TM help please Options

[Raiden]

Hey, I wanted to make a Technomancer 750 karma build, 1 submersion / initiation allowed. I would like some advice, complex forms mostly, what do I need to get at start? what rating? whats the "b est" first echo. any other ways to boost my DPs in the skills dept.? just general help and info would be nice.

[phlapjack77]

There are a few threads about this, lemme try to dig them up:
Techno help 1
...well ok seems I only have one to offer (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

As for my advice, the only thing I can say is that Registering/Compiling sprites can be hella broken. For mages, Binding a spirit costs a lot of money. For technos, Registering a sprite is free. So your techno should have the max number of sprites registered, and they should all have infinity services available since you can keep rebinding and rebinding the sprites. The only thing it costs is time.

[SpellBinder]

Yeah, incredibly broken. Had a TM thread an Exploit form to bolster it, then called on a rating 6 sprite to add to it further. I know part of this next bit is luck, but with a DP of 19 for Hacking On The Fly he scored 9 hits followed by 7 hits to get an admin account in a DR 9 server node.

Otherwise there's the Widget Crafting or Biowire echos. Widget Crafting can take a lot of hours for a smaller and short term gain (they only last for a fixed 8 hours), but there are some widgets that bolster skills directly; the Debugger widget adds its rating to all Software tests, which does include threading, and Cheat adds to all Hacking tests. Biowire is for meat space, letting you take a copy of a skillsoft and thread a complex form for yourself to use.

[Raiden]

OK, so now I just want to ask, what is the "better" stream sprite wise, and what would a good paragon be, I was thinking 01 or black hat.

[phlapjack77]

Another good echo is Multiprocessing. Observe in Detail is a free action plus it grants an extra free action. If you build a dronomancer, combine this and the advantage (more than metahuman?) that lets you jump in and out of drones as a free action.

I personally also like the idea of the Skinlink echo. Maybe not as useful as other echoes, but in my mind it's just cool for the techno to be able to touch anything and hack it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Raiden]

ugh... after debats we are now starting with 600 karma or 320 BP, no submersions... HALP!. lol here is what I have so far.

[ Spoiler ]

== Info ==
Street Name:
Name: Unnamed Character
Movement: 10/25, Swim: 5
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 0
Public Awareness: 0
Human
Composure: 10
Judge Intentions: 8
Lift/Carry: 4 (15 kg/10 kg)
Memory: 8
Nuyen: 0

== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 1
REA: 1
STR: 1
CHA: 5
INT: 3
LOG: 3
WIL: 5
EDG: 2
RES: 6

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence: 6
Initiative: 4
IP: 1
Matrix Initiative: 7
Matrix IP: 3
Physical Damage Track: 10
Stun Damage Track: 11

== Active Skills ==
Armorer : 0 Pool: 2
Artisan : 0 Pool: 2
Compiling : 4 Pool: 10
Computer : 2 Pool: 5
Con : 0 Pool: 4
Cybercombat : 0 Pool: 2
Data Search : 0 Pool: 2
Demolitions : 0 Pool: 2
Disguise : 0 Pool: 2
Diving : 0 Pool: 2
Electronic Warfare : 1 Pool: 4
Etiquette : 0 Pool: 4
First Aid : 0 Pool: 2
Hacking : 6 Pool: 9
Instruction : 0 Pool: 4
Intimidation : 0 Pool: 4
Leadership : 0 Pool: 4
Navigation : 0 Pool: 2
Negotiation : 0 Pool: 4
Parachuting : 0 Pool: 2
Perception : 0 Pool: 2
Registering : 4 Pool: 10
Shadowing : 0 Pool: 2
Software : 4 Pool: 7
Survival : 0 Pool: 4
Tracking : 0 Pool: 2

== Knowledge Skills ==

== Qualities ==
Sensitive System
Signature
Technomancer

== Complex Forms ==
(Tradition: , Resist Fading with )
Armor Rating: 6
Attack Rating: 6
Exploit Rating: 6
Shield Rating: 6
Spoof Rating: 6
Stealth Rating: 6

== Weapons ==
Unarmed Attack
Pool: 0 DV: 1S AP: - RC: 0

== Commlink ==
Living Persona (3 (4), 3, 5, 3)
+Living Persona
+Biofeedback Filter Rating 5

still has 15 bp left. lemme know your thoughts, 5 bp are going to a paragon, either black hat or 01.

[phlapjack77]

Dumpstatting not one, not two, but three stats? That's a bold move (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I think if you read that thread I linked above, some of your questions would be answered.

[Raiden]

I did, it help a lot. lol. and yes, the GM is ok with that I asked. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) . just want any tips for helping out with a 320bp build :/

[Tanegar]

Dumpstatting not one, not two, but three stats? That's a bold move (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I think if you read that thread I linked above, some of your questions would be answered.

