30 million Seatlle, what if Options

[Garou]

The complexes would be of poor quality, with small surface area of apartments, and often house a large family. Socialist style building in a word.


Does anyone have first hand experience of favelas, or any kind of undeveloped area where a lot of people live?

As no one seemed to answer that one, i will. I do have a little experience of Favelas because in my own place (as it happens on most non-planned cities on Brazil) there are Favelas right next to any good neighbourhood, in a very SR-like style.
I did a little research on the subject at Jornalism University.

What effectively happens has all to do with the appropriation of terrain. Generally speaking, areas of favelas aren't good areas for construction, or else they would have been used in this way before. In my own city in the NW of Brazil, Favelas exist either by the riverside or by ou local kind of Bayou (Called Mangue). On Rio de Janeiro, which has a particular kind of favelization process (Due to the abandonment of goverment interest on those areas), Favelas are built on the high hills over the city, each structure being built halfway over the other on levels (Lajes). Such structures allow better use of inclined surfaces for construction. But neither case it allows for tall buildings of sevelra floor. 2-3 floors max, every structure half braced on the next.

In Rio's case, the favela's formation existed on a non-official pact with the state goverment. Up to a certain height ( and i mean it) the state didn't invest in the infrastructure, which left the place ripe for non-official ways of construction and terrain deployment.

One un-intended side effect of this style of construction is that the Favela was a hard terrain to navigate tatically, and are quite defensible by drug dealers and other shady types. Operations in such locations are much more art than science. Every year, Special Forces teams from all over the world come to Rio in exchange programs, because if you can Operate on a favela at rio, you can do it in pratically any urban enviroment in the world. It's a tough cookie.

I believe that's what happened in places like the Barrens in SR-Seattle.

[CanRay]

The Ork Litter thing is stapled off by high infant fatalities in ork children unless they're in Middle Class+ families.

And, honestly, how many of those are there around?

[X-Kalibur]

Howdy folks, long time no see.
Just puting my 2 nuyen here as Garou asked for me to add something.

As Garou mentioned, yes, São Paulo is fucking huge. I mean, HUGE. I don't know how many cities are there that behave like this, but São Paulo has "sub-mayor halls" to manage several groups of neighborhoods. Honestly, I don't know why anyone would want to be the Mayor of that place.

Now, I've learned that the definition of "how close" something is to paulistas is not the same for anyone else. I had gone there for the first time in 2005 for the first concert in Brazil of Pearl Jam. I'd stayed at the cousin's house of a friend of mine that was going with me. We asked his cousin if the stadium where the show was going to happen was close to his house and if we could arrive there walking. His anwser was 'yes'. We walked for nearly two hours, passing through two subway stations that we could have taken to reduce the walking but he said it wasn't necessary because it was too close and it would be too crowded. I mean, it was almost 10 miles away and this is "WALKING DISTANCE" for paulistas.

Also, the first thing you ask someone you might want to have a romantic/sexual relationship is where they live. If they live more than 20 miles away it's better not to take it forward because you will neve see each other.

And yes, the town NEVER SLEEPS.

This as opposed to Southern California, where everything is 20 minutes away. Not really, mind you, based on traffic and actual distance, but it's the mindset of the folk living here.

[Halinn]

The Ork Litter thing is stapled off by high infant fatalities in ork children unless they're in Middle Class+ families.

And, honestly, how many of those are there around?

There's the dude in Tir Tairngire, and I think Evo employs three or so. That's about it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Daddy's Litt...]

I think Mexico City and Tokyo have around 25 million. 30 million is just over the top. I grew up in the suburbs of NYC with a population of 8 million and 25 million in the surrounding suburbs of NY. LI, CT and NJ. Trust me This is plenty crowded in some areas with lots of space in others. There is no need to pump up the numbers so high. Just the 8 million in NYC has slums, open parks, woodland areas, industrial areas and brownstone streets, chrome and steel and everything in between. Add on the outlying areas and you have more suburbs,farms, more slums (Newark, Yonkers, ) small towns and small citiies (Stamford, White Plains) and the commuter 'powerbase' of strip malls and beaches. still while being well short of 30 million.

[ChromeZephyr]

I believe that's what happened in places like the Barrens in SR-Seattle.

This is pretty much how I view the Redmond Barrens, an absolute maze of just-barely-acceptable construction that LS/KE only goes into with SWAT and above force...or just subcontracts out to the Metro Guard if they need a big message delivered (usually via 155mm shells). Watching a documentary on the favelas was certainly eye-opening, at least for me.

[Makoto]

The Los Angeles area-Southern California should have 30 million or upwards to 50 million people by the end of this century, while the San Francisco Bay Area is at 20-25 million residents. The state of California itself may be home to 70-75 million inhabitants in 2100 in this rate of growth, except the rate of outward migration continues to other neighboring states in the western region. And Seattle does not have the room to accomodate 30 million for goodness sake, nor does Dallas, Denver, Houston and Phoenix have more population in their metropolitan areas.

[Brazilian_Shinob...]

Not exactly true. Most major cities are still in place. Brasilia, Salvador, Manaus and even João Pessoa are quoted. That made people of my own hometown, Recife, right south of João Pessoa, poke fun at being ignored. We alsopoke fun at João Pessoa IRL, calling it an "outer neighbourhood" of our own city. We do so to voice our envy, because their city is much more civilized than or own. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Not true garou, João Pessoa is just as much violent as "Hellcife" but there is a difference of scale. Recife has much more people than João Pessoa.
And yes, the whole idea was that Hualpa ordered most people to move to the São Paulo/Rio de Janeiro/Minas Gerais area, but he was not so stupid as to not allow some other cities to still exist because of the already industrial infrastructure there. I mean, taking Pernambuco as an example, I'm pretty sure that they would allow only the Great Recife Area to remain, the other cities would probably be reverted back to the Mata Atlântica.