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> Spike Babies, What Do You think about this new Quality
Medicineman
post Mar 22 2012, 07:52 AM
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Spike Baby :
10Pts pos Quality(a combination of positives & negatives)
(You're an Elf born between 1910 and 2010. Full transformation,elfish appearence and longevity happened in 2011)
You get addional (LOG + INT) x3 Points of Knowledgeskills for free
You get School of Hard Knocks and College Education
You suffer a -1 to all Social Skills because You're so old school/old fashioned
You get a Lvl 1 Distinctive Style (just like a Surgeling)

He who dances like David Bowie
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snowRaven
post Mar 22 2012, 10:22 AM
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It's a lot of benefits for 10 BPs, and I don't think the Distinctive Style fits - they won't look different on the outside, after all.

Also, the -1 die on Social skills seems off, unless it would apply to everyone born before 2010.
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ravensmuse
post Mar 22 2012, 10:38 AM
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Yeah, I'd say that this is a bit much for a sole 10 BP.

Maybe the character just gets +5 or +10 knowledge skill points for that much. I can't think of any reason for the rest of what's there.
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Medicineman
post Mar 22 2012, 11:53 AM
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QUOTE (snowRaven @ Mar 22 2012, 05:22 AM) *
It's a lot of benefits for 10 BPs, and I don't think the Distinctive Style fits - they won't look different on the outside, after all.

Also, the -1 die on Social skills seems off, unless it would apply to everyone born before 2010.

a surgeling does neither and he gets one too
distinctive style is also about being tracked and thats why i included it

unless it would apply to [i]everyone born before 2010.[/i]maybe everybody who was Born around WWII or the 60s ?

consider s.o. who was born before WWI ,don't you think he would be seen a wee bit oldfashioned today ?

with an oldfashioned Dance
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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 02:21 PM
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Surgelings very frequently do look different, but you can have Distinctive Style for other features, yes.

It does seem like a crazy number of benefits, even though they're all Knowledge.
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Sengir
post Mar 22 2012, 05:00 PM
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QUOTE (Medicineman @ Mar 22 2012, 08:52 AM) *
(You're an Elf born between 1910 and 2010. Full transformation,elfish appearence and longevity happened in 2011)

Uhm, that's not how Spike Babies work...
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KarmaInferno
post Mar 22 2012, 05:03 PM
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Yeah, I was about to ask if the OP as mixing up immortal elves and spike babies.




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Warlordtheft
post Mar 22 2012, 06:01 PM
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My suggestion for Spike Baby :
20Pts pos Quality:
You're one of the few in the world, an elf born before 2000 AD. You've seen it all, and well sometimes a face plant is all you can do when you see people do the same thing over and over again. History repeats itself way too much, and the more you see the more you realize that people are so predictable.


You get a +2 dice when making any knowledge check that involves history.
You gain a +1 Social Skills because you've seen so much.
You gain immunity to age.

*Special Restriction:If you take more than 4 points worth of Essence in cyber or bioware you loose your immunitty to age.

I thought that hardknocks and college education were a bit much. That some spike babies may our may not have those characteristics. I also thought a +2 to certain knowledge checks involving history was more appropriate than a set of free skills. Most knowledge gained is probably useless (like knowing how to operate a rotary phone is these days). I'd say it would be a +1 to social tests since they have been dealing with people so long they pick up on things that others might miss. Immunity to Age is a nod to the immortal elves as opposed to normal elves not that it would effect the game all that much. Are all spike babies immortal?
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ShadowDragon8685
post Mar 22 2012, 06:23 PM
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If you're a Spike Baby, you would've probably been born in either 1910 or 1986; the last two perihelia of Hally's Comet.

That's a lot of difference. Remember, FastJack himself isn't much younger than a Spike Baby who was born in '86, whereas a Spike Baby born in 1910 has seen some shenanigans, man. Think about what happened: when they were a child, World War I was raging across Europe. They might even have been affected by the fighting if they were born in Europe. The world was knocked down, and then they got to witness firsthand the rise of the Third Reich, which probably hit them extra-hard if their birth-name was something like Wiesenthal or Goldberg and they were still in Europe. It's not remotely inconceivable that such a spike baby might actually be a holocaust survivor; or else have fought in the war; they might have seen firsthand the Blitz or the meat-grinder that was Omaha Beach. If they were in the Pacific, of course, there's no shortage whatsoever of battles they could have fought in; hell, maybe that's how they picked up their obligatory katana; war-trophy from a Japanese officer.

