Ruger thunderbolt vs ruger super warhawk. Options

[Stingray]

Both varieties of Smartgun require Armourer to install. And are you seriously attempting to argue that the internal smartgun doesn't take up any space?

..(Arsenal pg 148) ...the difference between the two of them( Accessories and modifications) is that accessories can be installed without requiring extensive mechanical
skill, while modifications requiring extensive mechanical knowledge.. ( (accessory)external version use mount and need armorer skill, no mention of (accessory)internal version however)

..by RAW accessories takes no slots, and Smartgun system, internal is listed among firearms accessories..
Modifications use slots, Accessories use mounts (while Smartgun system,internal (Firearms Accessorie version) do not use up , being internal)

[Thanee]

you only lost the slots in the arm for the weapon, the weapon itself has it's own mod slots again, if i remember this right

Yes, you do... but I meant the weapon taking too many slots in the arm. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Bye
Thanee

[Thanee]

Each to their own. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Of course, of course. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Just saying, that it's not just "better stats" for me, but also a style question (just a different answer to it).

Bye
Thanee

[Modular Man]

..Smartlink is firearms accessorie too, just paying cost of weapon(internal s-link) and saving 1 modification slot..
..Electronic Firing takes 2 slots, not 1..so that takes saved slot from smartlink..

Accessory isn't even necessary. You can buy a Thunderbolt pre-equipped with internal smartlink. That doesn't take slots and is cheaper than any alternative.

Apart from that, I have to second the notion that the internal smartgun described in "Arsenal" replaces the internal accessory of the same name and suddenly takes up modification slots. I think that this is what the following quote implies:

Smartgun System: This modification is the internal version of the smartgun system (pp. 311–312, SR4).

But we should take further discussion upon that subject to another thread so we do not derail this quite entertaining one.

[Stingray]

Accessory isn't even necessary. You can buy a Thunderbolt pre-equipped with internal smartlink. That doesn't take slots and is cheaper than any alternative.

Apart from that, I have to second the notion that the internal smartgun described in "Arsenal" replaces the internal accessory of the same name and suddenly takes up modification slots. I think that this is what the following quote implies:

But we should take further discussion upon that subject to another thread so we do not derail this quite entertaining one.

..SR4A is newer than Arsenal, so that point is moot..

[Stingray]

..hey, Modular Man.. any info about your pistol wielding charc..Race, awekened,any stats,gear??

[Temperance]

..SR4A is newer than Arsenal, so that point is moot..

I'd argue that it's not moot. The core book assumes basic rules without anything fancy. Every time something touching advanced rules shows up in SR4A, it references the appropriate book. In fact, if you look up Armor Modification, Gear Modification, Modification, Weapon Modification, and so on in the SR4A index, the rules reference is Arsenal, not SR4A. It does the same thing when you reference Weapon Accessories. This implies what is in Arsenal trumps SR4A. I'd go so far as to argue specific trumps general in this instance. To be fair, SR has not been known for it's consistency on this, so you may be right.

-Temperance

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

I'd argue that it's not moot. The core book assumes basic rules without anything fancy. Every time something touching advanced rules shows up in SR4A, it references the appropriate book. In fact, if you look up Armor Modification, Gear Modification, Modification, Weapon Modification, and so on in the SR4A index, the rules reference is Arsenal, not SR4A. It does the same thing when you reference Weapon Accessories. This implies what is in Arsenal trumps SR4A. I'd go so far as to argue specific trumps general in this instance. To be fair, SR has not been known for it's consistency on this, so you may be right.

-Temperance

However, if a weapon comes with modifications as part of the package, those modifications do not take up any slots, just as vehicles that come with Standard Modifications do not have any of their slots taken up by them. Says so right in Arsenal, If I remember correctly. They are DESIGNED that way, and therefore no slot was used. Case in point, if you Remove said Free Modification, you do not gain a Modification slot back for it. *shrug*

[Modular Man]

..hey, Modular Man.. any info about your pistol wielding charc..Race, awekened,any stats,gear??

Some kind of techie/mage and also an elf.
Average to low physical stats: Body and Strength on 2, so heavier guns than pistols can become quite an obstacle. No ambidexterity, either, just a pistol skill of 2 (Semiautomatics + 2) and smartlinked contact lenses, a tacnet is also very often in use.
Still, everybody needs a sidearm (or two or four). It comes in handy that the character in question is also the team's resident gunsmith, so he'll probably put those guns together himself. All in all, not the big action hero, rather fragile. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
That's the purpose of this gun design: Anybody with two hands can suddenly pack rather heavy pistol fire. Wide bursts can make hitting much easier. Hollowpoint rounds may be used to do extra damage, as explosive ammunition will probably ruin the sound suppressor's purpose.

[RHat]

..SR4A is newer than Arsenal, so that point is moot..

It does not reprint the modification rules, so the point is not moot.

[Nal0n]

CanRay the right tool is always a Panther Assault Cannon!
Pistols are for when you're playing nice.

Panther Assault? How 50's... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

Ares Thunderstruck Gauss Rifle modded for Burst fire and max. Recoil Comp, now that is cheesy AND SotA (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

( One time I had the cash AND the contacts to get one, but my group did not let me cause the GM threatened to give them to all NPC in high numbers if I'd ever do that... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)

[X-Kalibur]

However, if a weapon comes with modifications as part of the package, those modifications do not take up any slots, just as vehicles that come with Standard Modifications do not have any of their slots taken up by them. Says so right in Arsenal, If I remember correctly. They are DESIGNED that way, and therefore no slot was used. Case in point, if you Remove said Free Modification, you do not gain a Modification slot back for it. *shrug*

This point, right here. If a weapon comes with electronic firing, smartgun, and a flashlight it still has all 6 mod slots.