At 600 karma/320BP, he's up against the wall. I'd drop Resonance from 6 to 4 and bolster those stats, but that's just me. At minimum, I say buy another point of Agility; with Agi 1 you can't default on any combat skill, or a lot of physical skills, or most of the stealth skills. 320BP hurts. Out of curiosity, what was the debate?

[Raiden]

people wanting to try a ganger style, or, I mean, wanting to start at ganger levels, like completley new, I think I an going to drop res to 5, though that hurts so many ares >.< for that extra~30bp.

[Raiden]

after some more number crunching and ideas here is what I have with the 600 karma.

[ Spoiler ]

== Info ==
Street Name: 600 karma TM
Name: Unnamed Character
Movement: 10/25, Swim: 6
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 0
Public Awareness: 0
Elf
Composure: 11
Judge Intentions: 9
Lift/Carry: 4 (15 kg/10 kg)
Memory: 9
Nuyen: 0

== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 2
REA: 2
STR: 1
CHA: 6
INT: 3
LOG: 4
WIL: 5
EDG: 2
RES: 6

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence: 6
Initiative: 5
IP: 1
Matrix Initiative: 7
Matrix IP: 3
Physical Damage Track: 10
Stun Damage Track: 11

== Active Skills ==
Archery : 0 Pool: 1
Armorer : 0 Pool: 3
Artisan : 0 Pool: 2
Automatics : 1 Pool: 3
Blades : 0 Pool: 1
Clubs : 0 Pool: 1
Compiling : 4 Pool: 10
Computer : 1 Pool: 5
Con : 0 Pool: 5
Cybercombat : 1 Pool: 5
Data Search : 0 Pool: 3
Demolitions : 0 Pool: 3
Disguise : 0 Pool: 2
Diving : 0 Pool: 2
Dodge : 0 Pool: 1
Electronic Warfare : 1 Pool: 5
Escape Artist : 0 Pool: 1
Etiquette : 0 Pool: 5
First Aid : 0 Pool: 3
Forgery : 0 Pool: 1
Gunnery : 0 Pool: 1
Gymnastics : 0 Pool: 1
Hacking : 6 [Program or Device Type] Pool: 10 (12)
Heavy Weapons : 0 Pool: 1
Infiltration : 0 Pool: 1
Instruction : 0 Pool: 5
Intimidation : 0 Pool: 5
Leadership : 0 Pool: 5
Locksmith : 0 Pool: 1
Longarms : 0 Pool: 1
Navigation : 0 Pool: 2
Negotiation : 1 Pool: 7
Palming : 0 Pool: 1
Parachuting : 0 Pool: 2
Perception : 0 Pool: 2
Pilot Ground Craft : 0 Pool: 1
Pilot Watercraft : 0 Pool: 1
Pistols : 0 Pool: 1
Registering : 4 Pool: 10
Shadowing : 0 Pool: 2
Software : 4 Pool: 8
Survival : 0 Pool: 4
Throwing Weapons : 0 Pool: 1
Tracking : 0 Pool: 2
Unarmed Combat : 0 Pool: 1

== Knowledge Skills ==

== Qualities ==
Amnesia (Past)
Flashbacks (Common)
Low-Light Vision
Paragon (01)
Poor Self Control (Thrill Seeker)
Signature
Technomancer

== Complex Forms ==
(Tradition: Technoshamans, Resist Fading with CHA + RES (12))
Analyze Rating: 5
Armor Rating: 5
Attack Rating: 5
Command Rating: 5
Exploit Rating: 6 (Mute)
Shield Rating: 6
Spoof Rating: 5
Stealth Rating: 6

== Lifestyles ==
TM's modern life 1 months
Comforts: Middle
Entertainment: Middle
Necessities: Middle
Neighborhood: Low
Security: High
Qualities: Resonance Well [5LP]
AI in Residence [-3LP]
Crash Pad [-1LP]
Nosy Neighbors [-2LP]
Worse Neighbors [-1LP]

== Armor ==
Armor Jacket 8/6
+Fire Resistance 4
+YNT SoftWeave
Helmet 1/2
SecureTech Vitals Protector1/1

== Weapons ==
Ares Crusader
+Concealable Holster
+Laser Sight
+Gas Vent 2
Pool: 3 DV: 4P AP: - RC: 2
Unarmed Attack
Pool: 1 DV: 1S AP: - RC: 0

== Commlink ==
Hermes Ikon (4, 3, 3, 3)
+Iris Orb
+Suite: Pro User [Analyze 4, Browse 4, Command 2, Edit 4]
Living Persona (3 (4), 4, 5, 3)
+Living Persona
+Biofeedback Filter Rating 6

== Gear ==
Glasses Rating 4
+Vision Enhancement Rating 3
+Vision Magnification
+Flare Compensation
Respirator Rating 6

== Vehicles ==
GM-Nissan Doberman (Medium)
+Walker Mode
+Weapon Mount (Normal, External, Turret, Remote)
+Clearsight Rating 3
+Copy Protection Rating 3
+Registration
+Medium Drone Sensor
+Targeting (Self) Rating 3
+Copy Protection Rating 3
+Registration
Lone Star iBall (Minidrone)
+Chameleon Coating
+Gecko Tips
+Limited Maneuverability
+Spoof Chip
+Clearsight Rating 3
+Copy Protection Rating 3
+Registration
+Minidrone Sensor

[Tanegar]

people wanting to try a ganger style, or, I mean, wanting to start at ganger levels, like completley new, I think I an going to drop res to 5, though that hurts so many ares >.< for that extra~30bp.

