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> Jelly Bryce, RL gunfighter adept
otomik
post Sep 7 2004, 04:41 PM
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http://www.gutterfighting.org/jellybryce.html
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It has been known as historical fact that some human beings are gifted with eyesight that seems almost supernatural to the average man. Ted Williams, it was said, could read the label off a phonograph record spun through the air. General Chuck Yeager could see fighter planes coming 50 miles away. Bryce one day confessed to FBI agent Bob Oswalt that he could see the bullet leave the gun and his eyes could follow its trajectory to the target. That, he said, was why he could do the things he did. Before dismissing it out of hand, it must be remembered that Bryce could hit a Mexican peso thrown through the air with a .22 and he never, ever missed. Not only that but ten years after his retirement his niece says that he had long since quit shooting for fun but that, when called upon, he would demonstrate exactly the same level of skill as the day he retired. Like an aging Samurai in cowboy hat, he had transcended the need for practice of any kind.

Just an interesting story of an amazing life. kinda pissed me off that adepts always sucked as gunfighters compared to street sams, adepts always cast as the luddite type with alergies or essence loss from cordite (early mage stereotypes, sometimes encouraged by the sourcebooks and rules themselves).
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Edward
post Sep 7 2004, 05:13 PM
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Unless am mistaken an adept can be a far superior marksman to a street sam. You can take improved ability with a fire arm of your choice and possibly pay the magic point to have a smart link 2 installed (or use a laser sight and rely on skill.)

The only problem is that adepts don’t make good generalists while a street sam can fairly easily be quite good in 3 or 4 weapons.

Edward
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Kagetenshi
post Sep 7 2004, 06:06 PM
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I sincerely doubt his claim as to seeing the bullet, but that’s still quite impressive.

Even at a measly 500 feet per second your eyes would have to capture sometime within the first .02 seconds to see the bullet somewhere within the first ten feet. While that isn’t out of the realm of possibility, it’s still pretty unlikely. If you want to see the bullet as it leaves the gun (we’ll be generous and give it a full foot), you’re down to .002 seconds; to reliably see that, your eyes would have to capture at all of 500 frames per second!

I guess the test would be, could he stand to watch movies? If so, his eyes almost definitely didn’t capture fast enough.

~J
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mfb
post Sep 7 2004, 06:07 PM
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adepts are luddites...? sheesh, nobody told me!
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Siege
post Sep 7 2004, 06:18 PM
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Short of dissecting the man, it's impossible to know how he did what he did.

But adepts can be far superior gunslingers - but like anything else, once the adept is specialized, (s)he becomes a one-trick pony.

And to be fair, I'm not sure that cybernetics provides any better ability to mimic the gunslinger's abilities.

For all we know, Mr. Bryce may have just spent a helluvalot of his magic points on IA: handguns and a very kind GM allowed him to use the IA dice as a comp bonus to his perception score when applied to firearms. :grinbig:

-Siege
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mrobviousjosh
post Sep 7 2004, 07:33 PM
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QUOTE (Edward)
Unless am mistaken an adept can be a far superior marksman to a street sam. You can take improved ability with a fire arm of your choice and possibly pay the magic point to have a smart link 2 installed (or use a laser sight and rely on skill.)

You could only have a smartlink 1 installed with an adept (because the smartlink 2 requires installed cyberware). The general rule of thumb is that street sams are more accurate (especially with cybereyes like ultrasound or whatever) but adepts are easier to heal with magic, harder to detect, and generally more stable.
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Edward
post Sep 7 2004, 07:38 PM
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It has previously been proposed that the world is a role-playing game but I am quite confident in saying that god is not a generous GM.

The fooling cybernetics help you be a better gunslinger.

Quickness enhancement (preferably bio) to allow the skill to be purchased at a more favourable cost. And aditional combat pool

Strength enhancement for natural recoil reduction.

Improved int biowear. Additional combat pool

Smart link (or version 2) reduce target numbers

Range finder reduce target numbers at range

Enhanced articulation +1 dice to physical uses of the skill (are there any non physical uses of gun skills)

Reflex recorder +1dice

Image magnification reduce target numbers at range (available as scope).

That is all I can think of off the top of my head but there may be others.

There are just as many ways to improve your skill as an adept but you are more limited in the number of improvements you can take.

Also remember you can mix the 2 and a smart link 2 is probably worth the loss of magic. –2 target numbers and your dice are reduced from 12 to 10 (assuming some combat pool and you reduce your improve skill gun by 2 points)

Edward
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Kagetenshi
post Sep 7 2004, 07:48 PM
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QUOTE (mrobviousjosh)
You could only have a smartlink 1 installed with an adept (because the smartlink 2 requires installed cyberware). The general rule of thumb is that street sams are more accurate (especially with cybereyes like ultrasound or whatever) but adepts are easier to heal with magic, harder to detect, and generally more stable.

There is no reason whatsoever you couldn’t stick a smartlink-2 in an Adept. It would reduce the maximum level of IA: Pistols by one, but the TN reduction is, I believe, worth the extra die in every case.

