Salted Wounds [OOC], a Deep Black Sea game Options

[Gilga]

They never make it easy... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Jack_Spade]

Isn't teamwork cumulative with the bonus from the medkit?

Bye
Thanee

Yes, but in that case you are using the medkit and the drone is just assisting you.

That would look like this: Log+Skill+Medkit+Teamwork bonus dice

[Thanee]

Ah, yes, that's what I meant. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Bye
Thanee

[Thanee]

@Gilga: I'm preeeeetty sure, you cannot pick the same optional power twice. But it does not seem to actually say anything about it (just checked the part about summoning), so maybe you can. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Bye
Thanee

[Jack_Spade]

It isn't the same power if you chose two different spells.

[Thanee]

Ok. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Bye
Thanee

[Luckace]

Wish you a pleasant holiday.

[Volker]

Uhm, now I'm confused. You keep talking about medkits but a medkit doesn't provide extra dice. According to the CRB, an autodoc drone adds its rating to my dice pool, but I find nothing about what exactly an autodoc is or how I make a drone become an autodoc. Giving it the medicine autosoft would just enable it to make teamwork tests, but still it wouldn't provide extra dice, would it?

[Jack_Spade]

It's not just you who is confused. Those rules are clear as mud thanks to them not making a clear distinction between the capabilities of a Medkit and an Autodoc.

This is my interpretation:

A Medkit - at least one of R4 and above - is used both for First Aid and Medicine tests and therefore adds its rating to these tests' limits as well as the tests' dicepools, provided wireless is on.
The only thing stopping a medkit from being an autodoc is the lack of hands. You could mod a pair of arms on a medkit and receive an autodoc.
The Caduceus from B&B is an R4 Autodoc although it's pilot rating is only 2, which means to me it has an integrated R4 Medkit that is assisted by an R2 drone.
The frankly better option is to have a normal Anthrodrone with First Aid and Medicine Autosofts as a basis. In theory that could function already as a medic, albeit with the negative mods for lack of equipment.
Now you add an R6 Medkit. If you let the R6 Medkit take charge, you get an Autodoc that operates with 2*R=12 dice on its own.
If you let the drone take charge you get a dp of Pilot Rating + Autosoft Rating + Medkit Rating.

If you just want it to assist you, and you let the Medkit be in charge of the drone, you get just the +R dice to your LOG+Medicine test
If you take the Medkit yourself but also instruct the drone to assist you, you get your Log+Medicine+Medkit Rating + whatever teamwork check the drone manages, up to your skill.

[Thanee]

Sounds reasonable.

Bye
Thanee

[Thanee]

@Gilga: About spells and auras on the astral... I'm afraid, the "christmas tree analogy" is quite true.

Here's the most relevant part (SR5 312-313).

Without attempting to read an aura, you can still get an impression of what type of aura it is (spell, ritual, spirit, living creature, foreboding horror from beyond all mortal ken, etc.).

Like physical perception, you don’t need to make a test to see things that are immediately obvious (and since astral forms are bright and vibrant, this means that most astral forms are easy to spot).

Essentially, everything that is active on the astral (astral or dual-natured beings, spells, foci, etc.) has its own aura and is "bright and vibrant".

Also, just looking at it (no Assensing needed) reveals the general type (it's a person, spirit, focus, spell, etc.).


Astral signatures are something different (the 3 hits on Assensing stuff). That means, that you can determine the signature of the astral entity, i.e. its fingerprint (or that of its creator). For example, if you have 3 hits while assensing one of Wraith's spells or spirits, you will learn, that the spell or spirit belongs to Wraith (assuming you have asssensed him in the past and got 3+ hits to learn his signature).


What you need to "hide" spells like you described, is the Masking Metamagic (SR5 p. 326) with the Extended Masking Metamagic (Street Grimoire p. 149).

Bye
Thanee

[Volker]

It's not just you who is confused. Those rules are clear as mud thanks to them not making a clear distinction between the capabilities of a Medkit and an Autodoc.

This is my interpretation:

A Medkit - at least one of R4 and above - is used both for First Aid and Medicine tests and therefore adds its rating to these tests' limits as well as the tests' dicepools, provided wireless is on.
...

Okay, thanks for clarification.

