Security?, How do you handle it? Options

[thorya]

The Mages outpacing mundanes thread got me thinking about security systems in the game. We use several systems that are not directly from books, but seem to fit into the world, especially for countering mages and spirits. We use the existing security too. I've included a list of our homebrew security below. Does anyone have any other cool things they use? Not tweaks to the rules, but additional material that fits in the setting?

Magic Sensor and Locator- an array of glomoss patches is used with quick response light sensors to create a magic sensor. A miniature compact model can be used by drones to allow sensing of spirits and other astral figures as well as to detect sustained spells. A grid of these attached to a central computer system allows instant tracking and triangulation of a magic source or spell. (Note this assumes that glomoss responds with an intensity equal to the force and distance of the magic source, which may or may not be the case.)

Conducting Fog barrier- A small mister creates a fog of highly conducting microdroplets. Visual and ultra-sonic analyzers are used to assess anything moving through the fog and an individual must be broadcasting a security code or have previously entered one at a terminal that disarms the fog for a brief period. Sensor ratings for these systems vary from 4-6 and they include a Spatial Recognizer and audio enchancers. Depending upon the lighting conditions, ambient noise, and quality of the system, these sensors have a bonus of +2-6 to detect invisible individuals or concealed creatures because of the fog interacting with the individuals in unusual ways. If a threat is identified in the fog, a current is passed through the fog delivering 12S electrical damage to anyone inside.

One way Bulletproof, one way mirrors- Long rooms parallel to a hallways that has gates controlled from inside the room. Guards in the room can perform visual inspection and utilize scanners along the hallway. The guards are behind special polymer mirrors that allow them to see or fire into the hallway if necessary, but do not allow people in the hallway to see them (preventing spell casting and incurring a -6 blind fire penalty). The mirror acts as an Armor 8, Structure 9 barrier between themselves and the opposition. Additionally, the barrier is one way, providing only 1 armor in the opposite direction. Thus, guards can fire back easily if they need to. Guards communicate with people in the hallway using a speaker system and the doors are locked from the inside.

Dual Natured Pepper Spray-
Vector- Contact, Inhalation
Speed- 1 combat turn
Penetration- 0
Power: 5
Effect: Nausea, Disorientation
Made from dual natured chili peppers this spray can be used as normal pepper spray from a spray can or else dispersed in a cloud acting as an irritant causing watery eyes, a burning sensation wherever it touches and difficulty breathing. It also creates a corresponding effect on the astral plane that can affect spirits and astral mages. Spirits avoid exposure whenever possible. The spray settles on surfaces after being sprayed and contact with those surfaces can cause symptoms many hours after the initial dosing.
DNPS was designed as an anti-spirit counter measure, but has found many other uses. It is now tightly controlled because the difficulties it can raise for astral pursuit and astral forensics.

Bullet Analysis and Violence Suppression Systems- Originally designed as a security feature for subways to prevent terrorist attacks. These systems look like firesprinklers or standard camera set-ups, but actually contain sound and visual analysis programs. They track for the sounds of gun shots or explosions and quickly pinpoint the source of the violence and if the threat is considered real it disperses Narcojet or other "violence suppressants" in the area. Usually a physical command is necessary by a system overseer to authorize use of these systems suppressant systems, but some are automatic. They claim a high success rate and famously stopped a shooting at a New York airport the day before new year's, but have fallen out of favor due to their high false positive rate and the danger to children that their chemical response can pose.

Sage Security K-9 Team- A guard and dog team both of whom are using sage so that they can detect magic and are more alert in general. They may also be using other substances to increase alertness. Often they'll also be rocking out on Novacoke and/or Cram and have an injection of Nitro ready to go should they need it. Only particularly strong willed and driven individuals are trained in this task. They are trained how to bend their Will into a weapon against spirits, should they materialize, and their dogs have been trained to coordinate an attack with their masters. Typically individuals have a Will of 5 and training in a melee combat of 4 or 5 as well should they have to engage a physical opponent, and are fairly Charismatic. They utilize the Attack of Will spirit combat rule. These are only used at particularly large or high security locations, because of the cost of maintaining them.
Because of the side effects of the substances they rely on these teams work in rotations of one day on, one day off in most facilities. (Note, this ignores the supposed rarity of magical compounds and assumes that someone has developed a way to mass produce them)

Holo Hallway- This is a hallway filled with Holo Projectors. They can be used to create a hall of mirrors type effect that conceals an exit or traps, create illusionary guards to confuse intruders, etc. Even if hologram objects are identified, they can still conceal important features of a hallway, such as a pit or doorway. Often part of orientation for new employees involves learning how to avoid possible dangers of Holo Hallways.