~J
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mfb
post Sep 7 2004, 11:02 PM
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nor does using a smartlink-2 require cyberware. you just need smartlink-2 goggles. granted, you'll only get -1 TN instead of -2, but you still get the lower called shot TN.
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lokugh
post Sep 8 2004, 12:15 AM
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Ted Williams could tell what seam on a baseball he hit the ball on. Ron Luciano, in his book, The Umpire Strikes Back, talks about seeing Williams do it in spring training, many years after he had retired. They pine tarred the bat and then checked the mark on the ball where Ted said he hit it.

He and Yeager and Neil Armstrong all had 20/10 vision or better as well. Which brings up a new point. It is expected that by 2010 laser surgery will be able to correct eyes to 20/10 vision (nice symmetry there...). So, we are proceeding nicelhy toward building a better human.
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mrobviousjosh
post Sep 8 2004, 12:30 AM
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QUOTE (mfb @ Sep 7 2004, 06:02 PM)
nor does using a smartlink-2 require cyberware. you just need smartlink-2 goggles. granted, you'll only get -1 TN instead of -2, but you still get the lower called shot TN.

The smartgoggles v.s. cybereyes is what I was referring to, unless you want to take the essence loss. In the end, a more experienced runner once put it to me like this. Street Sams are better with lowering TNs and dealing damage with guns...for now. Once you get Karma and can build up your improved ability pistols (along with other nifty adept stuff) you'll find that a slight difference in TN favors the higher quantity of dice; especially for lower TNs. Though a Street Sam may be more consistent, an adept has an ability to receive more successes. Anyway, that's what I was lead to believe.
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Kagetenshi
post Sep 8 2004, 12:48 AM
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Twelve dice, TN 2: 10 sucesses. Eighteen dice, TN 4: 9 successes.

Seventeen dice, TN 2, ~14 successes.

~J
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mrobviousjosh
post Sep 8 2004, 01:28 AM
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QUOTE (Kagetenshi)
Twelve dice, TN 2: 10 sucesses. Eighteen dice, TN 4: 9 successes.

Seventeen dice, TN 2, ~14 successes.

~J

Like I said, he's more experienced and talked me into believing this; though I never did the math behind it to figure out the odds of success. I guess in "theory" adepts hit harder. :spin:
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Siege
post Sep 8 2004, 02:36 AM
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Don't forget the geas possibilities - the adept might not even have to lose the point of magic.

-Siege
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BitBasher
post Sep 8 2004, 02:55 AM
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QUOTE (Siege)
Don't forget the geas possibilities - the adept might not even have to lose the point of magic.

-Siege

Well by the book, that's up the the GM and not the Adept... :vegm:
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Siege
post Sep 8 2004, 02:57 AM
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Snicker.

Geas the magic loss from "Smartlink 2" with "only when unarmed". :grinbig:

-Siege
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Smiley
post Sep 8 2004, 03:11 AM
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Meh. One initiation and you're good again. Definitely worth it. Learn Wildcat, too, for the called shot bonus.
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Wounded Ronin
post Sep 8 2004, 03:15 AM
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Geas, +12 dice, smartlink.....that's all you need.


Ah, so cheesy. So broken.
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Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*
post Sep 8 2004, 03:18 AM
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QUOTE (lokugh)
Ted Williams could tell what seam on a baseball he hit the ball on. Ron Luciano, in his book, The Umpire Strikes Back, talks about seeing Williams do it in spring training, many years after he had retired. They pine tarred the bat and then checked the mark on the ball where Ted said he hit it.

The U.S. Women's Softball team has a training device system to train their eyes to do the same thing.
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Siege
post Sep 8 2004, 04:45 AM
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QUOTE (Wounded Ronin)
Geas, +12 dice, smartlink.....that's all you need.


Ah, so cheesy. So broken.

Not really - ya gotta live long enough to get that shot off.

-Siege
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Siege
post Sep 8 2004, 04:46 AM
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QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0)
QUOTE (lokugh @ Sep 7 2004, 06:15 PM)
Ted Williams could tell what seam on a baseball he hit the ball on.  Ron Luciano, in his book, The Umpire Strikes Back, talks about seeing Williams do it in spring training, many years after he had retired.  They pine tarred the bat and then checked the mark on the ball where Ted said he hit it.

The U.S. Women's Softball team has a training device system to train their eyes to do the same thing.

Ya know, that just sounds like a fun machine to play with.

-Siege
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Kagetenshi
post Sep 8 2004, 05:09 AM
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QUOTE (Siege)
QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ Sep 8 2004, 03:15 AM)
Geas, +12 dice, smartlink.....that's all you need.


Ah, so cheesy.  So broken.

Not really - ya gotta live long enough to get that shot off.

-Siege

Three points of IA: Pistols, three points of Imp. Reflexes.

~J
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Siege
post Sep 8 2004, 05:12 AM
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Sure Kage - but that's no longer cheesy and broken. :grinbig:

-Siege
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Kagetenshi
post Sep 8 2004, 05:15 AM
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Well, unless you've got a skill of 12, you're only using six of those IA points anyway, so it's a crippled character, not a cheesy one.

IA is limited by Magic and Skill. A Grade 6 initiate with Pistols 12 deserves to be that utterly sick with a gun.

~J
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Siege
post Sep 8 2004, 05:18 AM
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If you did nothing but spend magic points on IA: handgun and still managed to live long enough to Initiate not only once, but six times, you can be as cheesy as you like. :grinbig:

-Siege
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