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#1
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 234 Joined: 13-December 10 Member No.: 19,226 ![]() |
My mage developed the spell after a friends daughter lost part of her leg. Rather than see her lose her burgeoning magic to cyber, or the family put under the strain of massive medical bills for clone replacement.
My GM has given tentative approval, both because of good story factor and that my mage has an Arcana skill of 7 specialized in spell design. Regrowth Type: P Range: T Duration: P DV: (F/2)+7 This spell allows the caster to regrow lost limbs or repair significant organ damage on a target. It cannot repair fatal damage. Nor can it cause the removal of cyberware. Essence lost is unaffected. The threshold determines what extent of damage can be healed. The strain of the regeneration causes a number of boxes of stun equal to twice the number of hits that were originally needed to regrow the body part. This stun cannot overflow into physical damage but may knock the patient out. CODE Hits Effect Time 1 Minor damage 5 Minutes to 2 hours (Fingers, toes, ear, cosmetic regeneration) 2 Moderate damage 3 Hours (Hand, foot etc...) 3 Severe damage 2 to 4 Days (Entire limbs, complex organs like the eye or Kidney. 5+ Near Fatal damage 3 to 6 Days (Major organs, liver, lung, heart damage) CODE Force Effect -4 Limb available to reattach -1 Accident happened less than an hour ago +0 Accident happened between 1 hour and 1 day +1 Accident happened between 1 day and 1 week +3 Accident happened between 1 week and 1 month +5 Accident happened over 1 month Edited for the thread results
Reason for edit: Corrected Title
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#2
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Validating Posts: 132 Joined: 10-November 10 From: San Diego, Aztlan Member No.: 19,165 ![]() |
How does force factor in to the spell's effect? It seems like you could just cast this at force 1 without sacrificing anything. Is there any actual benefit to casting it at a higher force?
Additionally, it seems like this is a very powerful spell in that it negates the need for cloned replacement limbs or cyberlimbs. As such, there should be some challenge associated with using or acquiring the spell. Can the spell be cast on a target only once per "set of wounds"? Does the spell heal all parts of the body that have been affected (for instance, if the subject is missing an arm, a hand, and some toes, and the caster gets 3+ net hits, do all of the subject's missing parts come back, or what?) How does the spell affect the subject's condition monitors? I think my biggest concern with introducing a spell like this into a game would be that it makes cyber and cloned limb replacements basically obsolete. There should be a price to pay, either nuyen or essence, for losing a limb. What are the drawbacks to the spell? If there aren't any, then it's too powerful. |
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#3
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 268 Joined: 2-September 11 Member No.: 37,159 ![]() |
How does force factor in to the spell's effect? It seems like you could just cast this at force 1 without sacrificing anything. Is there any actual benefit to casting it at a higher force? Additionally, it seems like this is a very powerful spell in that it negates the need for cloned replacement limbs or cyberlimbs. As such, there should be some challenge associated with using or acquiring the spell. Can the spell be cast on a target only once per "set of wounds"? Does the spell heal all parts of the body that have been affected (for instance, if the subject is missing an arm, a hand, and some toes, and the caster gets 3+ net hits, do all of the subject's missing parts come back, or what?) How does the spell affect the subject's condition monitors? I think my biggest concern with introducing a spell like this into a game would be that it makes cyber and cloned limb replacements basically obsolete. There should be a price to pay, either nuyen or essence, for losing a limb. What are the drawbacks to the spell? If there aren't any, then it's too powerful. I gotta agree, I see several problems with this spell. First off, essence can't be created from mana. If it could all those essence hungry critters out there would likely have evolved to just suck up mana and convert it. So if the spell is going to restore her essence then the essence will have to come from something (or someone) else just like it does for every other essence "restoration". This leads to the second problem: Whenever one creature takes essence from another creature the stolen essence will fade over time requiring the creature to seek out more. So if this spell works, while the limb it regrows may be permanent, the essence would fade over time and she'd need to repeat the spell to restore it again... ergo you'd be turning her into a vampire of sorts. Which is the third problem: Once you get into Essence exchange you're essentially delving into Blood Magic - a very dark and dangerous place to go. Recall the old saying "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" Finally (I couldn't come up with another semi-clever segway) if this worked, even without the essence, half the corps in the world be after you to keep you from destroying the limb-replacement industry while the other half would be after you to buy the spell for resale (and then probably kill you after to avoid copyright issues). Though, really, with an Arcana of 7 I'm kind of surprised the magic dealing corps aren't already sending shadow teams to "recruit" you. |
