 Do Combat Spells Travel? |
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 Apr 29 2004, 03:26 PM
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#1
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Running Target  Group: Members Posts: 1,408 Joined: 31-January 04 From: Reston VA, USA Member No.: 6,046  |
I remember in SR2 the BBB describes combat spells as zipping from the caster to the target through astral space and materializing at the target. This allowed astrally present characters that were holding an action and close to the path of the spell the chance to try to 'intercept' the spell before it reached its destination and grounded out.
How has this changed in SR3? Do spells just materialize from the ether at the target, or are they somehow 'flung' from the caster to the target? |
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Apr 29 2004, 03:30 PM
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#2
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 669 Joined: 25-May 03 Member No.: 4,634 |
It seems they have changed. SR3 states, on page 182 (IIRC), that spells, in general, cause things to happen at the location of their target, and that any stuff inbetween the caster and the target is not relevent unless it impedes LOS. Elemental manipulations are an exception to this, explained on the same page.
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Apr 29 2004, 03:36 PM
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#3
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
Looks like they got rid of that. P 182 upper left: "The spell does not actually 'travel' though the glass- the caster manipulates mana to create an effect at the location of his target."
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Apr 29 2004, 03:39 PM
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#4
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
As said previously, combat spells do not travel while elemental manipulations do.
~J |
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Apr 29 2004, 03:53 PM
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#5
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,408 Joined: 31-January 04 From: Reston VA, USA Member No.: 6,046 |
hmmm... Ok, I know this is just a game mechanic, but I want to get a model in my mind for the way these things work.
M&M talks about drain being the result of the stress associated with channeling the mana/power through the mages body, and how cyber/bio interupt the flow of the power traveling through their body. But the SR3 says that the power doesn't show up at the mage's body, it shows up at the target. Anybody have a simple analogy to help me visualize this? |
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Apr 29 2004, 03:56 PM
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#6
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
Yes. Find brick wall. Lower head. Run towards wall. Wonderful visualization technique. Work with most SR rules. :D
Think of it sorta like paying some bruisers to beat some guy up. You don't 'do anything' the bruisers do, but they wouldn't have done anything if you hadn't paid them first. [edit] Well, that dosen't work to well, since the spell effect happens first. Darn, back to drawing board. [/edit] |
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Apr 29 2004, 04:00 PM
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#7
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,408 Joined: 31-January 04 From: Reston VA, USA Member No.: 6,046 |
But the bruisers walk from me (where they collected the money) to the victim... Maybe I just need to give up on trying to make magic 'make sense'. |
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Apr 29 2004, 04:03 PM
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#8
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,965 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Edinburgh, Scotland Member No.: 2,032 |
No, but I can confuse you further by telling you that the caster's aura shimmers with the energies of the spell as it is cast (P181, SR3).
One good analogy (I think someone came-up with it here in the past) was that you act like a broadcasting antenna, tuning your manna so that the target is the reciever. In retrospect it's not that good a metaphor because it dosen't explain why you need LOS to the target... Oh well. |
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Apr 29 2004, 04:05 PM
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#9
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
Nah you paid the brusiers with your credit card (haha, bruise now, payment later)
The brusiers come from where they are (astral space) to where the victim is. They don't come near you at all. Then the credit card company collects, in the form of drain... How's that :) |
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Apr 29 2004, 04:09 PM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 749 Joined: 22-June 02 From: Parts Without Member No.: 2,897 |
I'm sure we've talked about this before, but what is the feeling on how elemental manips travel? Yes, barriers block the spell, this we know. But _how_ does the spell travel? For example, a fireball cast at one end of a hallway against a target area at the other end of the hallway:
a) Shoots a tiny fireball down the center of the hall which explodes at the other end. b) Clears the hall of any and all life, as an F-meter diameter ball of flame scours every surface between caster and target. c) Usually hits the glass wall the evil GM put in the middle of the hall. Maybe the example makes less sense with fireball, but what about acid stream? Justify that..... :-) |
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Apr 29 2004, 04:12 PM
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#11
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,965 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Edinburgh, Scotland Member No.: 2,032 |
I go with tiny fireball.
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Apr 29 2004, 04:18 PM
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#12
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
A little tiny fireball with a happy face.
~J |
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Apr 29 2004, 04:19 PM
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#13
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Double-post, I smite thee!
~J |
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 Apr 29 2004, 05:07 PM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 214 Joined: 7-January 03 From: Wilton NH Member No.: 3,872 |
I'd say the mage is "actively" causing something to happen outside himself thus the need for drain tests. Space-Time, or newtonian physics don't really apply... its magic... so there is no need for any type of "physical" connection between mage and target... LOS is required so that he can focus his spell at the target's location. Think of it as surround sound, or tweaked sound waves that cancel themselves out everywhere but at the location of the target... Hmm... Maybe my explaination isn't working so well... Edit: Err maybe it does work... That explains the shimmering, and why astral barriars can stop spells... mages just put out vibes. |
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Apr 29 2004, 06:23 PM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 606 Joined: 17-December 03 Member No.: 5,909 |
P. 47 MiTS states that Magic CAN NOT alter space and/or time |
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Apr 29 2004, 06:31 PM
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#16
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,138 Joined: 10-June 03 From: Tennessee Member No.: 4,706 |
There's a difference between altering something and not being bound by something.
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Apr 29 2004, 06:36 PM
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#17
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
It can't alter the most basic aspects of space/time, but it is not restricted to following those laws. All Newtonian physics can be greatly affected by magic...
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Apr 29 2004, 06:39 PM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 606 Joined: 17-December 03 Member No.: 5,909 |
Ok ill buy that. but we need to be carefull on how we interpit the rules on how magic is affected by space and time because it could lead to some players cheesing the system.
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Apr 29 2004, 06:40 PM
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#19
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 518 Joined: 24-February 03 From: Tucson Member No.: 4,153 |
And spells can travel. They just need to purchase thier tickets ahead of time and show up at the airport at least 2 hours before departure. ;)
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Apr 29 2004, 06:46 PM
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#20
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Three hours for international travel.
~J |
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Apr 29 2004, 07:06 PM
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#21
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 214 Joined: 7-January 03 From: Wilton NH Member No.: 3,872 |
And dragon-forbid they happen to have a pair of toe-nail clippers in their carry-on.
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Apr 29 2004, 07:24 PM
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#22
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Decker on the Threshold Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,922 Joined: 14-March 04 Member No.: 6,156 |
Or a stethoscope. Or a reflex hammer (those little rubber hammers doctors use to test reflexes?) :eek:
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Apr 29 2004, 07:44 PM
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#23
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 518 Joined: 24-February 03 From: Tucson Member No.: 4,153 |
Sigh. I've created a monster. ;)
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Apr 29 2004, 08:02 PM
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#24
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 214 Joined: 7-January 03 From: Wilton NH Member No.: 3,872 |
Which actually brings up a good question... In Shadowrun, how does airline security check for awakened passengers?
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Apr 29 2004, 08:09 PM
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#25
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 518 Joined: 24-February 03 From: Tucson Member No.: 4,153 |
Welsome to UCAS sir. Do you have any magical foci to declare? No? Ok, move along. ;) |
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