Then skip forward a few more years: the Korean war and the tide of Red Chinese that pushed the world back to the 38th parallel, forcing a stalemate. A few more years and the Vietnam War rages throughout southeast Asia, dominating the world's political landscape for a decade; the biggest, mightiest superpower on Earth throwing everything at a pissant little third-world country and losing. He might have witnessed the fall of Saigon, either firsthand or on TV. Then he would have seen the rise of the microchip; the advent of the personal computer. He probably kicks himself for not investing heavily in IBM and Microsoft and Apple. The relative peace of the 1980s and the 1990s would have offered some much-needed respite, only for everything to be shattered on 9/11/01 when terrorists misappropriate some jumbo jets for uses which are not of their intended purpose. They'd be there for the rise of watch lists and no-fly lists and get to see the whole mess of Vietnam repeat itself in Iraq and Afghanistan, and we haven't even gotten to the start of the Sixth World yet; everything's going to go to hell in a handbasket, up whitewater shit rapids without a kayak, let alone a paddle, with the rise of Extraterritoriality, Dragons, Magic, VITAS I and II, the Crash 1.0, the amazing (and for this guy, probably heartbreaking) fall of and balkanization of the greatest nation the world has ever known, the rise of greedy, bloodsucking Megacorporations deploying orbital weapons against urban targets who haven't (by the standards he grew up with) done anything wrong, HMHVV, UGE, Goblization, SURGE, Spirits, Bug Spirits, Shedim, The Matrix, Simsense and Hot VR, The Crash 2.0, Desert Wars, Euro Wars, the revelation of Artificial Intelligences, Nanotechnology, The Wireless Matrix, Cybertechnology, Biotechnology, Genetic Enhancement, and Augmented Reality!

So basically, this guy shouldn't have to make Composure tests. Like, ever.
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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 06:25 PM
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Or constantly, depending on how well he adapted. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The problem with this concept is that it kind of forces you to be a certain kind of Spike Baby, depending on the various effects suggested. You're unflappable, or you're a student of human nature, or you soaked up lots of knowledge… but what if you didn't? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I guess you can just say you're a Spike Baby and not take the Quality. Seems inflexible, I guess.
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Tymeaus Jalynsfe...
post Mar 22 2012, 06:27 PM
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Well... IIRC, there are several Spike Babies born in the 1600-1800 Range (don't remember the exact dates, maybe they also coincided with the return of Haley's). There are 2 Tir princes that are/were in the 400 year old range.

I also was wondering why you actually needed to have a Quality to have such a character. Just work it out with your GM. No need for additional abilities or powers. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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ShadowDragon8685
post Mar 22 2012, 06:31 PM
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QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Mar 22 2012, 01:25 PM) *
Or constantly, depending on how well he adapted. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The problem with this concept is that it kind of forces you to be a certain kind of Spike Baby, depending on the various effects suggested. You're unflappable, or you're a student of human nature, or you soaked up lots of knowledge… but what if you didn't? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I guess you can just say you're a Spike Baby and not take the Quality.


Well, I guess if he didn't, if he managed to live from 1910/1086-2072 without picking up a lot of knowledge or going through the meat-grinders or both, then he managed to live a remarkably sheltered and ignorant life. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Also, when most 'Runners who have Flashbacks have them, they're probably flashing back to, at worst, the Night of Rage. When this guy flashes back, he's a child running for his life from a rolling artillery bombardment, or a young man ducking Nazi death squads through the ghettos, or maybe a young man leading a squad of Airborne Infantry or Marines into the very maw of death itself; anywhere in Europe or Southeast Asia, anytime between 1939-1975. Like I said: he's seen some shenanigans, man. You could use a Spike Baby as an excuse to load your Runner up with a cornucopia of mental woes and a firsthand account of history.
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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 06:34 PM
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Sure, but it all depends. There's no reason he had to have been in any of those events, for sure. Or he has a bad memory, or who knows. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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ShadowDragon8685
post Mar 22 2012, 06:38 PM
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QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Mar 22 2012, 01:27 PM) *
Well... IIRC, there are several Spike Babies born in the 1600-1800 Range (don't remember the exact dates, maybe they also coincided with the return of Haley's). There are 2 Tir princes that are/were in the 400 year old range.

