You crashed my icon!, Consequences of cybercombat Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[Mr Clock]

Cybercombat ensues, the runner defeats the security op, crashing his persona with a vanilla Attack program.

Does the security op simply restart his persona in (System) combat turns? If he has a backup system already running but not online in the node, how quickly could he get back in the fight?

Are there any programs or options to do some lasting damage to the security op, aside from going Black?

[TheOOB]

That is kind of the point of going black. The worst attack can do is crash the node the persona is running on, and then it can just be rebooted. Off the top of my head I think it will cause some dumpshock if they were full VR.

But in any case, attack is for IC and nodes, really runners use black programs on white hats.

[BishopMcQ]

You can also do things like delete the User Log and force all of the authorized users to start hacking the system, Add yourself as the only authorized user, then unleash the System's IC on the security team.

This obviously takes time, so if they are jumping right back on top of you, it's a little late--but if you have Agents or Sprites that can handle one task while you do the other, there are possibilities.

[CanRay]

I'm in ur nexus, haxxorzing ur IC. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Epicedion]

Cybercombat ensues, the runner defeats the security op, crashing his persona with a vanilla Attack program.

Does the security op simply restart his persona in (System) combat turns? If he has a backup system already running but not online in the node, how quickly could he get back in the fight?

Are there any programs or options to do some lasting damage to the security op, aside from going Black?

If the spider is running VR, they'll take dumpshock and might be a little shy about logging right back in.

[CanRay]

Or going to the office water cooler with puke on their shoes.

[PoliteMan]

You can also do things like delete the User Log and force all of the authorized users to start hacking the system, Add yourself as the only authorized user, then unleash the System's IC on the security team.

This obviously takes time, so if they are jumping right back on top of you, it's a little late--but if you have Agents or Sprites that can handle one task while you do the other, there are possibilities.

Good suggestions.

Generally speaking, destroying an icon does nothing. If you want avoid black software altogether, um... viruses can get purged, software can be reloaded, you're kinda stuck.

I'm not sure why you want to avoid black software though. Blackout does Stun damage and if you need permanent effects, throw in some psychotropic options.

[Mr Clock]

Just curious, to be honest. Thanks for the suggestion, Bishop.

To clarify part of my question: how quickly does one move in the Matrix? I'm thinking of how quickly a user can transition between nodes, follow a trail of private links and suchlike. Say if you got kicked out of your security network, you want to get back in to take that hacker out, first you log in on the main desk, then follow the hidden link to the operator suite where your programs are, then another hidden link to drop you back into the system. All connections have to verify your access ID before you can pass - how long would it take in actions or Initiative Phases?

[Epicedion]

Just curious, to be honest. Thanks for the suggestion, Bishop.

To clarify part of my question: how quickly does one move in the Matrix? I'm thinking of how quickly a user can transition between nodes, follow a trail of private links and suchlike. Say if you got kicked out of your security network, you want to get back in to take that hacker out, first you log in on the main desk, then follow the hidden link to the operator suite where your programs are, then another hidden link to drop you back into the system. All connections have to verify your access ID before you can pass - how long would it take in actions or Initiative Phases?

Pretty much every action you can do is listed as Free, Simple, or Complex already, which answers the question of how long it takes. Either that or they have an extended test with a duration handy. For example, logging onto a node (assuming you know where it is) requires a Complex action. So you can assume that for someone in hot sim VR, they can log onto a node and then do two other actions in that node in one combat turn (~3 seconds). In AR, they have to spend their 3 seconds typing in the address. Verifications and whatnot all pretty well move in the speed of NOW.

In your example if you have to bounce through three nodes, it'll take you a turn or three. Log onto the main node, log onto the attached node from the main node. Spend X complex actions to load your programs. Log onto the node where the trouble's going down.

