50#s of draw weight, i wouldn't expect crazy high ROF with a 150 lb bow, but 3 shots in 5 seconds I could totally buy.

[Draco18s]

So we've learned a valuable lesson about trusting strange new books.

Especially ones that are blatant power creep.

At under 150M I would agree with you, Outside of that, I would say totally doable.

Oh, there I'll agree. But when was the last time that ShadowRun combat took place at 150 meters or greater?

So we've learned a valuable lesson about trusting strange new books.

Especially ones that don't tell you the minimum range necessary to perform these types of actions.

[Fatum]

Especially ones that are blatant power creep.

As if the runners are ever going to get their hands on all those toys (well, the ones that matter, anyway).

[Critias]

On an added note: I have been watching many of these speed shooting demonstrations and most are done using bows under 50#s of draw weight, i wouldn't expect crazy high ROF with a 150 lb bow, but 3 shots in 5 seconds I could totally buy.

Well, that depends entirely on your Strength score and how much work 150 pounds takes, doesn't it? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)