Run Faster is up! Options

[nylanfs]

http://www.shadowruntabletop.com/2014/12/r...rint-pre-order/

[hermit]

Sum to 10, but no Karma buy. Hrm. Also, what the hell happened on page 5 of the ToC. Is this in the PDF too or only in the preview?

[BlackJaw]

Table of contents is up at Drive Through RPG:
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/pdf_preview_...1788-sample.pdf

Going purely on the table of contents there is a lot there I expected, with a few surprises.

Mostly, however, I'm very curious about Black Market Pipeline. Can my T-Bird character use it to reduce the price of his ride at character creation? In other words, did they make any major changes to it from the 4th edition version of it?

[Prime Mover]

http://www.shadowruntabletop.com/2014/12/r...rint-pre-order/

Fire up the e-reader and zip up your fire resistant armor Jacket!

Edit: Oops missed sticky above.

[Prime Mover]

Quick flash through.
1. First half of book is about third reused art.
2. New art is good to great.
3. No art representations of meta type variants, which weren't so hot in last edition.
4. Eye catchers archetypes, contacts and gear packs.
5. Pile of new qualities....gonna go make my infected dwarf flagellant now.

[Prime Mover]

Table of contents is up at Drive Through RPG:
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/pdf_preview_...1788-sample.pdf

Going purely on the table of contents there is a lot there I expected, with a few surprises.

Mostly, however, I'm very curious about Black Market Pipeline. Can my T-Bird character use it to reduce the price of his ride at character creation? In other words, did they make any major changes to it from the 4th edition version of it?

BMP Adjusts buy/sell price on one class of item. Vehicle, weapon, etc...

[adamu]

Sum to 10, but no Karma buy. Hrm. Also, what the hell happened on page 5 of the ToC. Is this in the PDF too or only in the preview?

Actually, Sum to 10, and Karma buy system, AND this cool new modular karma buy based on your character history.

[adamu]

This is chock full of some very fun stuff, both in terns of fluff and crunch.

Obviously have only had time to skim, but one disappointment is the "packs." About half are just single items! Many more are just two items. Since there is no discount for such combination purchases, what is the point?

But seems that most of the old qualities from previous editions are back, along with some cool new ones.

And lifestyle customization looks good.

[hermit]

Actually, Sum to 10, and Karma buy system, AND this cool new modular karma buy based on your character history.

Oh, by "point buy" they mean Karma? Or did I just miss it entirely? And how does the system based on character history work, like in CP2020?

[adamu]

Oh, by "point buy" they mean Karma? Or did I just miss it entirely? And how does the system based on character history work, like in CP2020?

Yeah, Point Buy is karma-based.
The old point buy where everything has a separate chargen cost is gone.

Don't know Cyberpunk…the modular thing is also karma buy, but after you buy race you buy things like Nationality, childhood background, education, professional experience, all at different costs and with different additions to atts, skills and qualities. Then you use what's left at the end to round your character out.

[hermit]

Ah, so it's an expanded PACKS system basically. With stuffbook options for more and different nations and professions. Nice idea at least, have to see it for myself though.

Calling Karma Generation Point buy is ... kinda misleading. Not that I really miss point buy ... but it's kinda odd.

[Sengir]

the modular thing is also karma buy, but after you buy race you buy things like Nationality, childhood background, education, professional experience, all at different costs and with different additions to atts, skills and qualities. Then you use what's left at the end to round your character out.

So basically modules are character properties like attributes, and PACKs are gear?

And since a lot of the proposed backgrounds are ex corp types, is there any mention of them being ostracized as in the description of the Corp SIN quality?

[Sendaz]

SINnerRun™

Where thanks to a sick bet between the AAA's, EVERYONE in the party is CorpSINners kicked to the curb in the middle of the Barrens by their respective corps with a built in transponder constantly broadcasting their SIN status & POV(Scrambled signal streaming Full Sight and Sound back to their masters to watch, no silent mode and attached to a cranial bomb to ensure nobody shuts it down or they go boom) and are forced to band together out of sheer self-preservation just to survive the harsh streets.

