 Traceless Walk, Alright, so I'm not Jesus, but... |
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 May 3 2004, 07:26 PM
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#26
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Traumatizing players since 1992  Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,282 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Las Vegas, NV Member No.: 220  |
I agree with Lime here wholeheartedly. how about it's magic and doesn't need an explanation.
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May 3 2004, 07:36 PM
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#27
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
Because every time someone uses that argument, someone else screams about how that's just a sissy cop out, and the game should rest on consistant laws of magic. By the books, the exact details of how these effects work varies from person to person. Each case is individual and the powers may manifest differently. The only important aspect about it, however, is the game mechanics of the power/spell/spirit power that are stated in the books and consistant. The rest is just style. I say "just style" because style should only get in game bonuses when the GM decides it should. Style should never have in game effects classified beforehand except when playing Munchkin D20 (the only game I know of that has a random hair style chart for PCs where each style gets specific advantages). |
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May 3 2004, 08:16 PM
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#28
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Traumatizing players since 1992 Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,282 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Las Vegas, NV Member No.: 220 |
I agree completely Herald. Especially since I don't see anything internally inconsistent with this power.
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May 3 2004, 08:26 PM
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#29
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 117 Joined: 29-April 04 Member No.: 6,291 |
Like Lime said, it's Magic. Consider it a constantly running check on everything the adept walks over. If it has the potential to leave a trace where he walks, he doesn't leave a trace there.
For instance, my take on the caltrop thing is that he stabs his foot (ice caltrop or not), it hurts him, but the blood doesn't come out of his foot. He's still got the injury, he's just not gonna die of blood loss because dripping blood from his feet would be a traceable walk. Pressure sensors going off also leave a trace of his walk, so he's in the clear there too. Land mines? Don't land mines use pressure sensors anyway, so isn't that the crux of the issue? Here's the guideline. Look at whatever the adept's walking on. Take away the trace. Leave everything else. Edit: I don't write so gud. |
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May 3 2004, 08:35 PM
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#30
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
You're nicer than I am. I'd have traceless walk negate footprints, but leave the blood-spoor.
It's traceless walk, not traceless bleed. Suppose an adept with TW has a hole in his pack, and there is flour/sawdust/marbles/chalkdust/small mice/water/ammo/dustbunnies leaking out? Does he leave a trail? I'd say yes. But no footprints. |
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May 3 2004, 08:37 PM
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#31
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
I have to agree; Time is more lenient than I'd be. Traceless Walk shouldn't staunch bleeding.
And, yeah, given that traceless walk makes pressure sensors incapable of detecting you, I'd apply the same to land mines. |
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May 3 2004, 08:40 PM
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#32
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
No argument there. Landmines _are_ pressure sensors, of a crude sort.
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May 3 2004, 11:13 PM
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#33
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 282 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 197 |
I rule that although the adept's weight does not affect the world, the world still affects the adept; i.e. the ability only blocks interactions in one direction. It acts like a buffer between the adept and the world. Adept wants to jump out of a three story window? Fine. The ability takes the place of the ground as far as the adept is concerned. His feet hit something that feels like the ground, and hits back just as hard, but the ground feels nothing. Adept walking on leaves: feet touch ability, ability touches back, but neither interacts with the ground at all.
edit: Had a more detailed explanation of how it works. Rewrote it completely, still wasn't satisfied, and deleted it. If you saw it already, ignore it. It was inaccurate. In trying to write out my explanation for traceless walk I realized I'm inconsistent in my own handling of it. I just use GM fiat to dictate its effects depending on what my own ideas on how it works (which I find impossible to articulate, apparently). Caltrops? You're gonna be hurting. Floor covered in nails about 1/4 in apart? No problem, do some jumping jacks. Re-edit: As a rule of thumb, I'd say a single surface of 1 in*in is enough to support the adept, or at least one point for every 1 in*in of foot surface. Just trying to find a rule that would encompass standing on a stack of quarters and a bed of nails, but not a caltrop. Of course, I'd still slice his foot off if he tried to walk across monowire, so that rule still doesn't cut it. :( |
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May 3 2004, 11:37 PM
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#34
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 117 Joined: 29-April 04 Member No.: 6,291 |
My take is, the magic allows the Adept perfect control of his feet, so his walk doesn't leave a trace. The no-bleed thing is just my take. Hey, he may bleed, maybe it's just invisible. Still picked up with stuff like infrared and magic senses, but it'll give him some confidence. As far as the trail of sand or marbles, he has control over his feet. It's Traceless Walk, not Traceless Leave-No-Evidence-Behind. You'd have to draw the line somewhere (your decision), otherwise they'll be conducting whole crimes without leaving any evidence or trace of their existence. |
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May 4 2004, 12:05 AM
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#35
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 282 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 197 |
Problem is, controlling your feet doesnt negate ground pressure. There has to be some manipulation of basic physical forces at work.
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May 4 2004, 01:58 AM
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#36
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 223 Joined: 3-February 04 Member No.: 6,054 |
so... would an adept with traceless walk and gecko crawl (quickened onto him) be able to scramble over a sleeping dragon? :|
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May 4 2004, 02:02 AM
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#37
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,616 Joined: 15-March 04 Member No.: 6,158 |
Sure. Traceless Walk and Gecko Crawl not necessary. Anyone can do that. Might not be the wisest thing, but anyone could do it.
