Hiding a gun, good cloths can be a pain. Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[Snow_Fox]

Ok Has anyone in their games tried to visualize hiding gun on their person?
I know the guns have concelament rating and all but have you really given it a thought?

in the rl it's a real bitch. Hip-hop rappers wear baggy clothing and that makes it easy to hide guns under the folds but normal people? James Bond has shown a man can hid a light pistol in a shoulder holster under a suit. Police and Gov't agents can wear larger guns under jackets but don't care if they show.

Women's suits cannot hide a gun. The cut is made to cling to the body. more casually a "boyfriend" jacket works well but not too much else. Formal wear is only mildly better than gym wear or a swimsuit and that goes for guys just as well "Is that a gun in your jock or are you just glad to see me?"

Even casual cloths don't do it. Guys can get away with looser jeans and tops, but women's jeans don't allow much give to hide a gun. and for both sides, a motorcycle jacket cuts off as the waist.

Certainly with a coat on, even a rain coat, you can hide a gun, but for the most part, unless you want to look like a slob, you can't really hide a weapon in easy reach (note a purse does not count as easy reach, trust me.)

Comments?

[Sabosect]

That is true today. And, I suspect, quite a bit in Shadowrun. But what about fashion trends towards looser clothes? They do happen from time to time.

[mfb]

perhaps female characters should get a +1 Cha, in exchange for a -1 Conceal to all gear.

just kidding. what women might be able to get away with is clothing that's only tight in the right spots--loose cuffs, long shirt tails, etcetera.

[UPTD]

I'm not sure how many shadowrunners care about fashion and whats "in". I know most of my characters wear a long coat for the purpose of +2 conc. Then again, none of my characters are exactly what you'd call the social types... Shadowrunners arent known for following laws, so why should fashion laws be anything special? In general i think the PC's are wearing the proper clothing that gives their weapon full concealability. So as my final say, i think the GM can decide on the current styles, the effects on weapon concealability, and what the effects are if the characters decide to not follow it.

-UPTD

[Snow_Fox]

Sure, in winter or the rian you get a long coat, but what in a corp setting indoors?
Loose clothes happen, but not injeans or skirts. Usually the change is how high/low the hem and waistline. baggy jeans do not last with women-makes us look fat, and in the summer, guys who wear coats sort of stand out. Sure a loud hawaian shirt hanging outside your pants covers a gun in a waist band, but that look gets old fast and gets the attention of sec forces real quick-remember what I said about rappers?

slobs can get by with it, but they create a whole other set of problems.

[UPTD]

In a corporate setting, if your getting hired I expect the johnson knows you're shadowrunners and will make allowances for the non-ettiquite attire. This thread reminds me of the scene in Miss Congeniality where Sandra Bullock pulls out a pistol from under her dress while shes working on pose and trying to walk like a model. The average Joe walking down the street who sees you wearing a long coat in the summer will likely think that your just another punk who wants to look cool. Granted, most shadowrunners dont give a gel round about what the average joe thinks and are much more concerned with what the gaurds and Sec. will think. In the corp setting where you want to fit in, its not likely your going to be carrying around relatively large weapons either. To put it in SR terms, James Bond probably had a custom pistol with increased concealability.

-UPTD

[Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*]

And a tuxedo cut to fit a holstered gun.

Which isn't exactly uncommon.

[Edward]

There are 2 ways to go.

Make your cover corp security and where a long coat.

Where a gun small enough you can hide it under a jacket (like bond dose) almost any man’s dress clothes would allow for a consolableable ankle holster but there is no such thing as a quick draw from an ankle holster.

Edward

[Siege]

Woo-hoo Snow! You give me hope role-players still live. :grinbig:

You can look at magazines like "Guns and Ammo" and get an idea for the concealability issues involved and some of the proposed solutions for women.

Depending on the outfit, obviously some weapons just aren't an option - my Sig 220 is a good sized weapon and not one that will be concealed on a woman wearing anything vaguely form-fitting.

This is part of the reason why gun manufacturers make snub-nosed and compact models of handguns - for undercover officers and the like who need firepower in a concealable package.

That said, a purse is a usually functional place to hide a weapon, particularly if you have it customized for the express purpose of hiding a weapon with the intent of removing it quickly.

Maintaining a weapon on your person is a little more complicated, but not impossible depending on the outfit in question - although most solutions would not allow for a "quick draw" option. At the risk of sounding like a pig, a woman might be able to conceal a small handgun under her breasts, taped just above the sternum if the blouse is dark and not particularly form-fitting. Good luck quick-drawing that one though.

Spiegel's Idea of Business Fashion

That's cutting a little close on the risque side of professional attire, but based on what I've seen women wear to work, it's not outside the realm of possibility to sneak a weapon into the outfit.

If being attractive isn't an issue, a little body padding would keep people from wanting to watch the character for too long and provide an excellent place to conceal a weapon.

-Siege

[Fortune]

UPTD: Snow Fox is not just talking about a meet. Not all shadowruns are of the smash-em-up-and-loot-em variety. Some actually involve infiltrating certain circles of society to achieve the rquired objective. This is where the proper clothing and etiquette are important.

[Siege]

As noted in 2064, Culture Shock and corp brats. :grinbig:

The point is well made - I just don't see many groups that take that sort of detail into consideration when making plans.

-Siege

[Sabosect]

There is a simple solution: Play a magician or have hidden cyberwear. Or, grab one of the much smaller guns. Generally, if you are trying to fit in with the upper class, you should also try to pull the gun out without being obvious about it. More surprise is garnered when the attackers think you are easy prey.