You may want to raise the point with your GM that 320BP doesn't give you gangers as much as it gives you scrubs. IMO, the main difference between a runner and a ganger is gear: the runner has all the wiz toys, while the ganger has to make do with stuff he's scrounged or that "fell off the back of a truck."

[Raiden]

he capped nuyen at 50k lol. :3

[Tanegar]

*fascinating eyebrow* Well, if your GM's goal is to have characters that are competent (not awesome, but competent) at one thing and sucky-to-marginally-capable at everything else, I think your character shows that he's on the right track. Try to not die.

[Udoshi]

Yeah, incredibly broken. Had a TM thread an Exploit form to bolster it, then called on a rating 6 sprite to add to it further. I know part of this next bit is luck, but with a DP of 19 for Hacking On The Fly he scored 9 hits followed by 7 hits to get an admin account in a DR 9 server node.

This doesn't actaully work. If you thread a form, its rating is limited to twice resonance.
That limit still applies if you increase the CF rating in other ways, such as sprite assistance.

That being said, my group has houseruled it down a bit anyway

[SpellBinder]

I'm curious to where it is stated. Threading is quite clear about the limit as applied to threading a complex form to improve it, but Assist Operation calls it a boost and doesn't mention any limitation on how high a complex form's rating can go from it. Now if the sprite's boost was done first, then threading, I can see the Resonance x2 limit, but to me it's like First Aid & Healing. It's a matter of order of application.

[Udoshi]

If you're threading, you still have to follow all the rules for threading.

Nothing in Assist Operation negates the limit imposed by threading. Assist operation raises the rating - if it provided a dice pool bonus instead, this wouldn't be an issue - and makes it bump against the ceiling. Or gets cut off by the ceiling. Either way, order of operations doesn't matter since there's no way to undo the 2x resonance limit.

[SpellBinder]

And what if a TM doesn't thread a maximized complex form and the rating of a sprite for an Assist Operation is greater than the TM's Resonance attribute? Would you say that the threading limit still applies when the complex form isn't even threaded?

Honestly I'd say that if there was a single line in Assist Operation to specify one way or another that it too is limited to improving a complex form's rating to Resonance x2 or not, there'd be nothing further to discuss about.

[Udoshi]

If its pure Assist Operation, then I have no problem with it. Rating 6+ sprites are still pretty taxing to register.

However, again, we play under house rules where Resonance has an Augmented Max that servers as a cap for all CF's. so 9 would be the limit no matter how it was being increased. CF's are WAAAY cheaper though.

[SpellBinder]

Hey, no worries. I'm still gonna do my own thing with sprites and threading in my own games and such. I'm already sure we're not the only ones doing things these ways anyway. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

For Raiden, I'd suggest checking with your GM on his/her decision on this matter. It'll likely have an influence on what you do in the game.

[Udoshi]

I'm still gonna do my own thing with sprites and threading in my own games and such.

What have you fixed/altered, by the way?
My major surprise was learning the various sprite types often lack skills they need to use their software - particularly when it comes to decryption, that base action was changed in the transition to anniversary.

[SpellBinder]

Honestly, nothing of note with sprites; didn't really get deep into TMs until after SR4a was printed. Was really referring to our discussion on Threading/Assist Operation. If I had noticed any skill discrepancies to the CFs, then I would've just said that the sprite had the necessary skill to use the CF as intended anyway.

But if it ever came down to it, I have mulled the thought of having sprites be able to perform an Assist Operation only for complex forms that they too possess. For the above TM I mentioned (technically a story character), it was a crack sprite that did the Assist Operation.

[ShadowDragon8685]

In my experience, the best first echo a TM can get is the skinlink echo.

Suddenly, literally nothing is safe from hacking as long as you can touch it. Not even ancient Soviet ICBM hardware or whatever.

[RHat]

In my experience, the best first echo a TM can get is the skinlink echo.

Suddenly, literally nothing is safe from hacking as long as you can touch it. Not even ancient Soviet ICBM hardware or whatever.

It is also part of the Resonance Trodes/Mesh Reality/Acceleration combo, which takes quite a few echoes but can be wonderfully powerful.

[Raiden]

resonance trodes?