Practical uses for a Magic rating of 1? Options

[Dakka Dakka]

And yet you claim that the defensive Applications of the spell are Magical in Nature and should bypass ITNW. Magic is not intelligent, Dakka Dakka. It cannot make determinations of whether it has been used offensively or defensively. If the defensive appplication works, then so does the offensive application.

The magic does not make any determination, I agree, but the spell can still have two effects that are treated differently.

there is a Sustained Magical Effect in place. That magical effect creates damage, therefore it is capable of bypassing ITNW.

No, the magic only causes the damage in the defensive application. On the offense the melee attack causes the damage. Without a successful attack there is no damage.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

The magic does not make any determination, I agree, but the spell can still have two effects that are treated differently.

No, the magic only causes the damage in the defensive application. On the offense the melee attack causes the damage. Without a successful attack there is no damage.

Nope... But I don't think we are going to agree, so......

[Dakka Dakka]

...let's agree to disagree. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Yerameyahu]

There is no magic damage in SR and ItNW has a specific set of exclusions (weapon foci, spells, adept or critter powers). An elemental attack granted by a spell is not one of them. You do not attack with the spell but your damage is increased by the spell.

I know there's no 'magic damage', which is why we're having this confusion in the first place. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) My point is that the expected and desired behavior of the system, regardless of how the RAW happens to be worded, is that Aura causes 'magic' damage. Winning an argument about RAW but messing up the *game* is not a good outcome. If you're right, that only tells us yet another instance where the RAW is wrong. If you don't agree that Aura *should* hurt spirits, then the result is presumably fine for you.

[Dakka Dakka]

Is bypassing ItNW the desired outcome? I agree it is more desirable to have it uniform across both effects (offensive, defensive) but I'm not sure which option is better. Balance aside, I think it is more logical that fire behaves (mostly) like fire even if it is created magically. Yes that would further nerf indirect combat spells.

[Yerameyahu]

Right, so it's absolutely a question involving balance, magic 'theme', and the RAW. It's definitely a coherent position that magically-created 'natural' elements are themselves nonmagical; I haven't been saying you're incorrect. If that's what we want, then we probably have to fix ITNW and spell balance separately (as have been suggested different places). That's kind of a bigger change, so I'd consider it dispreferred against the smaller tweak of 'Aura counts', that's all. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

The issue is that a Natural Fire must consume something to keep burning. No fuel, no fire. Elemental Aura consumes nothing, so it must be fueled some other way. The way it is fueld is by Sustaining the Magic that provides its existence. Since it only exists because the Magic fuels it, it is Magical in nature. Since it is magical in nature, it defeeats ITNW. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[pbangarth]

I have to side with Tymmy et al on this one. The elemental effect created by the various Aura spells is no less magical than the elemental effect created by a Fireball, etc. I don't see that any rewording/house ruling is necessary.

[cndblank]

Or you could go with the Cyberlimbs are cool. This is cyberpunk so Cool wins and ask the GM to handwave it.

I'm sure the GM can come up with a good reason. The prices seem a little off even if it is 2070. Hardware is easy to mass produced. Bioware...

I run an Old School 2050 campaign so cyber limbs are less than half the price of either Type-O or Cloned.
They are also fairly common since only the very rich and awaken go for Type-O or Cloned unless you want to talk backroom recycled organics.

Add in no waiting and with an abbreviated physical therapy program (home physical therapy skill chip/knowledge soft included), they can have you back to work in under a week, cyberlimbs win hands down.



I mean if you had a choice between major eye surgery or getting proven technology of cybereyes that mean you never have to reach for a pair of shades, a camera, a pocket secretary, explain why you have the football game on, or worry about falling asleep with your glasses on or your contacts in, which one would you go for?

Hell it would be worth it just to be able to snap a shot with a thought and being able to match a name to a face or figure out if you have the right brand of makeup for your significant other.
Think of the advantages of cybereyes after a hard night celebrating (no red eye and no having to turning on the light so you can see once you are home). Let alone no need for swim goggles, getting dust in your eyes, and allergy and cold season would be better with no watery eyes.

Cyberleg: 20,000¥ +1,500¥ for each attribute point above 3
Type-O Leg (with the right Attributes already included): 21,000¥
Cloned Leg (with the right Attributes already included): 25,000¥

Except being more interesting for organleggers, awakened can take the type-O replacements without drawbacks AFAIK.

Again, justify harder.

[Yerameyahu]

'Cyber is cool' is fine… as long as you're not a mage. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Then, it makes no sense.

[Dakka Dakka]

Cyber is cool, but cyberlimbs are meh at best.

[Xenefungus]

Actually, for any mundane, the cheapest way to get a high shooting dicepool is a cyberarm with agility 9.

[Dakka Dakka]

Actually, for any mundane, the cheapest way to get a high shooting dicepool is a cyberarm with agility 9.

True, for that arm only. Whether that is viable hinges on how often the GM uses the average or minimum Attribute.