Dual Natured Fire- This produced when awakened ivy is burned. The magical essence of the ivy is released in the astral plane in the same way as heat is in the physical plane. This can be use to burn astral figures if they are trapped near it or try to pass through dual natured fire. Generally creatures on the astral plane will move away from it and so it poses little risk except as a deterrent. No particularly useful benefit has yet been found.

Chemical Sensors- These are standards, but I don't think they are utilized enough. Essentially, give each employee a chemical coding in their I.D. so that fakes can be detected or someone not carrying any chemical code at all.

Awakened Detection Test- This utilizes a special set of flash cards along with a Deepweed smoke machine. A mundane will only be able to one set of words displayed on the cards, while an awakened character exposed to the Deepweed smoke will astrally perceive only be able to read the other set of words.

Deepweed Air Filters- Both a security measure and an employee loyalty program. These filters constantly run the buildings incoming air supply through a bed of awakened kelp, such that there is a constant low background dose of Deepweed in the air supply. A period of exposure of 10 minutes is required before the effects set-in. For most mundanes this just gives the building a feeling of a relaxing vibe and makes it seem more welcoming. For awakened characters, they begin to astrally perceive. A waiting period is required before being allowed into the highest security branches of buildings with these systems and guards are trained to look for unannounced magical users suddenly acting strangely. It is also not uncommon to couple this with additional countermeasures once a mage is identified. The mage suffers the normal -2 modifier after being in these facilities for 10 minutes.
Employees in such a facility may suffer withdraw if away from work for long periods of time and are often not informed about their exposure.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Interesting Indeed, Well Done... I Like them. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Loch]

These are pretty neat ideas, and I *may* have to pilfer a few for my London game.

I've been thinking more recently about how police and corpsec forces would go about apprehending your average gang of sixth-world hooligans, especially when the hooligans sometimes include trolls and the cyber-augmented. Especially in 2072, with the recent improvements in nanoware, could it be possible to use some kind of fast-curing foam projector to bind up dangerous suspects quickly and (relatively) harmlessly? Or would I need to invent my own rules for that?

[Kliko]

These are pretty neat ideas, and I *may* have to pilfer a few for my London game.

I've been thinking more recently about how police and corpsec forces would go about apprehending your average gang of sixth-world hooligans, especially when the hooligans sometimes include trolls and the cyber-augmented. Especially in 2072, with the recent improvements in nanoware, could it be possible to use some kind of fast-curing foam projector to bind up dangerous suspects quickly and (relatively) harmlessly? Or would I need to invent my own rules for that?

It is not a "nice" world out there. They shoot first (with gel rounds) or knock the frag out of them with stun batons and aks questions later.

[Midas]

Thanks for sharing your ideas. Not sure any of them will make an appearance in my game anytime soon, although I do use glomoss to detect magic use at high-security checkpoints for airports and the like.

[Glyph]

These are pretty neat ideas, and I *may* have to pilfer a few for my London game.

I've been thinking more recently about how police and corpsec forces would go about apprehending your average gang of sixth-world hooligans, especially when the hooligans sometimes include trolls and the cyber-augmented. Especially in 2072, with the recent improvements in nanoware, could it be possible to use some kind of fast-curing foam projector to bind up dangerous suspects quickly and (relatively) harmlessly? Or would I need to invent my own rules for that?

The SR3 book Man & Machine had freeze foam, although it seemed to be used more for riot control than general policing of an area.

[Seriously Mike]

Deepweed Air Filters- Both a security measure and an employee loyalty program. These filters constantly run the buildings incoming air supply through a bed of awakened kelp, such that there is a constant low background dose of Deepweed in the air supply. A period of exposure of 10 minutes is required before the effects set-in. For most mundanes this just gives the building a feeling of a relaxing vibe and makes it seem more welcoming. For awakened characters, they begin to astrally perceive. A waiting period is required before being allowed into the highest security branches of buildings with these systems and guards are trained to look for unannounced magical users suddenly acting strangely. It is also not uncommon to couple this with additional countermeasures once a mage is identified. The mage suffers the normal -2 modifier after being in these facilities for 10 minutes.
Employees in such a facility may suffer withdraw if away from work for long periods of time and are often not informed about their exposure.

Duuuuuude... Can I have that one installed in my pad? I mean, it's awesome! Well, aside from the munchies problem. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

The SR3 book Man & Machine had freeze foam, although it seemed to be used more for riot control than general policing of an area.

I think it's in one of SR4 books too. Corebook or Arsenal, either way I saw it somewhere there.