[mmu1]

[Arethusa]

In real life terms, I'd say it's definitely possible to conceal a gun in relatively form fitting clothing. In winter, any coat'll do (for those unfamiliar with various cuts, you might have luck poking around something like bluefly for ideas). A car coat would certainly work, and everyone's familiar with trench coats, but even shorter, a biker or bomber can work. Now, something really fitted and really short (there are some canvas jackets by Rogan or Ralph Lauren) will cause problems, but a single stack, slim form factor pistol can definitely fit if you know what you're doing. Now, you won't ever manage to stash anything in a fitted tshirt, but a relaxed or classic cut buttoned shirt will definitely leave room for a slim holster (small of the back, maybe stomach if you have the pecs to even things out). In terms of pants, slim cut jeans can be fairly forgiving. You won't hid anything near your crotch (no jokes about easy access, thanks), but with a boot cut leg opening, you can definitely fit something in the Glock 30/36 or Beretta 9000 range. Leg opening's not exactly easy access, but it's there. If you want to go more formal, traditional or casual cut slacks/chinos are far more forgiving, as are dress shirts, and a blazer or more formal jacket can definitely give you room. Certainly, there are more fitted cuts for these things, but even then, a slim, small gun is doable. Variations, of course, need to be taken into account depending on how fit/slim you are.

For women, it's a fair bit harder, considering how much skin they tend to show with most fashions (and I can only expect this trend to continue). There's no way women'll conceal a gun with most shirts or pants. Likely, inside of thigh with a skirt or concelead under a jacket are the most viable methods. That's not to say that women don't have loose clothing that's still attractive, but it tends to be very casual. Might be able to get away with a slim form factor gun on the inside thigh with some looser business type slacks, but not being a woman, I can't vouch for this.

[Snow_Fox]

Under the bust is not an option. Think about where you look at a woman when ogling. you're going to notice a bulge there right?

shoulder holsters work better for men because of the anatomy that gives you broader shoulders. The hollow under the arm can hide something. Our, womens', best chance is the small of the back, but even then a quality suit is not good. The inner thigh holster looks good in movies but trust me boys, uh-uh. chaffe city.

Fortune is right about how I view playing. Not all of us are mercs out of the Z security zones. My main character is a nice respectable woman who spends most of her day with nice people who'd seriously fvreak if they knew what she did for a living.

[Arethusa]

[Sabosect]

Then perhaps I have the perfect cover for someone who deals with the upper class. She moves among the higher class and openly carries a gun. Why? Officially she is a security consultant whose specialty is in the magical arts. This means she spends a lot of time supposedly travelling. Her explanation about the gun is simple: Her clients tend to feel more ready to trust her when they see she has prepared for the possibility of trouble. In reality, the only people she provides security advice for are the gangs she deals with on a regular basis, and he advice usually consists of showing flaws in their defenses by using those flaws to kill the gang members. But, ask your GM before trying this.

Oh, and her excuse as for why she doesn't give security advice to friends: She wants to keep her home life and her working life separate, but keeps the gun out of habit.

[Fortune]

Admittedly that is one scenario, but not by any means the only one. The character in question (I'm sure) just would not fit the role of Security Consultant, that being much too beneath her. As she said, not everyone has the same motivations when playing shadowrun. One person's night of fun might be another person's night of boring-talking-stuff.

[Sabosect]

Perhaps we are looking at this the wrong way. She needs to hide a gun, but still be able to access it when the shooting starts. We've already ruled out quite a few places and, depending on the current fashion trend, may end up ruling out the rest as well. After all, is she is going to be hobnobbing, she nees to stay with their current trend. Which means she may be relying on a purse for months at a time.

Perhaps instead of concealing a gun in an easy to access location, we should look at ways she can delay being hit by bullets until she has her gun out.

[Cain]

As Siege pointed out, a purse is an ideal place to carry a firearm. You can even get away with larger guns than men can conceal, and it's harder to spot it accidentally. I seem to recall hearing about several "purse pistol" designs that would be the equal of a Shadowrun heavy pistol.

[Siege]

Actually, my bust idea depends on the type of clothing and the physical dimensions involved - it's still feasible, depending on the amount of gap between "top" of breast and distance to waist.

If she's a fit woman wearing a relatively snug outfit - well, yes...that's going to seriously impact the options.

And it would still be awkward as all hell.

-Siege

[JaronK]

A woman can easily hide even a very large gun under a long skirt... there's no way to know that such skirts won't be fashionable in the future. Just add a small slit to the skirt and she can draw the weapon as though pulling it from a pants pocket. Even under a shorter skirt you can hide a weapon between the theighs. Handbags have already been mentioned, and she could hide a weapon easily enough under a blazer, or any other form of jacket. Also, many women today wear scarves and the like, which could again be used to conceal a weapon. A creative person might even hold the gun under a bundle of scarf, concealing the weapon even while it's ready to fire.

Seriously, it's not THAT hard. Not all women wear skin tight spandex all the time.

JaronK

[Siege]

I think SnowRaven is aware of that, Jaron. :grinbig:

-Siege

[Sabosect]

Nevermind.

[JaronK]

So go with my first. Under a long skirt, on the inner thiegh, with a slit cut in the side. Not a tight skirt, but one with a bit of space and ripples. Totally invisible, you can hide a heavy pistol easily, and she can draw it very quickly (it'll look like she's grabbing her croch, but while the folks are distracted by what they think is a woman masturbating, she's drawing her gun and firing).

JaronK