Minor Magic spells, Shadowrun version of D&D Cantrips Options

[Umidori]

...you don't pray to god or the ancestors for a cold beer...

Clearly you don't worship Broseidon, god of the Brocean.

~Umi

[Blade]

In some religions, you don't pray to god or the ancestors for the death of someone, but there still are combat spells in Shadowrun. You don't pray to god or the ancestors to make special effects in a movie, yet there are mages who use spells for that.

All spells won't fit all characters, but I don't see anything weird with some mages using their spells to make their daily lives easier.

[Sengir]

Clearly you don't worship Broseidon, god of the Brocean.

~Umi

Only Americans could think of a water deity when talking about beer (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

@Blade: I'm sure you will find special effects designers who pray that everything goes well, whereas people supplicating Him to descended from heaven in all his flaming glory to light a cigarette...

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

So how often do you see a character with the ability to cast grade 7 spells using grade one spells in a major confrontation?

All the Time..., and not just Magic Missile. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Yes, you can find strange examples, but as a matter of fact people tend to cast their spells starting with the higher grades in final encounters...

It is not a Matter of Fact. It is a Matter of Choice. I almost always tend to go subtle instead of Overpowering, so I often use more Lower Level spells (to the option of actually using them in higher spell slots to have more of them). Not always, but more often than not. It also has an interesting effect on how you are perceived, as well. Refrain from casting your higher level spells, and people will tend to underestimate you. It is often a boon to be underestimated.

@KCKitsune

It is not about powergaming. My point is that spells are build differently in SR than they are in DnD.

You would need to introduce a whole new mechanic for spells. Thats a lot of efford for a bid of fluff. Of course, with mages beeing the best possible choice already I guess some peoble would frown at the possibility to make them even more "jack of all trades" with freebees...
But again, thats not the issue I wanted to address.

Or, you know, just cast a spell at Force 1 for a "Minor Effect" if you just want to make them common place, and don't want them having to create an entirely new spell. That will shunt that Drain to almost nothing. Or simply allow a Minor Effect at Force 0, for no drain and no roll required (Me, I just stick with Force 1). *shrug*

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

All spells won't fit all characters, but I don't see anything weird with some mages using their spells to make their daily lives easier.

But no additional mechanics are required to represent that. Cast at Low Force and move along. Want to light a Cigar, use a Low Force Ignite Spell. *shrug*

[Lionhearted]

Bah! Ask Odin for beer all you want, however if you know how to manipulate mana to such a degree that you can warp perception, throw great balls of fire and close wounds, you bloody well should be able to figure out how to sculpt it into party tricks.
*Puts on hermetic hat*
most magi sneeze more mana then it takes to light a fag, keep flavour to flavour.
and yes, I would allow players to great creative and abuse it, why?
Because McGuvyering is awesome.

[Sengir]

Bah! Ask Odin for beer all you want, however if you know how to manipulate mana to such a degree that you can warp perception, throw great balls of fire and close wounds, you bloody well should be able to figure out how to sculpt it into party tricks.

If you know how to throw fireballs (i.e. have learned the spell), you should be able to light a BBQ, but depending on your tradition it might be considered inappropriate to waste your gift on such trivialities.
If you have not learned the spell, you should not be able to use a magic lighter, because that would make magic feel too common for this time of the mana cycle.

[Stahlseele]

Actually, Odin would probably up for giving you a Beer, if you tip him well enough in Terms of Sacrifices . .
If it's worth the cost to you, have it your way.
And yes, Americans thinking of Water-God while talking about beer really fits *snickers*
Over here, it'd be something like Odin, a Warrior/King or at least a God of good Food.
Beer is liquid Bread, it's good for you

[Irion]

All the Time..., and not just Magic Missile. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)



It is not a Matter of Fact. It is a Matter of Choice. I almost always tend to go subtle instead of Overpowering, so I often use more Lower Level spells (to the option of actually using them in higher spell slots to have more of them). Not always, but more often than not. It also has an interesting effect on how you are perceived, as well. Refrain from casting your higher level spells, and people will tend to underestimate you. It is often a boon to be underestimated.

Actually it is funny, that the Order of the stick adressed the issue in todays episode...

I did not want to say, that everyone starts with Grade 9, then comes 8, than 7 etc.pp (Of course there are grade 2/3 spells, which are superior for some situations compared to grade 3++ spells.