Let's say your white hat is operating in cold sim.
Turn 1: log onto main node, log onto attached node
Turn 2: load attack, load armor
Turn 3: load analyze, load stealth
Turn 4: load track, log onto hacked node

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Pretty much every action you can do is listed as Free, Simple, or Complex already, which answers the question of how long it takes. Either that or they have an extended test with a duration handy. For example, logging onto a node (assuming you know where it is) requires a Complex action. So you can assume that for someone in hot sim VR, they can log onto a node and then do two other actions in that node in one combat turn (~3 seconds). In AR, they have to spend their 3 seconds typing in the address. Verifications and whatnot all pretty well move in the speed of NOW.

In your example if you have to bounce through three nodes, it'll take you a turn or three. Log onto the main node, log onto the attached node from the main node. Spend X complex actions to load your programs. Log onto the node where the trouble's going down.

Let's say your white hat is operating in cold sim.
Turn 1: log onto main node, log onto attached node
Turn 2: load attack, load armor
Turn 3: load analyze, load stealth
Turn 4: load track, log onto hacked node

Of course, this could all be accomplished in a Single, 3 Second Turn by a competant Hacker with optimal Gear, with a pass to spare even. Even a Character using AR can do so in 1 Turn, properly augmented. Not to mention that IC can be there even faster, since their programs are already loaded. Not to mention the use of Suite style programs to cut the load time even further.

[CanRay]

I'm not sure why you want to avoid black software though. Blackout does Stun damage and if you need permanent effects, throw in some psychotropic options.

"He's coming around, sir!" "About time! What happened in there? REPORT!" "Dude... Your head, is, like, totally a toaster." "That's not the report I was expecting." "FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINGERSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!"

[Mr Clock]

Off topic but it's my thread, so meh:

Can a sprite do Assist Operation and Sustain Complex Form at the same time? I've been looking at twinking dice pools (reading Unwired).

[CanRay]

Slightly more on-topic, would a naval officer who just saw his seaman decker/hacker who has a ship for an icon fall into dumpshock be allowed to official put in his report, "They sunk my Battleship."?

[sabs]

You know, if I'm a Naval Officer and I see the guy in charge of Operational Security of the computer systems for my Destroyer go into dumpshock? I'm panicking.

I'm cutting over to manual controls, and manual fire mode. I might even be initiating emergency rebooting of the command nexus.

[CanRay]

No, the Hacker's Icon is that of a Battleship. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Not as strange an idea as you might, considering the "ships" the US Navy Tenth Fleet gets.

[TheOOB]

Well, if you really want to deal with that white hat, you need to take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

[CanRay]

So, moral of the story is that Shadowrunners should never take any job that involves the UCAS Navy's Tenth Fleet. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Mr Clock]

Enough with the boats, on with the show!

Inquiring minds need to know: can a sprite perform two tasks simultaneously, such as Assist Operation and Sustain Complex Form? If not, why not?

[sabs]

Because Sprites are broken and stupid and already way too good?

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Because Sprites are broken and stupid and already way too good?

You probably believe that about Spirits too... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[CanRay]

Sprites are probably Light Spirits that got trapped in the Fiber Optics.

[BishopMcQ]

Critters can sustain a number of powers equal to their Magic or Resonance Rating. I'd say that without a specific rule to the contrary, a Sprite could maintain a number of different powers equal to their Rating. I believe the FAQ has ruled that a Sprite cannot use the Assist Operation multiple times concurrently (primarily to avoid the doubling or tripling of rating on a single CF) but different tasks should be allowed. As always, talk to your GM before trying tomfoolery.

[CanRay]

GMs, remember, you can use a Rolled Up Newspaper to train your players.

Rules Lawyers might require the lead pipe be inside the Newspaper to learn 'em proper like.

[Mr Clock]

FYI, I am the GM for this particular. Rules Lawyers will flee before me! But I need to know the ins and outs as my SO is playing the TM. Ho ho ho.

[Makki]

Inquiring minds need to know: can a sprite perform two tasks simultaneously, such as Assist Operation and Sustain Complex Form? If not, why not?

I thought, that's what sprites are for?