Minimum costs for expendable fodder, Terrorists seek disposable troops. Apply within. Options

[FuelDrop]

Ok, so it's looking like our game is going to involve going up against a shadowy terrorist organization who spend lives like they're worthless. this got me thinking: why would anyone sign up to be runner-fodder?
Answer: they don't!
As I see it the cheapest way to make an instant fanatic is:
Kidnapped SINless hobo: Free.
Second-hand Data-jack: 250 nuyen.
Hot SIM: 400 nuyen (I think. AFB ATM so can't check.)
Cracked personafix: effectively free.

thoughts?

[Thanee]

You could take a look at one of the Denver Missions (4th or 5th, I think; "Through a rose-colored commlink" or somesuch). (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Bye
Thanee

[hermit]

Surgeon: 50/h (can be substituted with more skillsofts though, for 250)
Medical facilities: 100.000
Location (includes guarding it so nobody steals your medical stuff): 1000/week
Cheapest possible hot-sim sim module is 350.
Also, cracked BTL for cheaper price is rules abuse. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

And as for shady terrorists who spend their lives like they're worthless: if they're convinced their lives suck sufficiently and their targets are at fault, you don't need to use personafix, you need a leader with charisma who inspires them to tell their (supposed) oppressors what's what by blowing themselves and some of them up. You send a handler with a secondary trigger for the explosives belt so the terrorist explodes even if they chicken at the last moment if you're professional and that's that. Much cheaper, and seriously, it makes you look a lot better and guarantees a steady stream of supply, especially if the organisation's enemies are massive dicks and retaliate with maximum collateral damage because they feel entitled like that.

[FuelDrop]

Well, since the terrorists in question are Hand of Five, an anti-meta organization, I figured they wouldn't have any qualms about using SINless metahumans as their bullet sponges.

Also, is a facility level medical facility really necessary for a data jack? I remember reading somewhere that you could go into a doctor's and come out with a shiny new datajack in about an hour, which implies more shop-level tools. Could be wrong, though.

[hermit]

Well, since the terrorists in question are Hand of Five, an anti-meta organization, I figured they wouldn't have any qualms about using SINless metahumans as their bullet sponges.

Given their tight connection, they could easily just use the Metroplex Guard. You know, tracking wanted terrorists in an NCIS-ish case, ignoring all juristictions but I AM WEARING A UNIFORM LOOK AT IT AND BE PATRIOTIC. But they should have enough eager human minions. There're several gangs that would love to give them an ideological blowjob; the Night Stalkers, the Troll Killers, the White Lightning ...

Also, is a facility level medical facility really necessary for a data jack? I remember reading somewhere that you could go into a doctor's and come out with a shiny new datajack in about an hour, which implies more shop-level tools. Could be wrong, though.

You're right, it requires a medical shop (10K). As your terrorists are probably not without enemies, they might want a mobile medical shop, which is 15K, and an appropriate vehicle for transport.

[Blade]

You don't even need to implant people, just give your personafix to BTL junkies.
You can also use a Psychotropic IC. A TM with the echo that let him force people into hotSim VR + a blackhammer with psychothropic IC can do it for free. A friend of mine had such a TM be the main antagonist in one of his campaign.

[hermit]

The 'mancer has the added benefit of being able to thread the psychotropic option over and over and, using a blackout CF, he can just memory wipe someone entirely. Because there is truth to the whole brain-hacking technomancer scare.

[Seriously Mike]

The 'mancer has the added benefit of being able to thread the psychotropic option over and over and, using a blackout CF, he can just memory wipe someone entirely. Because there is truth to the whole brain-hacking technomancer scare.

Oh what the hell again?! They can do this?!

[hermit]

Oh what the hell again?! They can do this?!

Sure. There's nothing preventing them from re-threading a psychotropic option for the blackout CF every time they use the CF as an interrupt. It won't even cause much fading, so they're likely to soak it. It'd take long, but not over an hour (which is equivalent to 3600 attacks for an unimmerged 3 IP/turn 'mancer). The mancer needs to take care to not kill the victim, since the damage will fill the physical track, but if he just threads a low-end blackout form, the victim will likely soak it. It's not easy but perfectly possible.