[Blade]

I wonder how one-way bulletproof barrier work...

Mental Manipulation Prevention Pack
Features enough glowmoss to detect spells cast on the wearer. As soon as the glowmoss detects magic activity, a message is sent to the user's commlink: "MAGIC ACTIVITY DETECTED, POSSIBLE MENTAL MANIPULATION". This allows the wearer to roll a new spell resistance test (as specified in the rules when someone or points out that the victim isn't acting normally, he can roll a new spell resistance test).
The problem is that it'll activate as soon as magical activity is detected on the wearer, which means that false positives are possible. Behavior analysis software might be used to help limit those false positives.

[Seriously Mike]

I wonder how one-way bulletproof barrier work...

I saw bulletproof glass for cars IRL that stops anything coming from the outside, but still lets bullets fired from the inside through.

While we're at security, where can I find turret setups? Something like motorized tripods that can turn MGs mounted on them into stationary, autonomously firing drones. It's in one of SR4 books, but I can't recall which one.
Nothing like a friendly yellow trashcan that suddenly opens a hidden hatch, unfolds a MG and starts blasting away at the intruders. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Manunancy]

I wonder how one-way bulletproof barrier work...

Some IRL example exist - they rely on the mechanic of the impact : it flexes the glass, which mean the impact compresses the glass on the impact side and stretches it on the other.

With a careful layering of material with different stretching/compressing resistance, the resulting glass is far more reistant from one side than the other.

here's an extract from wikipedia :

Advances in bullet-resistant glass have led to the invention of one-way bulletproof glass, such as used in some armored trucks. This glass resists incoming small arms fire striking the outside, but will allow those on the other side, such as guards inside the vehicle, to fire out through the glass at the exterior threat.

One-way bulletproof glass is usually made up of two layers, a brittle layer on the outside and a flexible one on the inside. A bullet fired from the outside hits the brittle layer first, shattering an area of it. This absorbs some of the bullet's kinetic energy, and spreads it on a larger area. When the slowed bullet hits the flexible layer, it is stopped. However, when a bullet is fired from the inside, it hits the flexible layer first. The bullet penetrates the flexible layer because its energy is focused on a smaller area; the brittle layer then shatters outward due to the flexing of the inner layer and does not significantly hinder the bullet's progress. One-way bullet-resistant glass is far from being perfected; there is evidence that suggests it can be achieved, but in most cases when shooting from the "safe" side, the intended target would have to be very close for the bullet to cause lethal wounds.

[kzt]

The SR3 book Man & Machine had freeze foam, although it seemed to be used more for riot control than general policing of an area.

RW, Nuclear weapon storage sites use what is called "sticky foam" it to fill security doors. Under high pressure. Damaging the door releases the foam. Including having a guard shooting the door. Oh, and if it gets on you face you can smother, which is why the use is limited to areas where the risk of death for property damage is acceptable.

[stevebugge]

Echo Location Motion Sensors work wonders on a budget too for detecting invisible characters, adding an ultra or infra sonic active sonar ping will counter the magician who remembers to also cast a silence spell.

Also a lot of runners can be thwarted by deliberate use of low tech security like a Deadbolt lock requiring a physical key, a dual lock system requiring two keys is just obnoxious "What? We need to break in the two separate residences of the research leads to steal their keys to the door?"

Another thing that is cheap and very effective against invisibility is extra thick carpet, walk on it leave a footprint.
If you want to go a little more over the top in your decorating style get fiber optic carpet linked to pressure sensors so the carpet changes color when walked on, it's a cool effect during business hours and a telltale sign on a security camera.

Drones are a real problem for mages, the high threshold for affecting a complex technological device just makes them hard to deal with.

[kzt]

Keys don't work in SR without house rules because the developers have no idea of the differences between a high security lock and a $15 kwickset lock. So the pick gun can trivially defeat everything. Including the combination lock on a vault. ...

[OneTrikPony]

Magic Sensor and Locator

I like this alot and would like to assume that the force and distance can be calculated for triangulation. Pair this with FAB (does it work the same in SR4?) and you've finally got a decent defense against magic without needing spirits hanging around

Conducting Fog barrier

I'm not sure the shock feature would work. Maybe if it grounded through the floor somehow. What is the path of the electricity?

One way Bulletproof, one way mirrors

would this work vs. mana illusions?

Dual Natured Pepper Spray-

LOVE IT. but, what kind of irritation does it cause to astral beings? Possible asenseing modifiers? Can you sneeze on the astral?