[Gilga]

Well, the quote you use is for mana spells cast on the astral plane. In this case, I agree they are astral forms. However, people and spells cast on the physical plane are not astral forms, they have auras but they do not interact with the astral plane in any way. So, a spell is no more vibrant than a person, and an awakened (not perceiving person) is no more vibrant than a mundane. I understand that you can tell if it is a spell or a person or a spirit without rolling assensing... Still, if it is close enough to see the spell it can also see the person.

[Volker]

Not quite. The spell is also on the physical plane, but not exclusively there. According to the CRB, p282, the mana is channeled into the physical world. If you sustain a spell, you currently stream mana into the physical world. There is a constant connection to the astral plane.

[Thanee]

Every spell is active on the astral plane, even physical spells. Similar to a dual-natured being or a spirit.

Bye
Thanee

[Volker]

Yep, and everything that's dual-natured is easily spotted in the astral room.
That's why it's driving bnc mad that you just keep running around as a dual-natured being without taking any precautions.


By the way: James is with us. The only thing she left behind (grudgingly) is the rotodrone because it needs to be recharged.

[Gilga]

Spells on the physical plane (even mana spells) are clearly not dual natured, they cannot be dispelled or countered or interacted with from the astral plane.

[Thanee]

That is not entirely true.

They can be assenesed, and I am not quite sure whether or not they can be dispelled, but I would think so.

Also, they do interact with mana barriers.

Essentially, everything that is magical exists in the astral space. In some cases (mages or foci) only when it is "active", in most cases (spells, spirits, etc), all the time.

Bye
Thanee

P.S. I do not agree with bnc, however, that it is a good idea to not be astrally perceiving. Even just being a living entity is rather obvious on the astral, and if you cannot see anything there, whatever is there is at a huge advantage. Like that watcher. If Anna was not astrally perceiving, she had no chance to notice it, while it could easily spot us.

[Volker]

ad PS: That's why I wrote "without taking any precautions". To hide behind a (live) tree and take a short glimpse now and then is entirely different from walking around dual-natured all the time.

[Jack_Spade]

From my GM perspective it's as follows:

Spells cast on the mundane world are visible just as the aura of a mundane person would be. They can only be dispelled by someone on the mundane plane and stopped by mana barriers that are active on the mundane in contrast to those active only on the astral (dual natured barriers obviously catch spells on both planes).

As for using influence on a watcher: That's a bit iffy, since they are constructs and not really alive. Still, they've got the stats so I guess they are susceptible. BUT:
Watchers stay in contact with their masters through telepathy - they don't need to report back physically. A more promising and less suspicious influence would be to have it check out a different corner of the cemetery.

[Gilga]

Well, thanks for the safe. I really am not sure what the proper way to handle a watcher other than influence... I mean, if we kill it we alert the mage, and it is very difficult to sneak past it - (for everyone but James).


@Volker - I think that the snow provides very good cover as astral visibility is only 50 meter. (whereas mundane is only 20 meters). Thus, no matter what we do - nothing can spot us from a mile and be in our location in a few seconds.
In these conditions, hiding seems unnecessary for me - anything we encounter is by chance rather than design, and astral forms can enter from all directions so not much to hide. Also, Anna has a summoned spirit - that has to remain in the astral, (and so is Wraith but he avoids confrontations). So whatever we do, we have astral forms with us...

[Volker]

Out of interest, as I'll be GMing soon, too:

Spells cast on the mundane world are visible just as the aura of a mundane person would be. They can only be dispelled by someone on the mundane plane and stopped by mana barriers that are active on the mundane in contrast to those active only on the astral (dual natured barriers obviously catch spells on both planes).

Is this your interpretation or is it stated somewhere as an official rule?

[Jack_Spade]

p.281 core
"A magician in the physical world can only cast spells
on targets that are in the physical world. Similarly, a
magician in astral space can only cast spells on targets
that are present in astral space (though auras of things
in the physical world can be seen, auras alone cannot
be targeted). If you’re using astral perception (or you are
otherwise dual-natured), you can cast spells on targets
in either the physical world or astral plane. Only mana-
based spells work in astral space, even if you’re in the
physical world astrally perceiving the target."

[Volker]

Okay, so the dispelling thing is basically your interpretation as this doesn't say a thing about whether or not spells are "dual-natured" or astral. But I think it's still a valid interpretation.

[Jack_Spade]

Correct.