 Rigging a bike?, Whats your take on it? |
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 Jan 20 2005, 11:02 PM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 127 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Sweden Member No.: 1,313  |
Didn't find this in a quick search, so...
Can a rigger rig a motorcycle? Rigger 3 says that a riggers body goes limp when rigging, alas he should fall off a bike if he's jacked in. So rigging a bike is only possible via remote control, or...? What's your take on it? |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:06 PM
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#2
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
You could tie yourself on somehow, but good luck getting through a crash. I personally wouldn't risk it.
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Jan 20 2005, 11:11 PM
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#3
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 269 Joined: 8-November 04 Member No.: 6,817 |
I'd imagine balancing the bike would be very hard when your body goes limp.
But bikes can be rigger adapted can't they, and there's nothing canon that says it can't be done. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Jan 20 2005, 11:14 PM
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#4
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Guests |
It'd also be somewhat easier to install a restraint system in a Harley or a large chopper.
But how in the world would you rig a rice rocket? |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:20 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 127 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Sweden Member No.: 1,313 |
You could ofcourse get a sidecar and rig from there...
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Jan 20 2005, 11:20 PM
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#6
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,362 Joined: 3-October 03 From: Poway, San Diego County, CA, USA Member No.: 5,676 |
You can rig a bike, but it needs to have a gyroscopic balancing system installed to stay balanced with your body all limp. And, if you turn really sharply, you might fall off. Plus, people can just shoot you instead of the bike.
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Jan 20 2005, 11:31 PM
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#7
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 269 Joined: 8-November 04 Member No.: 6,817 |
Something that tends to be the case for non-rigging bikers as well. I don't have the Rigger book here, how many unmodified bikes even have the required sensors:1 ? All I know is that there are none in the BBB. |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:33 PM
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#8
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Target Group: Members Posts: 50 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Pueblo Corporate Council Member No.: 2,020 |
See, this is where the game gets wonky... Gyroscopic Stabilisation is almost required for the sanity of the operator and the GM, but as you see below, depending on the GM, not needed. As a reminder, this is how I do it, not how it should be.
(this explanation works with the rules, but sounds stupid) When I've rigged a bike, I've set it up that I'm jacked in and passed out. Stabilsation is accomplished through a Gyroscopic Stabiliser (in Rig3, mostly for droned bikes) and a set of leg irons that clamp down on the legs. The handlebars are customised with gauntlets that lock down on the hands, and you just lie down on the bike. If you're gonna crash, there's a mental, "crash-button" that jacks you out of the bike and releases all the restraints so you can 'escape' as you see fit. (this explanation doesn't completely jive with the rules, but it's close and makes sense) If you're rigged into the bike, and you ARE the bike, the bike is also aware of this 150-kilo weight strapped to the top of it. The Rigger-controls understand that the majority of the maneuverability of a motorcycle comes from the proper manipulation of this weight on the back of it, it would allow (through RAS operations) the most efficient cornering of the bike by manipulating the body of the rigger to manuver the weight. In this manner, the movmement of the rigger's meat is not conciously controlled by the rigger directly, but unconciously moved by the Rigger/VCR interface. A gyroscope helps, but is not required. (this explanation is expensive and least compliant of the three) The motorcycle gets a drone package installed (with the gyro), and the rigger controls it through 'Virtual Dashboard' mode, the drone system takes the autonav commands from the rigger, allowing them complete control over the vehicle, while not passing them out. This is sadly only as effective as the Drone rating, which is prohibitvely expensive. The rigger issues these 'virtual dashboard' commands through the datajack connected to the VCR, so they're just as complex as regular drone commands, just without the whole captain's chair total-immersion environment BaronJ |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Jan 20 2005, 11:41 PM
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#9
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Guests |
150 kilos? Damn...
You could turn it into a sort of Tron bike with a mostly enclosed housing for the Asian variety. Choppers should just really need a five-point restraint or something. |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:44 PM
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#10
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Target Group: Members Posts: 50 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Pueblo Corporate Council Member No.: 2,020 |
Whoops.. forgot my English to Metric conversions; that's if you've got a troll rigging a bike. If its an Elf (or a scrawny human, the normal case) it's only about 70kg of extra mass. |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:49 PM
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#11
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Jesus Freak Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,141 Joined: 23-April 04 From: Anaheim, CA Member No.: 6,274 |
This is actually how I handle it. I have some sort of enclosed cockpit on the bike that they can strap themselves into. You can also armor it and they will be protected inside. |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:51 PM
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#12
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,664 Joined: 21-September 04 From: Arvada, CO Member No.: 6,686 |
Riggers can move their meat bodies while rigging. Thus, if they are riding a bike, they can let themselves and the bike stay balanced.