Bullet Analysis and Violence Suppression Systems- Originally designed as a security feature for subways .

the idea of a large tiled room full of showerheads makes me extremely uncomfortable no mater the purpose and I'm not even Jewish. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Keys don't work in SR without house rules because the developers have no idea of the differences between a high security lock and a $15 kwickset lock. So the pick gun can trivially defeat everything. Including the combination lock on a vault. ...

Only if you allow the Lockpick gun to work on a combination lock. I wouldn't. But that is just common sense. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Blog]

Or locks that require multiple keys

Sure you have a lockpick gun, but there are 3 keyholes that must be turned at the same time

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Or locks that require multiple keys

Sure you have a lockpick gun, but there are 3 keyholes that must be turned at the same time

Indeed...

[CanRay]

Only if you allow the Lockpick gun to work on a combination lock. I wouldn't. But that is just common sense. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Only one reply works.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Only one reply works.

I love it, CanRay... Well Done. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[CanRay]

My usual response to RAW Vs. Common Sense. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[bibliophile20]

Only one reply works.

Amen. I had to suggest that quality for TM player, due to his tendency to react without thinking (although he's getting better; last year, during our Dresden Files game, he gave his True Name to a recently uncorked--and hungry--demon...)

On the security topic, I tend to go with the attitude that "Do what makes sense with the world" as opposed to "Creating challenges for the players", with the caveat that if the PCs keep blowing easy challenges out of the water, their rep will spread to the point where more appropriate challenges will start coming their way... like, say, a run on a high security MCT facility. But I'm not gonna put a rating 6 maglock with antitamper and biometrics on a street level target's apartment unless there's a damn good reason said street target is gonna be that paranoid.

As for autopickers, I'll let them work on key locks, but mechanical combination locks need a different specialized tool, which I'll probably homebrew at one point (something with touch sensors and increased sensitivity sensors, a mechanical arm or similar, and a specialized autosoft--it'll practically be a hyper-specialized mini-drone)

[CanRay]

As for autopickers, I'll let them work on key locks, but mechanical combination locks need a different specialized tool, which I'll probably homebrew at one point (something with touch sensors and increased sensitivity sensors, a mechanical arm or similar, and a specialized autosoft--it'll practically be a hyper-specialized mini-drone)

Stethoscope, found in any higher-end Medkit.

I think there's increased touch sensors that could feel the tumblers (By way of it's bonus) as well. I'm pretty sure there's Qualities and Adept Powers that do the same, but I'm too tired and cranky to look them up to see if they're figments of my imagination or actually in the book.

[bibliophile20]

Well, yeah, if you wanted to do it yourself, you'd use a stethoscope and those nice 'wares that give bonuses to hearing and touch; but if you're a lazy runner that doesn't have the time to learn combination lock cracking, I was thinking of a tool that'd do it for you, just like auto-pickers for key locks.

[kzt]

Well, yeah, if you wanted to do it yourself, you'd use a stethoscope and those nice 'wares that give bonuses to hearing and touch; but if you're a lazy runner that doesn't have the time to learn combination lock cracking, I was thinking of a tool that'd do it for you, just like auto-pickers for key locks.

They don't actually work on good combination locks. (UL group 1, 1R or FF-L-2740A) The dials and the gate don't interlock until you have completed dialing the combination or otherwise do not provide any usable clues to the person trying to manipulate them. A FF-L-2740A lock is designed to burn up and lock closed if you try an autodialer. They way a safe tech opens these without the combination is via a drill-point template and a drill. In SR there are other approaches that can be used.

You can use manipulation on the group 2 mechanical locks that you get on most "safes". It still takes quite a lot of skill and time to open them, but you can non-destructively do it if you are good.

But even some key type locks are impossible to pick with a pick gun. For example, the most obvious is the EVVA MCS, which uses magnetic fields in a sealed keyway, but a lot of the more common UL 437 locks are simply never going to be opened by a tool that isn't designed for that lock by an expert. And oddly enough it is hard to find those kind of tools.

[thorya]

I've never used them in Shadowrun, but in a D&D campaign I had locks that could only be opened by a key or pick of the right material. I can see the same thing being used in mechanical locks without magic. So magnetic slides that are drawn to the steel usually used to make lock pick tools, but not to the key made of non-magnetic materials. A key with an embedded magnet that in the correct orientation cause some of the tumblers to disengage. Or a key that has to be made of a non-conducting material for the lock to disengage with an added security feature of delivering a mild shock to anyone sticking something conducting in the key hole.
Edit: Nevermind, they apparently already do some of that with the EVVA MCS locks. Surprised I hadn't heard of them before.