[_Pax._]

Medical facilities: 100.000
Location (includes guarding it so nobody steals your medical stuff): 1000/week

Nah, you don't need that.

Just drop 65,000¥ on a Docwagon SRT (an ambulance). It has a Valkyrie module, and those can be used to perform basic surgery. Remotely via the matrix, even, so your doc never needs to be on-site, or even know WHERE the SRT happens to be. It also comes with an R4 medkit built in, so that's 4 bonus dice for using it. Your "doc" can be chipped; R3 or R4 should be plenty. And remember: you're not looking for a clean, complication-free install. You want something quick and cheap, that'll last for a couple days, tops. You don't care about infections, chronic pain, scarring, or anything like that. Long before any of those became a serious problem, the guy you've done it to will have splattered himself (and a dozen bystanders) into chunky salsa ... right?

For the implant ... a Datajack, wired with a hot sim module. 750¥ new, 500¥ used (though I suspect there aren't a lot of used datajacks with a hot-sim module built in, so I'd count on the as-new price).

Then, yeah. A personafix. Crafted in-house, so that the person stays calm, doesn't even notice their bomb vest (assuming you use a wearable, and not something surgically implanted inside their gut), and goes to a particular place at a particular time.

Triggerman does the detonating; that behavior isn't part of the personafix. They watch for the best placement to cause the most damage, injury, and fear ... and BOOM.

[MK Ultra]

Oh what the hell again?! They can do this?!

As far as I recall they can't because TMs do not have access to Program-Options. AFB right now though, so I can't check (Unwirred?).

[hermit]

As far as I recall they can't because TMs do not have access to Program-Options. AFB right now though, so I can't check (Unwirred?).

Unwired specifically allows them to purchase complex forms for 2 karma (p. 136) and also thread program options (p. 148).

[CanRay]

Sandwich: 1¥.
Religious Brainwashing: Time.
Picking Out The Nutbars: Skill.
Bomb Vest: Depends on what's around the area.

[KCKitsune]

Do you need a datajack for running Hot-SIMs? I thought 4th edition made it so that a 'trode net would the same thing, but no surgery needed.

If I'm right
1) Disposable commlink: 300 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)
2) Trodes: 50 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)
3) Hot SIM module: 250 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)
4) Personafix chip: effectively free

Total: 800 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)

[DeathStrobe]

Oh you know, you could just stalk people and find out who regularly visits the area you want destroyed and knock 'em out and have an area cranial bomb implanted.

Maybe hack a camera and watch them go about their normal day and when they're in a line or a good place to detonate and then pop. None of this time consuming brainwashing mess or moderately expensive implants.

Oh and if you implant multiple people, when the crowds are panicking and rushing for the exit, watching more people seemingly at random explode and take out more people while attempting to exit would soe a lot of terror in to the populous.

But that might be even more time consuming then brainwashing a few hobos.

[Jaid]

Do you need a datajack for running Hot-SIMs? I thought 4th edition made it so that a 'trode net would the same thing, but no surgery needed.

If I'm right
1) Disposable commlink: 300 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)
2) Trodes: 50 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)
3) Hot SIM module: 250 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)
4) Personafix chip: effectively free

Total: 800 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif)

iirc, a datajack can run BTL chips without needing a hot sim, which might be why people are suggesting that.

on a side note, the psychotropic brainwasher killing a victim should never be a concern. for brainwashing purposes, just use blackout instead of black hammer, and you can only ever fill the stun track, no matter what (well, okay, maybe on a critical glitch if you're specifically trying to not kill the target as a main goal).

i don't think the brainhacker can do a total mind wipe though... the most powerful memory-eraser is worth a few hours. which is just fine if all you want to do is make them unable to identify their kidnappers and provide information about where they were taken, of course.