So you probably won't use finger of death agaisnt undead or creatures with a high fortitude save. This might be a case where it would be better to use acid arrow.

The point is just that in general, higher level spells do more damage, are harder to resist etc. So it is probably better to use them in worthy encounters.
Something like that is not the case for SR. Spell is Spell. You decide the punch it packs.
If this would be true for DnD I guess nobody would move past magic missiles, often...

[Umidori]

Oh come on, guys. I don't like America any more than anyone else, but they're not alone in crappy beer and citizens that purposefully seek it out. Give credit where credit is due, now.

America has bros. The UK has chavs. South Africa has zefs. I'm certain most countries have their own equivalents - young people with no money and a penchant for partying, so they buy as much of the least expensive swill they can find so they can all get sloshed on the cheap.

At least America doesn't have football hooliganism... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

~Umi

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

At least America doesn't have football hooliganism... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

~Umi

Since When? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
It is just a different Football, is all.

[Stahlseele]

no it's not.
it's handegg.

[Lionhearted]

*Puts on british aristocrat voice* Hep, hep I never understood why you good chaps over the sea needed to put on a full suit of armour to play a merry game of rugby. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

no it's not.
it's handegg.

Heh... well put. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[All4BigGuns]

Oh come on, guys. I don't like America any more than anyone else, but they're not alone in crappy beer and citizens that purposefully seek it out. Give credit where credit is due, now.

At least America doesn't have football hooliganism... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

~Umi

The main reason so many people over here go for the crappy beer is because the crap-stuff is cheap and most of us are seriously underpaid. (Our Federal minimum wage is $7.25/hour with 'tip earning' jobs being $2.13/hour)

I don't know how bad people get over soccer over there in Europe, but people here get pretty darn crazy over our particular brand of football...it's more than a little ridiculous.


On Topic: For the most part, there wouldn't really be anything wrong with letting a magician toss a bit of mana around to keep his doss clean, chill his beverage or other such banal things. It's such a minor usage of mana that it shouldn't really be much of a drain even for the weakest of magicians and not at all overpowering, nor is it one of the "something for nothing" things because it's just daily life usage and as such not really suitable for any sort of in-game use (except possibly as 'coolness').

[Stahlseele]

isn't this what buying hits is there for?
stuff you would not need to roll for?

on the other hand:
using a fireball to light up a fag is always a bad idea.
even at force 1 it will hit anything within 1m radius of the target point.

and overcoming the object resistance is another thing.
if the object resistance is 2 and you cast only a force 1 spell, nothing happens.

[All4BigGuns]

using a fireball to light up a fag is always a bad idea.

Dude, every time you use that term it makes me twitch. We use that word for something entirely different over here (it's a slur).

[Stahlseele]

i am german

[All4BigGuns]

i am german

Yeah, it's just that over here it's a slur term used for homosexuals, and while some know how it's used over there in Europe, not everyone does (that I do know is why it only causes a slight twitch).

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

isn't this what buying hits is there for?
stuff you would not need to roll for?

on the other hand:
using a fireball to light up a fag is always a bad idea.
even at force 1 it will hit anything within 1m radius of the target point.

and overcoming the object resistance is another thing.
if the object resistance is 2 and you cast only a force 1 spell, nothing happens.

Which is why you use Ignite. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Yeah, it's just that over here it's a slur term used for homosexuals, and while some know how it's used over there in Europe, not everyone does (that I do know is why it only causes a slight twitch).

Context is everything. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Lionhearted]

It's a merry gay day to light some fags and hang out with the pofters (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Stahlseele]

Which is why you use Ignite. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

agreed, lighting up a fag with ignite is more like it. still needs to overcome the object resistance . .

[ChromeZephyr]

Which is 2 at most, I would think. So a decent mage (Magic 3-5, Spellcasting 3-5; total 8.) should just be able to buy the necessary successes, using a Force 2 spell for 1 drain, and 1 combat turn (3 seconds) later fwoosh, lit cigarette. I'm tempted to give my next mage character ignite just for this reason. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

edit: Holy grammar, Batman. All of my poor English teachers must be feeling a disturbance in the Force from that one.

[Lionhearted]

What you need is a pipe, it's essential for the gentleman wizard.