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May 4 2004, 02:15 AM
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#38
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 586 Joined: 22-November 02 From: Gordonsville, Virginia, U.S.A. (or C.A.S.) Member No.: 3,630 |
You know, the mention of land mines reminds me of a book I read several (I think at least 20) years ago.
It was a non-fiction account of combat in the European Theater during World War II. A member of the commander's new platoon (the new C.O. was assigned to replace someone who'd been killed or sent home due to injuries, I believe) had, at some time prior to the new commander being assigned, successfully "blazed a trail" through an enemy minefield by running through it so quickly that all the mines exploded AFTER he was past them. I believe that the soldier in question had a pre-war background in Track & Field, but I can't remember. I believe, although I am not entirely certain (I don't know if the book was that specific), that he also shed ALL of his gear except his uniform, helmet, and boots to cut down on encumbrance. Just thought you'd be interested. As the saying goes, fact is often stranger than fiction. :) --Foreigner |
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 May 4 2004, 02:33 AM
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#39
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 282 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 197 |
I really hope someone tries that in one of my games. What's the damage code for running into monowire again? :dead:
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May 4 2004, 03:04 AM
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#40
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 117 Joined: 29-April 04 Member No.: 6,291 |
The main issue I have with arguments like this is, it's magic. I promise I don't mean to be a smartass about this, because some people just want to rationalize things out. But with magic, I'm under the impression that you simply can't. Otherwise, it wouldn't be magic. There is no reason at all why the PAdept doesn't make noise when he walks, it's magic. Thus all this talk about "absorbing the pressure from the feet and transferring through any pressure from the ground in a 1-to-1 force ratio" talk is pretty hard to work through. |
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May 4 2004, 06:11 PM
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#41
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
That's awesome! It's certainly believable, depending on the type of mine. Like maybe a Bouncing Betty or something similar. The only unbelievable part is anyone having the marbles to actually do it! explanation: Bouncing Betty (I'm almost sure of the name and operation, although there are many here who are in a position to correct me on this) - land mine that fires a small explosive charge up to waist/groin level and detonates a small charge. Designed to wound, not to kill. The idea is a dead soldier is gone; one less man on the field. A wounded soldier must be cared for; three less men on the field. |
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May 4 2004, 08:53 PM
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#42
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 586 Joined: 22-November 02 From: Gordonsville, Virginia, U.S.A. (or C.A.S.) Member No.: 3,630 |
Moon-Hawk:
I believe the mine in question is the German "S"-mine. "Bouncing Betty" was the derisive nickname bestowed upon it by American soldiers. However, I'm reasonably certain that there have been similar mines used in warfare over the years. IIRC, the device in question usually had trigger mechanisms (pressure sensors) arrayed in a semi-circular or circular pattern around it, roughly a meter away from the mine itself--one meter being the approximate stride length of a man of average height, i.e., 5' 6" to 5' 8" (1.68 to 1.73 Meters). The intended victim would step on the trigger, firing a small explosive charge placed directly beneath the mine itself. After a delay of a fraction of a second--long enough for the mine itself to be propelled up to roughly waist-high--the main charge would detonate, discharging the mine's cargo--hundreds of one-half-centimeter ball bearings--for a distance of approximately twenty-five yards (22.86 Meters) in any direction. In one story I remember reading about the D-Day landings (Normandy, France, June 6, 1944), one fellow walked by another soldier who had apparently fallen victim to an S-mine. The man in question, still very much alive at that point, was in a seated position, propped up with his back against a tree, with his midsection heavily bandaged--and calmly spitting up ball bearings. --Foreigner |
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May 4 2004, 09:04 PM
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#43
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
_I_ wouldn't be all that calm about having my midsection turned to hamburger. And I'd sure as hell not be able to calmly spit up the ball bearings that _turned_ my midsection to hamburger. Something about the way that the muscles and organs I need to _do_ that feat have been turned into hamburger.
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May 4 2004, 09:11 PM
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#44
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 260 Joined: 20-March 04 From: That really good state. Yeah, you know the one... Member No.: 6,177 |
If he was suffering from shock(which I'm sure he was) it would be possible that he was feeling no pain whatsoever and could be quite detached about his injuries.
[EDIT] Also if he was bandaged someone must have treated him, most likely doping him up something fierce in the process :) [/EDIT] |
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May 4 2004, 09:22 PM
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#45
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Yup, most light anti-personnel land mines in use by well-funded armies are bouncing these days. However, the delay on those isn't anywhere near long enough to allow someone to run outside the lethal radius. Once your leg is off the mine, you've got half a second at best, more likely 0.2-0.3 seconds. And I'm sure all of you've seen pictures from Africa or South-East Asia of people who've walked into non-bouncing light land mines. Those don't kill either, you just lose a leg or two, or three. However, I've seen some references to pressure-triggered anti-personnel land mines weighing ~6kg. I'm pretty sure that's a guaranteed kill. :) Pressure-triggered mines are mostly a thing of the past, though. Trip wires, or a wire pulled by a soldier, are becoming more and more common. Vibration-triggered mines are in the works. Heat or magnetic field sensing mines would likely be quite common by the 2060s. This post has been edited by Austere Emancipator: May 4 2004, 09:25 PM |
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