If they are remotely rigging a bike, it does need the gyroscopic stabalization gear, because there is nothing otherwise to keep it upright. Lastly, whenever you rigger adapt a vehicle, you must have it with sensors 1. (Or it automatically gets it, I can't remember). Regardless, you can't have rigger adaptation without at least sensors 1. |
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Jan 20 2005, 11:58 PM
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#13
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
I'm of the opinion that the cost of a VCR and bike equipped with gyroscopic stabilization allows for a feedback control that makes the riggers body less than limp when desired. My understanding is that riggers incur a +8 TN modifier to all physical activities but still have some control. And thus, with some form of bike-body communication (VCR + gyroscopic stabilization processor), a rigger's body moves with the bike so to speak.
Also, I believe there is a canon mention of Combat Bikers using rigged bikes. But maybe not. |
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Jan 21 2005, 01:19 AM
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#14
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,129 Joined: 11-June 03 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 4,712 |
Magnets and plates in the hands/handles and ass/seat. Rigger won't go anywhere. :D
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Jan 21 2005, 02:06 AM
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#15
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,362 Joined: 3-October 03 From: Poway, San Diego County, CA, USA Member No.: 5,676 |
Sure, you can move your body while rigging. You just get +8 to target numbers. Wear lots of impact armor.
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Jan 21 2005, 04:27 AM
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#16
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Target Group: Members Posts: 56 Joined: 24-July 04 Member No.: 6,512 |
The novel Dead Air talks about it, (combat bikers are rigged, wielding a melee weapon in one hand and a gun in the other IIRC), but I don't know about any sourcebook references. |
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Jan 21 2005, 04:28 AM
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#17
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Target Group: Members Posts: 50 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Pueblo Corporate Council Member No.: 2,020 |
From what I remeber from my whirlwind tour of the novels (which are semi-canon), in second edition, Bikes were riggable. The novel in question is "Dead Air" by Jak Koke, wherin two drek-hot Test Pilots are forced to retire, and enter Combat Biking with their MilSpec VCRs. Honestly, it was one of those "ok, sure" novels, but it's still quasi-canon. (a case of tele-frag posting) This post has been edited by BaronJ: Jan 21 2005, 04:29 AM |
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Jan 21 2005, 06:28 AM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 224 Joined: 6-April 02 From: ab.ca Member No.: 2,522 |
I've always figured it should work fine. The RAS just doesn't kick in fully, the rigger still has subconscious motor control. The rigger is no longer aware of his body as independent, but rather it is now just a component of the bike.
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Jan 21 2005, 07:01 AM
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#19
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
Do remember that Dead Air was fiction set within a fictional universe ... the events in it didn't actually happen in the Sixth World.
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Jan 21 2005, 07:10 AM
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#20
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Target Group: Members Posts: 83 Joined: 12-February 03 Member No.: 4,083 |
? :huh: As opposed to real events that happened in the fictional universe? |
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Jan 21 2005, 07:49 AM
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#21
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Target Group: Members Posts: 56 Joined: 24-July 04 Member No.: 6,512 |
I'll have to look it up again. The book kind of underwhelmed me (the description of Combat Biker being the only thing in the book that piqued my interest) so it got relegated to a corner of the closet. |
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Jan 21 2005, 07:58 AM
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#22
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,088 Joined: 8-October 04 From: Dallas, TX Member No.: 6,734 |
Yeah, I used to own all of the SR books, but recently had to pare down my library and that was one of them that didn't survive the purge.
Even the gratuitious sex scenes didn't save it :) *heh* Actually, the idea of a Tron bike made me wonder - I see nothing wrong with rigging bikes...the sensor:1 thing can be gotten around very easy by modding the bike to have extra CF, then adding sensors. When I was a player, I had all my bikes with Sensor 1 because I always bought the sec combo of Proximity Alert and Electric Shock System. The description of the Fenris car of Wolf's in "Wolf and Raven" made me chuckle. (kids tossing a rat against the car, repeatedly stunning it.) |
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Jan 21 2005, 08:31 AM
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#23
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Exactly. Just like Karl Kombatmage is a fictional person in the fictional world of Shadowrun. |
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Jan 21 2005, 01:27 PM
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#24
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
Karl isn't real?
But I have all these letters and emails... |
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Jan 21 2005, 05:08 PM
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#25
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
moving your body and shifting your weight is part of riding a bike. it should be accomplished automatically, as part of the rigging process.
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