Why did Dunkelzahn need Matrix 2.0? Options

[Smirnov]

I've been thinking a bit. Big D is somewhat responsible for the first Crash with all that Roxborough story. His will, as pointed out in Street Legends, made possible for Villier to crash Fuchi. At the same time he gave Dankwalther money, which contributed to the eventual Novatech IPO and led to second Crash. Also, if I'm not mistaken, Dunkezahn's instructions to Draco Foundation go up till 2064. Is it just a coincidence, or all that was part of the dragons plan? And if yes, why did Dunkelzahn need Matrix 2.0 (obviously it was the main consequence of the Crash)?

[CanRay]

We'll find out when we see what in the final instructions he gave The Draco Foundation: "Now open envelope #2, you can find it in my sock drawer at my house in..."

[Smirnov]

I hope it's not 'write three letters'

[Mardrax]

(obviously it was the main consequence of the Crash)?

I'd say the absence of godmodding AI is the main consequence of Crash 2.0. YMMV though.

[CanRay]

Dunkie set up the dominoes and they fell either like he expected, or exactly like he didn't. Might have explained a certain Vice President's disappearance either way.

[LurkerOutThere]

I believe the whole point of Art Dankwalther is he was an unexpected consequence, barely worthy of mention by Dunkelzahn but having far reaching effects.

The game world would loose a lot of it's fun value if the Dragon's could see the future perfectly.

[Ascalaphus]

I'm getting this Foundation vibe here...

[Blade]

Even if we were sure he needed a crash 2.0, we can't be sure of why, because maybe it's for something that will (or won't) happen in a thousand years.

But if you want to keep thinking about it, you might like to take a look at the circumstances of the first crash too...

[raben-aas]

OR! .... He didn't have fucking clue since he's an old dragon, not a Matrix designer!

[Lansdren]

I do seem to remember some shadow talk from the big D saying something along the lines of "technology might be something to give humanity the edge this time round against the horrors if they have the time to prepare"

I'm really really putting words in his virtual mouth here but that was the gist I was given,

Given how big D was all about the long game and wanting to spank the horrors when ever he could it does seem to fall into line that he might if he could push the tech side of things further through other people just like he pushed magical side of things himself in small ways.

[Blade]

The thing is that there was no need for the Crash 2.0 to get the Matrix 2.0. Work on a wireless matrix was already in place before and it would have arrived anyway.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

The thing is that there was no need for the Crash 2.0 to get the Matrix 2.0. Work on a wireless matrix was already in place before and it would have arrived anyway.

But perhaps it would take longer to implement it everywhere. Scale comparisons aside, it is the same thing with changing IPv4 to IPv6. It's been taking years to gradually change it in every computer of the planet and it is just a simple change. IF the internet somehow collapsed and we had to build it from the ground, then IPv6 would already be the default implementation.

[Smirnov]

OR! .... He didn't have fucking clue since he's an old dragon, not a Matrix designer!

Of course, he was no Matrix designer, but he was an avid fan of technology, mass media and stuff. And Celedyr is quite fond of matrix too. And you don't need to be a technical engineer to predict the Crash and see that something new would rise from the ashes.

The idea about Deus is intriguing, haven't thought about that.

[LurkerOutThere]

Of course, he was no Matrix designer, but he was an avid fan of technology, mass media and stuff. And Celedyr is quite fond of matrix too. And you don't need to be a technical engineer to predict the Crash and see that something new would rise from the ashes.

The idea about Deus is intriguing, haven't thought about that.

Except no one saw the crash coming, otherwise the crash wouldn't have happened. There's just too many moving pieces to the what happened at the crash for anyone to predict it. The other alternative that it's just one more level of Magicrun in the setting is even less palatable.

That's not to say you couldn't predict A crash happening, just to presume the Novatech IPO, the Jorgumand Worm, and all the emp strikes that precipitated the crash would be the cause and the intimate that D set them in motion is falling afoul of Iluminati/Batman hand waving story telling. I think the actual material backs me up that what happened with the crash was damn near unprecedented.

[Smirnov]

Lowfyr did see it happen - he switched whole S-K off the Matrix. And Horizon was tooquick to seize to moment, which was mentioned in Corporate book.

[LurkerOutThere]

Lowfyr did have a plan in place for a cascading matrix failure. For all we know that plan might have involved a case of shotguns and the major fiber trunks with a redline to essen, that's not nearly the same thing as him knowing when he woke up that morning that he'd need to shut off the euro grids.

In fact some of the only reason that plan even worked is a few of the egg nests in europe had already been dealt with.

How quick is too quick?

[Ascalaphus]

Horizon's servers were conveniently offline for "upgrades" at the time it all happened; after the Crash happened, they were one of the first ones up, which gave them a great competitive advantage.

It *could* be a coincidence of course, but it smells funny.

[Draco18s]

Consider for a moment that Big D didn't want Matrix 2.0 or even that he really wanted Crash 2.0 but that he wanted sentient AIs, but not ones like Deus or Mirage. That is, little baby AIs and not giant digital gods. As came up in another thread, an AI is largely immune to the primary powers of the horrors.

So the best way to have gone about killing dues but at the same time giving rise to AIs, is to--essentially--cause a network war between the Big Boys (Mirage, Deus, and Megaera) that results in mutually assured destruction (and as a side effect, Crash 2.0) and the scattered remnants of sentience giving rise to smaller, less powerful, more benign AI programs.

(In my own defense, "That's even dumber than the first one!").

[CanRay]

Lowfyr did see it happen - he switched whole S-K off the Matrix.

Or he remembered reading something about Crash 1.0, and thought, "You know, it might be a good idea to have a plan in case this happens again."

Lowfyr did have a plan in place for a cascading matrix failure. For all we know that plan might have involved a case of shotguns and the major fiber trunks with a redline to essen, that's not nearly the same thing as him knowing when he woke up that morning that he'd need to shut off the euro grids.

Lowfyr probably has more Zombie Plans than the UCAS/CAS Government combined.

In his head.

Before breakfast.

[Bigity]

Maybe D didn't want Matrix 2.0 or AIs, but non-fading Technomancers.

[Draco18s]

Maybe D didn't want Matrix 2.0 or AIs, but non-fading Technomancers.

Possible. Although I never did understand how otaku + crash 2.0 = technos. Even in a pseudoscience "it's magic!" way. There's no detail, just kinda "it was A, then B happened, now it's C." E.g. no cause and effect relationship, just coincidental timing.

[Bigity]

Maybe it was going to some blended technology/magic thingy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

I kid, I kid

[Draco18s]

Maybe it was going to some blended technology/magic thingy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

I kid, I kid

Technos have to be partly magical, afterall, they can be assensed....

[CanRay]

Possible. Although I never did understand how otaku + crash 2.0 = technos. Even in a pseudoscience "it's magic!" way. There's no detail, just kinda "it was A, then B happened, now it's C." E.g. no cause and effect relationship, just coincidental timing.

Technos have to be partly magical, afterall, they can be assensed....

The potato battery that has an AI in it that Kane would love as a pet can be assensed. It just means their aura is all fragged up. Drug addicts show up the same way. PersonaFixed People, same deal.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Technos have to be partly magical, afterall, they can be assensed....

Well, I have to disagree with that sentiment... Normals can be assensed as well, does not make them Magical in any way, shape OR form.