also, i find myself doubtful that the human supremacist organization is going to be terribly happy to be completely dependant on technomancers... and if all you ever want to do is one specific effect over and over again, you can just buy a program to do all the work for you.

at which point, you just need trodes, a hot sim module, a cheap commlink, and some way of restraining your victims while you repeatedly drop blackout on them, possibly run a couple of low-rating agents to do the job, and you only *really* need 3-4 different versions of blackout. should be relatively cheap.

seriously, it's not as if technomancers are the *only* people with access to the psychotropic option. the only difference for a technomancer is that they can change the option on the fly... if all you want is to do one thing over and over and over, a regular hacker or even an agent can get the job done just fine, no need to go hunting down that needle in a haystack (because really, "oh we'll just use a technomancer with resonance trodes to brainwash people" is frankly just not necessary).

[Wakshaani]

Sandwich: 1¥.
Religious Brainwashing: Time.
Picking Out The Nutbars: Skill.
Bomb Vest: Depends on what's around the area.

^^^
This

[Ixal]

Are just talking about bomb vest carriers or also about "charge highly armed runners with a rusty spoon" crazies?
If yes then they likely need to stay alive a bit longer. Shadowrunners don't normally show up on schedule so you need to keep them around a bit.

[thorya]

Oh you know, you could just stalk people and find out who regularly visits the area you want destroyed and knock 'em out and have an area cranial bomb implanted.

Maybe hack a camera and watch them go about their normal day and when they're in a line or a good place to detonate and then pop. None of this time consuming brainwashing mess or moderately expensive implants.

Oh and if you implant multiple people, when the crowds are panicking and rushing for the exit, watching more people seemingly at random explode and take out more people while attempting to exit would soe a lot of terror in to the populous.

But that might be even more time consuming then brainwashing a few hobos.

Finally a good use for palming? Don't knock 'em out. Just slip a pack of explosives or a few grenades with a remote detonator into their bag. Hell, if you hate meta-types do this to some elves and orks, so it looks like they staged the attack to lend public sympathy for your side. Then all you have to pay for is explosives and recruiting of a very talented pickpocket.

P.S. I'm kidding about palming. I know it has some awesome uses if you know how to use it right. I don't need 10 posts to justify its existence to me.

[bannockburn]

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Psychotic_Prankster

[Mantis]

Oh you know, you could just stalk people and find out who regularly visits the area you want destroyed and knock 'em out and have an area cranial bomb implanted.

Maybe hack a camera and watch them go about their normal day and when they're in a line or a good place to detonate and then pop. None of this time consuming brainwashing mess or moderately expensive implants.

Oh and if you implant multiple people, when the crowds are panicking and rushing for the exit, watching more people seemingly at random explode and take out more people while attempting to exit would soe a lot of terror in to the populous.

But that might be even more time consuming then brainwashing a few hobos.

Implanting a Cranial bomb still requires surgery of some sort. They aren't cheap either. The area bomb runs to 10,000¥ compared to a data jack and commlink for about 1,000¥.

[KarmaInferno]

Commlink + hot sim module + trodes + personafix, built into a helmet modified so it can be locked.

You can even install a remote detonate grenade in there.

Find bum, slap helmet on bum, instant fanatic soldier.




-k

[Jaid]

Commlink + hot sim module + trodes + personafix, built into a helmet modified so it can be locked.

You can even install a remote detonate grenade in there.

Find bum, slap helmet on bum, instant fanatic soldier.




-k

not much use if the guy actually looks visibly different.

just capture the bum, apply nanopaste trodes, and leave the other stuff in his pockets. or, if there are no pockets available, tape the rest to them underneath their clothes.

[_Pax._]

... sounds like a job for Gecko Tape ...

[Manunancy]

Depending on what your puppet is supposed to do, some sort of remote-contoled injector loaded with a berzerk drug of one stripe or another may be a good (and not overly expensive) extra in the package. It will improve the ppor schmuck's durability and ablity to cause damage and make him last a bit longerr before he goes down improving it's effectiveness.