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#4
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 234 Joined: 13-December 10 Member No.: 19,226 ![]() |
QUOTE How does force factor in to the spell's effect? It seems like you could just cast this at force 1 without sacrificing anything. Is there any actual benefit to casting it at a higher force? Hits are capped by force, so you'll need at least a force equal to the threshold. QUOTE Additionally, it seems like this is a very powerful spell in that it negates the need for cloned replacement limbs or cyberlimbs. As such, there should be some challenge associated with using or acquiring the spell. As it stands now replacement limbs only require money, time and is more of a nuisance than anything. Imagine the cost of a mage casting this spell. QUOTE Can the spell be cast on a target only once per "set of wounds"? Does the spell heal all parts of the body that have been affected (for instance, if the subject is missing an arm, a hand, and some toes, and the caster gets 3+ net hits, do all of the subject's missing parts come back, or what?) As with normal curative magic it is once per set of wounds, and may only be cast once per wound. QUOTE How does the spell affect the subject's condition monitors? It doesn't. This is not a curative spell, it was designed to fix the secondary effects of wounds. QUOTE I think my biggest concern with introducing a spell like this into a game would be that it makes cyber and cloned limb replacements basically obsolete. There should be a price to pay, either nuyen or essence, for losing a limb. What are the drawbacks to the spell? If there aren't any, then it's too powerful. This spell was designed for medical mages in areas where clonal replacments or decent cyberware are rare. Like a shadowrun team in a hideout or in the barrens. Most people will find it easier to still take the time and money to go to the hospital for mundane replacements. |
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#5
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Target ![]() Group: Members Posts: 51 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Europe Member No.: 17,956 ![]() |
I think this is good spell.
However, I am sure that you need to mention that it doesn't cure any Essence loss (otherwise it will be abused). |
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#6
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,150 Joined: 15-December 09 Member No.: 17,968 ![]() |
I think the spell should be harder to succeed reliably. How about net hits are the new organ/limb's attributes (capped at the old limb's attribute ratings)? So sure you got your leg back, but you still don't jump so good ...
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#7
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,150 Joined: 15-December 09 Member No.: 17,968 ![]() |
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#8
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,899 Joined: 29-October 09 From: Leiden, the Netherlands Member No.: 17,814 ![]() |
I think you might want to move up the required hits per body part to be regenerated, to make sure that most mages need to overcast to heal serious damage. That way, only a handful of badass mages are comfortable using this spell, and the corporate market position won't be threatened too much by a cheaper alternative to cloned organs.
It might also be interesting to differentiate needed hits based on: * How long ago the injury occurred. * If the severed body part is available to reattach (makes it easier, can make it a fun sidequest to recover a lost arm because otherwise the spell is too hard to safely cast). If you fiddle with the numbers to keep it balanced, I think in principle the spell is good. |
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#9
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 234 Joined: 13-December 10 Member No.: 19,226 ![]() |
It might also be interesting to differentiate needed hits based on: * How long ago the injury occurred. * If the severed body part is available to reattach (makes it easier, can make it a fun sidequest to recover a lost arm because otherwise the spell is too hard to safely cast). I really like the idea. I'll have to see what I can do. |
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#10
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,190 Joined: 31-May 09 From: London, UK Member No.: 17,229 ![]() |
The Yakuza will love it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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#11
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 584 Joined: 15-April 06 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 8,466 ![]() |
I would probably make the regrowth take a number of weeks equal to the number of hits required for the body part. I don't think the intent is to have an instant TADAAA!!! here is your new leg.
