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> Designing a unique weapon.., Any idea how to create a sword-pistol?
Seidaku
post Mar 19 2004, 09:54 PM
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Just for fun, I'm trying to create Cervantes (from Soul Calibur) as a shadowrun character. Not having too much trouble with the stats (ghoul physad with ambidexterity and an emphasis on edged weapons), but I'm somewhat at a loss as to how to create his signature "pistol-sword." (the right hand sword in the image I linked to)

Any suggestions?

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DirkCjelli
post Mar 19 2004, 10:10 PM
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Cannon Companion has rules for creating custom firearms.

I would suggest taking the 'melee hardenned' advantage, and adding the cost of the closest sword (presumably, the katana) to the cost of melee hardenning a weapon.

I also feel that you should suffer an accuracy pentalty from firing something like a gun-sword. The bracelet gun has a -2 I think. The penalty is due to the funky non-pistol way of pointing and shooting.

A GM might allow a special 'martial-arts' manuver where one would fire the sword as one stabbed (I'd add +2 to the power of the stab and call it good) [again, more Cannon Companion fun]
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Herald of Verjig...
post Mar 19 2004, 10:11 PM
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Using CC rules, a custom variant of "melee hardening" that is at least double the normal costs plus the cost of a blade to attach.

The above only if the GM has approved the concept. The best time to implement that is when the GM has suggested the idea.
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gknoy
post Mar 20 2004, 12:08 AM
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QUOTE (DirkCjelli)
I also feel that you should suffer an accuracy pentalty from firing something like a gun-sword. The bracelet gun has a -2 I think. The penalty is due to the funky non-pistol way of pointing and shooting.

Actually, I'm not sure it would be all that hard to aim.

If you look at some of the old pistols (especiallt flemish horse-pistols), they had grips that were almost collinear with the blade. I imagine that a sword-pistol would probably have a similar shape. If you can point a flashlight, you can probably point a gun-sword. Let's face it, if I had a sword with a firearm built in, I'd probably want it to be something that is heavy-hitting, close range, as a "Surprise!" for whoever I'm fighting.

Lack of iron sights, and the nonstandard grip, yes ... I can see that as making it harder to shoot things at a distance. I think that a better way to solve that (than a +1 or +2 to TN) is to simply make the ranges smaller. Heck, why not simply say that it has hold-out ranges (since most holdouts are probably just as hard to aim), even if it's firing a 10 guage buckshot? :-) That's what I'd do.
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Adarael
post Mar 20 2004, 01:14 AM
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I'm with gknoy... Most 'pirate boarding daggers' as they were called didn't have a knife grip, but a pistol grip, for more accurate shooting. Why a pistol grip? Because a lot of Epees, Rapiers and the like already used bent-grip handles. Granted, until very late in the history of them, they were pretty crappy and prone to breaking. That wouldn't be the case in 2060, though, what with using refined metals and non-flintlock actions. <G>

I also agree with the +2 power to the melee attack if you had a manouver that let you shoot once you'd stabbed someone. That's the rule I came up with for a guy's palm-shotgun - do an open-hand attack and if you get at least 2 successes up before body, the shotgun goes off and adds +2 to the power for the Body roll.
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Kanada Ten
post Mar 20 2004, 03:26 AM
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There is a picture of a gun-sword on page 66 of Cyberpirates. It's a katana pistol with two handels, one pistol, and one sword handel with a special do-dad I assume is used to fire the gun when you have stabbed thine enemy.
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nezumi
post Mar 20 2004, 03:57 PM
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As long as we're on the topic, what about custom melee weapons, like sword-chucks?
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TheScamp
post Mar 20 2004, 04:06 PM
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And gopher chucks.
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Aidley
post Mar 20 2004, 04:23 PM
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sword-pistol..... isn't that rather like a bayonetted rifle?

do a google on WWI & WWII for more info.

