Killin' Hands, ...and you Options

[Kayne]

The hallmark of the close quarters adept: Killing Hands. But how exactly does this power work in the world of Shadowrun. Is it a transfer of destructive energy, like some sort of anti-reiki, or something more along the lines of the Tae Kwon Do/Karate practice of punching through people, like the late Mas Oyama, who killed three bulls with his bare hands.

So, fellow dumpshockers, what's your take on Killing Hands?

[SunRunner]

All of the above. It works the same way a combat spell works - inflicting (enhancing) damage with magic. It really depends on the Adept in question, and how the Adept views their powers and how they function.

[Ancient History]

The actual effect is independant of the way the adept visualizes it working. You can imagine the magic makes your hands as hard as steel, or that a jolt of deadly astral energy weaves into your opponent's aura, or that you hit them at the exact point where they break. Any or all of them could be true, or not--the effect is the same.

[Cain]

I've had a character who made bone spurs pop out from his hands; I've done a lot of the traditional "green glowing energy", and at least one who did them as nerve strikes. Oh, and an experimental character who thought it was a result of his orichalcum bone lacing.

[mfb]

my favorite is my tech-oriented adept who uses killing hands + distance strike to create laser beams, micro-rockets, and other staples of mecha anime.

[Nylan]

When my groups plays, and someone does the Killing Hands + Distance Strike we go with the Ryu/Ken fireball thing...just for some flare. I think we let him learn it easier because it was always so visible....hmm.

[Smiley]

I've always pictured it as using your own energy/aura to inflict more damage with a punch. Which is why you can choose not to fully annihilate an opponent and just do normal unarmed damage. Here's the question, though: Does it work while you're wearing shock gloves?

[GrinderTheTroll]

[Rev]

I'm all for allowing people to choose a special effect for ther killing hands, as long as it is always on. Just be sure you tell them that when they choose.

[BitBasher]

If someone in my game takes an obvious power like that I allow that to fulfill a gaesa too. It is after a pretty decent disadvantage compared to someone that can do it stealthily.

[GrinderTheTroll]

[Smiley]

I agree. If killing hands was just a matter of knowing where to hit, someone could take that as a knowledge skill or something. to me, it's all about the adept putting some serious magical hurtin' on some poor schmuck.

[GrinderTheTroll]

[Smiley]

Knowing where to strike and how hard is included in your skill. If you have unarmed at 2, you know that you clout someone until they fall down. If you have Wildcat at 12, you know all the little points and nerves to strike. My opinion, anyway.

[Rory Blackhand]

The way I view Killing Hands is that the adept is able to generate and focus a tremendous magical burst of ki energy that even the most dedicated martial arts "mundane" master is unable to match. This magical energy is generated internally with no outward displays (which doesn't mean I am opposed to them, or taking a geasa with them, you can have the theme music from Mortal Combat emanate from the adept every time he uses killing hands for all I care. Why limit effects to just visual ones?). I like to think of it as a killing "vibration" that the adept adds to whatever kinetic energy he is able to generate in his mundane strike. If you see my point here you will notice that the power level of an adept's strike is a completely separate issue from his Killing Hands ability.

The best way I can explain this is that the magical energy of an adept in combat is kind of gathered and stored in the adept's midsection where it builds until the adept attempts a strike. A strike generates kinetic energy as power is generated in the midsection, transferred to the hips, to the shoulder, to the arm, and then released on contact with the target. When the adept strikes the magical energy creates a deadly vibration to this mundane kinetic energy of the adept's strike. Not every adept has the same strength so trying to link Killing Hands to the power of an attack makes no sense at all.

If you follow what I am saying, the power level of an adept's strike is not what Killing Hands effects. It is the damage level only. Similar to a radio wave broadcast, the adept is able generate a magical killing vibration to tune the power of the broadcast/punch into something that kills the listener/target. This would explain why a strength 3 adept is not as likely to make a kill as a strength 6 adept is. Killing Hands ability only adds a certain kill frequency or vibration to a strike, it has absolutely nothing to do with the power level of the strike. A radio station can increase the wattage of it's transmission to generate a much more powerful signal, but this has absolutely nothing to do with the frequency of the signal. Same thing as an adept's Killing Hands ability. In this way adepts of different physical strengths can create different powered Killing Hands attacks. Otherwise it is my opinion that the developers would have made each Killing Hands attack do a set amount of damage.

This means that Bone Lacing and Hard Liner Gloves would add to a Killing Hands attack. Those items, for whatever reason, add to the power of unarmed attacks. Killing Hands does not affect power level. It affects damage level only, so it is separate. And if you didn't allow Bone Lacing or Hard Liner Gloves to add to the power level of a killing hands attack how could you justify Muscle Augmentation or the bioware equivalent either? Or Enhance Attribute, Strength spell when Improved Reaction is not stackable with reaction enhancing spells either, for example?

I think the best way to play it is to keep the power level a separate issue. Nowhere in the spell does it say power level is a factor.

This brings up Delayed Damage. If an adept is able to just touch the target then no physical force was generated. I would argue that it is then a mental stat that is used to generate the power of the attack. I would say Willpower. At least with the "obvious" Delayed Damage version the physical energy was generated and transferred to the target. Same with Distance Strike. The way I play it is the adept has to sort of shadow box thru the motion of an attack exactly as he would to make a normal attack in order to be able to send the physical energy into the air towards the target. If not then it is a mental attribute that should be used as the base power of the attack.

[mfb]

indeed. however, i don't have a problem with an adept who explains his killing hands as being a greater knowledge of pressure points and weak spots, etcetera. the fluff for killing hands is whatever you want it to be.

[Rory Blackhand]

Well said mfb. It is just fluff.

I wouldn't get my panties in a bunch thinking the players are munchkins just because the team's phys ad put on a pair of Hardliners for an extra +1 power level to his punches when he goes out in his Vashon Island suit.

[Kagetenshi]

I'd get my panties in a bunch because those gloves don't go with that suit! ;)

~J

[Smiley]

What if they're TRES CHIC hardliners?

[toturi]

Cast a Fashion 6 on that pair of Shockgloves and they are soooo tres chic...

[Siege]

That's why a Tailor contact comes in handy.

-Siege

[RangerJoe]

Once gave some PCs I was GMing a contact in the form of a mall custom-hat kiosk guy-- the guy who runs one of those stands with the automated stitching machines and all the different colored threads.

"You want a Mitsuhama subsidiary's corporate security logo? Okay. On what color shirt. Okay. Come back in an hour."

[PBTHHHHT]

For me, it's similar to what Rory has said, the main thing is that I feel that it's based on magic (or ki or chi or whatever your religion/theories/belief calls it, heck call it spirit energy) flows from your body to the point of contact thereby causing that extra damage to the target. There's no obvious physical effect by an adept with killing hands.

The main reason why I would hesistate from going in the pressure point theory is because the killing hands affect on animals and non-living things. Pressure point for that hellhound? Maybe it's known/published somewhere. The pressure point working on something that's already dead... well, nerve strike already says that it doesn't work if I recall correctly. That's my input on the killin' hands discussion.

[PBTHHHHT]

[Bigity]

Killing Hands is like in the Last Dragon...he's got the power of the glow baby. SHOGUN OF HARLEM!