Watch their wacky antics as The Suits Meet the Mean Streets on Pay Per View Channel 243 now.

[hermit]

I'd watch that. I might steal it.

[Sendaz]

And since a lot of the proposed backgrounds are ex corp types, is there any mention of them being ostracized as in the description of the Corp SIN quality?

The Burned Company Man only has a fake SIN 4, no Corp SIN of any kind.

Of the others that have a SIN these are National level.

So they pulled a TJ Fallacy and avoided the issue. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

But do not let that stop you from looking at this product. Lots of good stuff here, really liked the Infected writeup.

And the Netcat/Toaster shipping fiction makes it's long awaited debut, if only in small snippets. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

I'd watch that. I might steal it.

Please do.... it makes good background noise, like the old 'I'd buy that for a Dollar' ads in Robocop.

Goofy but sort of gave a feel for just how messed up the setting was.

[hermit]

Please do.... it makes good background noise, like the old 'I'd buy that for a Dollar' ads in Robocop.

Goofy but sort of gave a feel for just how messed up the setting was.

I absolutely love those and use similar background noise anyway. SINnerRun™ will definitly make an appeareance.

[Medicineman]

Obviously have only had time to skim, but one disappointment is the "packs." About half are just single items! Many more are just two items. Since there is no discount for such combination purchases, what is the point?

to fill up Pages ?
When I've seen them I was wondering myself and started a Thread in the German Forums
but no Answer to why there's 24 Pages of Equipment and Ammo Lists and Cyberware combinations.
But its still too early for a satisfying analysis so far
I just hope CGL doesn't continue this kind of business conduct or the Last 124 Pages of a future Seattle Sourcebook might be a List from the Telephonebook Seattle 2075

JahtaHey
Medicineman

[Sendaz]

I thought the explanation in the book was fairly clear

In an effort to make this process easier, we have
pre-assembled character kits (PACKs) that allow you to
quickly and easily make new characters by offering a
collection of gear with pre-calculated nuyen and Karma
costs. The collections presented here meet specific
themes, as listed in the title, to help you quickly and
easily build your vision for a character. The nuyen and
Karma costs are listed with the title; in all cases the nuyen
is evenly divisible by 2,000, so each PACK can be
wholly purchased with the specified amount of Karma
at character creation if desired. PACKs frequently note
Availability for ease of reference.

It's not about offering a discount, thought might have been nice, but rather they were just giving easy to grab bits to fill out a equipment list.

I see it more useful for a beginner player who just wants to grab and go whereas a more experienced player will probably have their own tastes and would customize their gear list much more than what they offer.

Also a GM could use this for stocking NPCs fairly easily.

Maybe this would have been better in the Starter Box Set, but I do not see a problem with it being here.

As for the telephone book, yeah that would be a bit inane, but I would not mind them doing 1-2 pages of AR style ads from the Seattle Bell Virtual CommBook as image filler. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

[Grinder]

But - assuming other posters are correct, as I haven't purchased the PDF yet - is the point of having "packs" with only one or two items in it?

[Sendaz]

Edit: fixed small spelling errors as seem to have Ork thumbs this morning

Streamlining numbers I imagine, for example one single item Ammo pack is the 160 rounds of Gel ammo for 2,000 yen or 1 Karma.

Remember it said they did everything for the packs in increments of 2K cash.

So picture a player who bought his weapon and wants to grab some gel ammo. He could just buy as normal but the Pack gives him a set amount of ammo for the preset 2k so if he was using packs along the character process it slots in nicely where if he went and bought 100 or 150 round (two common choices as humans like round numbers) he may end up with bits of loose change at the end and just not as efficient use of assets.

Again I see this more for newer players, though even experienced players might use this for one off runs or such when they just need a fast chargen.

[Medicineman]

As for the telephone book, yeah that would be a bit inane, but I would not mind them doing 1-2 pages of AR style ads from the Seattle Bell Virtual CommBook as image filler. nyahnyah.gif

1 Page would be Great especially with AR Advertising !
It would give Players a tangible Feel for Shadowrun (like the Chromebooks for Cyberpunk 2020 did)
but It would be bad if it would be just a filler to bloat up a book

So picture a player who bought his weapon and wants to grab some gel ammo.