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#12
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,019 Joined: 10-November 10 From: Annapolis Valley, Nova Scotia Member No.: 19,166 ![]() |
The Yakuza will love it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Ha. No. The Yakuza would enforce a strict "no regeneration" policy for failure, I think. Since the lost finger parts are from punishment. |
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#13
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Target ![]() Group: Members Posts: 95 Joined: 10-September 11 From: Lyon, FRANCE Member No.: 37,728 ![]() |
Yep, I'm sure there would be some thing like ths :
Yakuza boss : oh, you regenerate your finger ? Yakusa grunt : Hmmm .... well, you see .... Yakuza boss : Try regenerate your head now ... *slash* (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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#14
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
I think this is good spell. However, I am sure that you need to mention that it doesn't cure any Essence loss (otherwise it will be abused). Losing a Limb does not incur Essence Loss. Ever. Only replacing it with Cyber does that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) EDIT: Oops, Missed Aerospider's original Post on this subject. |
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#15
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 681 Joined: 23-March 10 From: Japan Member No.: 18,343 ![]() |
I agree I like it. I also like the idea of making it a little harder. Maybe adding a threshold of say 7 - Target's Essence. That way a cybered-up person becomes that much harder to regenerate. But an unmodified child is still pretty easy. All that this would do is change your chart from 'Hits' to 'Net hits'.
-D |
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#16
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Deus Absconditus ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,742 Joined: 1-September 03 From: Downtown Seattle, UCAS Member No.: 5,566 ![]() |
It seems okay in general, but I do question its necessity.
If a little girl loses a leg in 2011, it's tragic. In 2073, it's more of a "terrible accident" at worst, and at best, a minor inconvenience. She can have a new leg cloned from her tissue, force-grown to the right size, and reattached. Or she can buy an off-the-rack Type 0 leg. Or, if you're destitute, you can steal a leg from another little girl and attach it. I can understand it from the perspective of "I know a mage and he fixed my little girl because he knows healing magic." From a wider perspective, there are more commerically viable ways of attaching legs to little girls. |
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#17
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Advocatus Diaboli ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 ![]() |
On a magic-theory note: if regrowth takes weeks… what's the mage doing during that time? I think he'd have to be sustaining. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)
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#18
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,083 Joined: 13-December 10 From: Rotterdam, The Netherlands Member No.: 19,228 ![]() |
On a magic-theory note: if regrowth takes weeks… what's the mage doing during that time? I think he'd have to be sustaining. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif) Handwave it as needing x hours of attention from the mage per week? |
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#19
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
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#20
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Advocatus Diaboli ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 ![]() |
I'm just not sure magic works that way, that's all. Things are either instant, sustained, or permanent.
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#21
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
I'm just not sure magic works that way, that's all. So don't make it take weeks. Treat it like Standard Healing. Takes a few Turns and done. There is a reason there is no Regeneration spell currently. It can work, but you have to make the choice. Either it takes time, and should be maintained (sustained) or it is a Permanent Spell, and uses those rules. *shrug* |
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#22
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Advocatus Diaboli ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 ![]() |
But that results in insta-limbs, which I gathered they were trying to avoid here. And it *is* a permanent either way, just like Heal is.
I view this spell as largely flavor, because it relies on people even using the Advanced Wound rules in the first place. So I'm not too worried about balancing it. The services of a mage are expensive, so there's theoretically a fair balance between medical and magical treatment of these kinds of non-Damage wounds. |
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#23
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,899 Joined: 29-October 09 From: Leiden, the Netherlands Member No.: 17,814 ![]() |
Maybe instead make it a Metamagic that uses Ritual Spellcasting?
I like the general idea of magical regeneration, but I wouldn't want it to be a commercially sound alternative to biotech. Maybe components? Use Enchanting and reagents? Those are the typical ways to make magic-use expensive. |
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#24
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,083 Joined: 13-December 10 From: Rotterdam, The Netherlands Member No.: 19,228 ![]() |
I like the general idea of magical regeneration, but I wouldn't want it to be a commercially sound alternative to biotech. Maybe components? Use Enchanting and reagents? Those are the typical ways to make magic-use expensive. Hence my more extended-test proposal. Paying a mage for that ammount of time is expensive. |
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#25
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
But that results in insta-limbs, which I gathered they were trying to avoid here. And it *is* a permanent either way, just like Heal is. I view this spell as largely flavor, because it relies on people even using the Advanced Wound rules in the first place. So I'm not too worried about balancing it. The services of a mage are expensive, so there's theoretically a fair balance between medical and magical treatment of these kinds of non-Damage wounds. True... I can see that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) |
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