 What don't wound modifiers modify? |
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 Oct 16 2004, 01:51 AM
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#1
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Technomancer  Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,638 Joined: 2-October 02 From: Champaign, IL Member No.: 3,374  |
Having trouble verifying my ruling on a dispute last game. There were a few opinions around the table and the easiest way to solve the problem is this: What tests don't wound modifiers apply to?
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Oct 16 2004, 01:54 AM
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#2
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,590 Joined: 11-September 04 Member No.: 6,650 |
Damage resistance tests are the only test to which it does not apply
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Oct 16 2004, 01:54 AM
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#3
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
damage resistance and drain.
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Oct 16 2004, 02:40 AM
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#4
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Technomancer Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,638 Joined: 2-October 02 From: Champaign, IL Member No.: 3,374 |
That's what I thought. Danke. |
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Oct 16 2004, 03:07 AM
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#5
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Senior GM Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,406 Joined: 12-April 03 From: Redmond, WA Member No.: 4,442 |
You shouldn't apply wound modifiers to the Body(4) Test after taking a Deadly Physical, where you try to avoid losing limbs, eyes, ears, etc. (Deadly Wounds and Permanent Damage, SR3.127).
Nor to the Body Test (Healing Physical Damage, 126) to determine if you can heal on your own. Your physical wound level is already accounted for in the Wound Table, and your stun damage doesn't affect whether you'll be able to stabilize. |
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Oct 16 2004, 04:43 AM
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#6
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 179 Joined: 9-October 04 From: I'm in Hell! HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!! (A.K.A Alabama) Member No.: 6,739 |
I might rule that decking wouldn't be affected, as the physical body is shut off from what he is feeling.
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Oct 16 2004, 05:03 AM
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#7
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
what you're feeling, maybe. but your body is still going to be going nuts, reacting to the damage, which will affect you mentally.
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Oct 16 2004, 06:48 AM
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#8
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,073 Joined: 23-August 04 Member No.: 6,587 |
Considering you can take physical damage while in the matrix I think the penalties should defiantly apply.
Edward |
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Oct 16 2004, 06:50 AM
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#9
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
You could probably add to that list any tests the character does while using Astral Projection. Stun Modifiers would still apply, but I'm not sure about Physical.
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Oct 16 2004, 06:53 AM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 179 Joined: 9-October 04 From: I'm in Hell! HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!! (A.K.A Alabama) Member No.: 6,739 |
What? Why does that matter? The ICE is sending biofeedback through the matrix, you still can't really feel it. Maybe stun damage, or RP tramalogical damage would go aganst you, but not phys. |
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Oct 16 2004, 11:08 AM
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#11
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Senior GM Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,406 Joined: 12-April 03 From: Redmond, WA Member No.: 4,442 |
Of course, Fortune and Wutasumi, I'm sure you're aware that book rules indicate that Physical wound penalties apply to tests made while Projecting or Decking. I assume Dashifen was asking for book rules, not house rules.
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Oct 16 2004, 03:36 PM
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#12
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Yeah I know. I was actually responding to Wutasumi's post, stating that if he was exempting jacked-in Deckers, then he should also make an exception for Astral mages. Sorry for the confusion. I need to quote more I guess. :) |
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Oct 16 2004, 03:57 PM
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#13
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Ain Soph Aur Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,477 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Montreal, Canada Member No.: 600 |
Wait, WHAT??? Are you serious? We've always added injury to drain. If that's not true, it's seriously going to affect how our mages play. Are you sure? I checked in the BBB and it says:
Injury doesn't apply? |
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Oct 16 2004, 04:09 PM
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#14
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
No, it does not. Any mod that affects Drain Resistance must state specifically that it does. |
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Oct 16 2004, 04:54 PM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 179 Joined: 9-October 04 From: I'm in Hell! HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!! (A.K.A Alabama) Member No.: 6,739 |
But I also thought maybe it was in the book, and players were arguing with the book. |
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Oct 16 2004, 05:03 PM
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#16
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 126 Joined: 11-September 04 From: French Runner Member No.: 6,652 |
For a long time we played exactly like you , Backgammon...and actually I still have a problem not applying wound modifiers to Drain...after all, if a magician is wounded, how come pain doesn't interfere with his/her capacity to handle drain? It must be quite a challenging thing to become a sort of conductive material for astral energy coursing through your body, and I guess pain could distract you and make this feat much more difficult...
On top of that, drain Target Numbers are not such a big deal since 2nd ed (don't you remember 2050 when a Force 5 spell had a Drain TN of 5 instead of 1/2 Force ?) so it seems to me that wound modifiers could balance the game...after all your chromed-to-max street sam suffers from wound modifiers (okay, okay, unless he's got some niffty pain editor/trauma damper bioware)... |
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Oct 16 2004, 05:07 PM
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#17
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 179 Joined: 9-October 04 From: I'm in Hell! HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!! (A.K.A Alabama) Member No.: 6,739 |
I never had a problem with it, the logic is that when you put magical force through your body, that because your body is held together by magic (At least thats how I interpreted essence) it dosn't affect your body in any way, because it kinda is your body.
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Oct 16 2004, 05:13 PM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 126 Joined: 11-September 04 From: French Runner Member No.: 6,652 |
I'm not sure I can agree...after all handling drain is Willpower test, not a Body Test, which , IMHO, implies that it is an act of will, that you have to concentrate and focus yourself on the delicate task of controlling the flux of raw mana running through your body/aura...as such, pain should be a handicap and make it harder to concentrate, hence wound modifiers on the drain resistance test...
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Oct 16 2004, 06:47 PM
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#19
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 614 Joined: 17-June 03 From: A safehouse about to be compromised by ninjas Member No.: 4,754 |
OK Backgammon and Tortui. I see the reference, and the reading of it. Is that the clearest spot where this reading is supported? Weve had it both ways and if theres a clearer spot Id be glad to have it pointed out to me.
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Oct 16 2004, 08:18 PM
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#20
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
I'm with Ombre on this one. Anyway, I shot an email over to shadowrunrpg.com to get an official ruling, so should be resolved in a few days.
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Oct 16 2004, 09:10 PM
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#21
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
when astrally projecting, you use Willpower to resist damage. should you take wound mods for that, too?
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Oct 16 2004, 09:17 PM
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#22
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Ain Soph Aur Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,477 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Montreal, Canada Member No.: 600 |
We consider it a huge game balance thing also. Currently, mages have to be real careful about taking drain, cause when you start you don't stop. A mage with Serious stun isn't even going to try to cast anything, or he'll probably pass out. If injury doesn't apply to drain, then that totally changes the risk mages face. Not being able to cast spells very well because you have TN mods is one thing, not even trying cause you'll pass out is another.
That makes mages definatly more limited in our games, but that's not necessarely a bad thing. Magic IS very powerful, and this definatly curbs it. When we do have mages playing, they have to plan what spells they're gonna use and that plan always involves a "by then I'll be too drained to support anymore" phase. |
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Oct 16 2004, 10:22 PM
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#23
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
*shrug* your game, i guess. it's never been a problem, in the games i've played.
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Oct 16 2004, 11:30 PM
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#24
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Ain Soph Aur Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,477 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Montreal, Canada Member No.: 600 |
Yeah... we've never played otherwise is all. If we changed now, it'd be weird. Had we always played with wounds not affecting drain, there wouldn't be a problem I guess. It's just switching between the two is a huge differance.
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Oct 16 2004, 11:32 PM
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#25
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
To me, Drain Resistance is just another form of Damage Resistance except you are doing it to yourself.
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