I'd get me a calculator and punch in the Numbers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
(but I'm used to do a lot of things myself)

Again I see this more for newer players,

OK, jup it may be a Help for Newbs playing Shadowrun for the first few Times, but after that.... Its a waste of precious space which could be used for better things like f.E. Depictions of the Metaraces (ImO)
these Packs Lists would be much better suited in the Beginners Box ( and not only 24 but 48 or even more Pages)

with an independant AR Dance
Medicineman

[Sengir]

But do not let that stop you from looking at this product.

I'll definitely read it, since I decided this will be the product which sinks the edition or makes it swim for me, especially the chargen section.


Also, no televised death sport is complete without K-10...

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

The Burned Company Man only has a fake SIN 4, no Corp SIN of any kind.

Of the others that have a SIN these are National level.

So they pulled a TJ Fallacy and avoided the issue. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

But do not let that stop you from looking at this product.

Not a fallacy to completely ditch the thing that ties you to the Corporation, in whatever manner that is appropriate. Obviously, the Ex-Company man managed to purge his files before he left, thus eliminating that link. I applaud his foresight. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Sendaz]

1 Page would be Great especially with AR Advertising !
It would give Players a tangible Feel for Shadowrun (like the Chromebooks for Cyberpunk 2020 did)
but It would be bad if it would be just a filler to bloat up a book

I loved Cyberpunk 2020 for the ads and such. Really added to the atmosphere.

I'd get me a calculator and punch in the Numbers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
(but I'm used to do a lot of things myself)

same for myself, but you know what these kids are like nowadays. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) *shakes his kids at the script kiddies* Get off my LAN!

OK, jup it may be a Help for Newbs playing Shadowrun for the first few Times, but after that.... Its a waste of precious space which could be used for better things like f.E. Depictions of the Metaraces (ImO)
these Packs Lists would be much better suited in the Beginners Box ( and not only 24 but 48 or even more Pages)

with an independant AR Dance
Medicineman

I do agree it may have been better used in the Beginners box as that would be the first step for many new players where as I see Run Faster more geared toward players with more than a few runs under the belt and looking more for new options and probably already have an idea of what gear they want in any case.

Not a fallacy to completely ditch the thing that ties you to the Corporation, in whatever manner that is appropriate. Obviously, the Ex-Company man managed to purge his files before he left, thus eliminating that link. I applaud his foresight. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

But this is where it gets weird as the description for the Burned Company Man is as follows:

After years of training, years of operating on the company’s
behalf, and years of absolute loyalty, for some reason
the burned company man was blacklisted.
He barely had enough time to retrieve his emergency go-bag; all of his
accounts were frozen, right when he had the heat on his six.
Good thing he kept one account off the books for just such
an emergency. Now all he has is a go bag and some spare
cred, just enough to secure some drekhole to use as a new
base of operations.

So he had a back up SIN to use, but by the description above he probably DIDN'T have time to wipe out his Corp Files himself as he was already on the run.

This implies that the Corp for whatever reason lost/destroyed his Corp SIN because he was blacklisted and thus taken off their books.

Which raises the question, when the Corp screws you over and tosses you to the curb, do they just delete your Corp SIN automatically(instead of putting a black mark on it to show he is on their files but not in their good graces) so nobody can see your past and if so, that seems to be a bit different than the description of the Corp SIN in core.

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

But this is where it gets weird ...

So he had a back up SIN to use, but by the description above he probably DIDN'T have time to wipe out his Corp Files himself as he was already on the run.

This implies that the Corp for whatever reason lost/destroyed his Corp SIN because he was blacklisted and thus taken off their books.

Which raises the question, when the Corp screws you over and tosses you to the curb, do they just delete your Corp SIN automatically(instead of putting a black mark on it to show he is on their files but not in their good graces) so nobody can see your past and if so, that seems to be a bit different than the description of the Corp SIN in core.

I see what you mean. Don't have the book as of yet, so I cannot actually form any other comment. Hmmmmm..... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/frown.gif)