I also was wondering why you actually needed to have a Quality to have such a character. Just work it out with your GM. No need for additional abilities or powers. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


Apparitions of Halley's Comet. The 1600-1910 list is as follows:
October 1607: Hey, you got to live in the days of Wooden Ships and Iron Men! Were you a pirate who sailed the high seas?
September 1682: Still the age of sail... Moving right along.
March 1759: Still the age of sail, but think about what you're about to see! The American Revolution, shortly followed by the French revolution! You might even have fought in them; they recruited young back then! Did you suffer bitter, terrible winters alongside General Washington, or maybe you stormed the Bastille in Paris? Maybe you got adventurous later on and took to the high seas around the turn of 1800; you might have seen the Battle of Trafalgar. Hell, if you're Spanish, you might have shot Nelson.
November 1835: You were born in the middle of the Industrial Revolution. You're going to witness the rise and fall of steam power, son. Also the American Civil War in about thirty years, won't that be "fun"?
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ShadowDragon8685
post Mar 22 2012, 06:40 PM
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QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Mar 22 2012, 01:34 PM) *
Sure, but it all depends. There's no reason he had to have been in any of those events, for sure. Or he has a bad memory, or who knows. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


Whats the point of making a character who's a century (or centuries) old if you're not going to exploit it and have seen the pivotal moments of your time? You might as well just make a young elf.
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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 06:44 PM
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Hehe. My point is just that each of these is one specific kind of person, and they're all kinda different.
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ShadowDragon8685
post Mar 22 2012, 06:47 PM
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QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Mar 22 2012, 01:44 PM) *
Hehe. My point is just that each of these is one specific kind of person, and they're all kinda different.


Yes, but a Spike Baby, especially a 1910 Spike Baby, lived a long time when civilization was at its peak. He could have fought in those wars and then gone on to achieve excellence in education, probably shot forward by exploiting the G.I. Bill or something.


Oh, I see. No, I wasn't suggesting absolutely everything there at once. Some of that would be chronologically impossible. No, I was just tossing out scattershot ideas as they came to me. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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VykosDarkSoul
post Mar 22 2012, 08:04 PM
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So why not make it a quality, and work out your particular history, and then work with the GM on an appropriate bonus for it....
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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 08:17 PM
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You mean like, "Spike Baby (5-20 BP): Work it out with your GM"? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) That's a little *too* flexible.
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VykosDarkSoul
post Mar 22 2012, 08:26 PM
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More like Spike Baby (20pts)
Immunity to Age
+1 to two knowledge skills
+1 to two active skills


...you limit it to actually adding to the skills instead of providing a dice pool modifier, therefore its not to huge, and IMO the Immunity to Age is huge in and of itself.
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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 08:28 PM
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Speaking of… why Immunity to Age? Is this a thing? I thought they were just elves, etc.
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VykosDarkSoul
post Mar 22 2012, 08:29 PM
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and as a sidenote, are Spike Babies truly Immortal, or are the just ageless.

Because if they are truly Immortal then there is not much of a reason to bother playing one, if they are ageless, well, then obviously they have to have SOME skills to survive as long as they have.

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Yerameyahu
post Mar 22 2012, 08:31 PM
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They're definitely not immortal. I don't even think they're ageless. They're just elves and dwarves (yes?) born pre-6th World.
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Tymeaus Jalynsfe...
post Mar 22 2012, 08:39 PM
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QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Mar 22 2012, 02:31 PM) *
They're definitely not immortal. I don't even think they're ageless. They're just elves and dwarves (yes?) born pre-6th World.


Yes, there is a vast difference between a Spike Baby and an Immortal Elf, Who are also not truly immortal. They can be killed just like anyone else can.
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EKBT81
post Mar 22 2012, 11:03 PM
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Honestly, I wouldn't even bother with making up a special quality. Spike babies are after all normal elves, only with an earlier birth date. I don't see any reason for skill bonuses. People unlearn stuff they don't practice regularly, and a "firsthand account" bonus on history knowledge checks is IMHO also questionable. What they may remember from back then may not actually be the truth but rather biased news/propaganda of the day, and, perhaps more importantly, memories aren't set in stone but change over time.
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