<edit> moron me. looks like your more sorted than i am...
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A Clockwork Lime
post Mar 20 2004, 05:09 PM
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Bah. Lack of an ability to delete posts sucks.
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maneius
post Mar 20 2004, 07:26 PM
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QUOTE
As long as we're on the topic, what about custom melee weapons, like sword-chucks?


Nuklear Power?
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Herald of Verjig...
post Mar 20 2004, 08:25 PM
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Sword chucks:
reach of double that of the sword type used. (1*2=2, 2*2=4, but 0*2 ~= 1)
damage is the same as that of the sword type
if you fail to connect for any reason, you must resist (sword damage)
if you connect and kill the enemy with one hit, you must resist (half sword damage)
if you connect and don't kill the enemy, you must resist (number of failed dice)L
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maneius
post Mar 20 2004, 08:35 PM
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YOU CAN'T HOLD THE DAMM THINGS!
(Read NuklearPower.com)
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Herald of Verjig...
post Mar 20 2004, 08:47 PM
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The chain is unsharpened.
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Foreigner
post Mar 20 2004, 08:59 PM
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Seidaku:

Believe it or not, what you propose is not a new idea.

The U.S. Navy experimented with such a concept in the 1830s.

The weapon was called the "Elgin cutlass pistol", and was made in Massachusetts.

It was a single-shot, .36-caliber percussion ("cap-and-ball") weapon with a Bowie-style knife blade mounted under the barrel--the blades were usually 6 to 10 inches in length, measured from the pistol's muzzle.

Some versions had a handguard like a traditional cutlass, designed to protect the fingers of the user's shooting hand if he were using a sword or other bladed weapon in his free hand.

The weapons were intended for use by U.S. Navy personnel, in close-combat situations--which, in that day, usually meant they would either be used to (a) repel boarders or (b) by members of a boarding party.

As most pistols in that day were single-shots (COL. Sam Colt didn't market his first commercially successful revolver, the so-called "Texas Paterson", until 1836, and it was made in very small numbers), the idea was to give the user a weapon with which to defend himself once the pistol barrel was discharged.

Here's a link to show you what an Elgin cutlass pistol looked like:

http://www.ken-drake.com/

This is just a suggestion, mind you, but I think what you're looking for would be a more modern (i.e., 2060s) interpretation-- perhaps a burst-fire pistol with a folding blade (a mono-wakizashi, maybe?) under the barrel, or something of the sort?

--Foreigner
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Seidaku
post Mar 20 2004, 11:37 PM
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Hmm.. how does this sound, as a possible way of achieving the goal:

A top-mounted weapon accessory that adds something like -2 to concealability, but also allows the gun to be used in melee as a (STR)L edged weapon (reach 0)?
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John Campbell
post Mar 21 2004, 12:05 AM
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Genius! We could call it.... a bayonet!
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Mr. Man
post Mar 21 2004, 02:44 AM
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Sword gun, eh? Didn't Final Fantasy VIII do this first?

I haven't played the game, but always wondered what the hell was up with this weapon...
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Herald of Verjig...
post Mar 21 2004, 03:04 AM
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The popularization is mostly due to FF8, but the premise was originally from the days of muzzle loaded weapons.

When you were in a combat zone and could only get one shot off, you could either drop the now useless gun or alter the design so it has a melee use.

I've also seen pistol-hammers and pistol-axes where the barrel of the gun served as the handle of the axe/hammer.
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RedmondLarry
post Mar 21 2004, 03:30 AM
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You can also try Lazamataz's Hell Glock.
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maneius
post Mar 21 2004, 04:38 PM
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:eek: Is that a mock up, or just a bunch of photos stuck together? :eek:
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Austere Emancipa...
post Mar 21 2004, 05:03 PM
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Photoediting. And really bad quality. Looks almost as ridiculous as anime-style gunblades.
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maneius
post Mar 21 2004, 05:09 PM
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Thought so.
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RedmondLarry
post Mar 21 2004, 07:11 PM
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But it is one of the best 9mm, 50 caliber, 12 gauge art pieces in its class.
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maneius
post Mar 21 2004, 07:25 PM
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Correction: only
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