 RL Firearms Question, ATF site is crap... |
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 Mar 15 2005, 05:57 PM
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#26
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Great Dragon  Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222  |
Brilliant. You can count on me to report this thread if it isn't closed down soon otherwise. This post has been edited by Austere Emancipator: Mar 15 2005, 05:50 PM |
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Mar 15 2005, 05:54 PM
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#27
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It's for winners Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 523 Joined: 8-February 05 From: Wiltshire with da shooty stuff Member No.: 7,067 |
I couldn't help you, i know all about fire arms in the UK and the licencing of them (as i am waiting for my licence for shotguns) but just a quick question why the hell would you want to walk about with one?
Call me stupid but i would never walk about the streets with my shotgun! torz x :S |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:14 PM
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#28
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Resident Legionnaire Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,136 Joined: 8-August 04 From: Usually Work Member No.: 6,550 |
I don't want to walk around with one (I have to do that at work anyways), I want one for home protection.
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Mar 15 2005, 06:19 PM
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#29
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Moving Target Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 870 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Idaho Member No.: 5,960 |
report the thread it's done anyway. It's just going to turn into a honeypot for those who don't believe in individual rights. |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:27 PM
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#30
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It's for winners Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 523 Joined: 8-February 05 From: Wiltshire with da shooty stuff Member No.: 7,067 |
Ah, well thats different, saying that in the uk the law is so strict about keeping fire arms, we have to have them locked away in a cabinet and the ammo in a different safe, on an internal supporting wall and all that.
I mean when we transport them the mechanism has to be separate form the gun! didn't mean to diss you but I have been taught to treat all fire arms with respect! And i have no idea what the law is in the US! torz x :D |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:39 PM
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#31
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
Laws int he US regarding firearms vary from state to state.
Some of the more assinine knee-jerk legislation includes the recently expired "Assault Rifle Ban" which did not define what constitutes an assault rifle on calibre or intended purpose in the design process but rather how it "looked" and how many attachments were currently on it. There were some additions that did make sense though, like no fully automatic, a limit on ammo capacity, etc. However, as many have said, the laws only serve to keep guns out of law abiding citizen's hands. Personally, I'm happy to live in a city where all male residents over the age of 18 must own a firearm. I couldn't imagine not being allowed to own a firearm, and one of the reasons I doubt I will ever visit England. |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:50 PM
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#32
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
Fully automatic weapons were not touched by the AWB. Those have been heavily regulated since 1932.
On a side note, for those who find the Five-seveN a SCARY COP BABY KILLING OMG NO NONOES gun, consider that its armor piercing ability is more or less easily matched by any rifle, and an old CZ52— a pistol— can be had for around $100 with plenty of ammunity and can penetrate almost just as well. Recent furor over the Five-seveN is nothing bu the Democratic party hemorraging political power and trying desperately to stayin in the political limelight. Why, why, why am I registered Democrat? |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:45 PM
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#33
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
That's rhetorical, right? |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:57 PM
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#34
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
It's funny, if it weren't for his stance on the war in Iraq, I woulda voted for teh libertarian guy. He likes for law abiding citizens to own fire arms and would have gone a long way toward removing both NRA and the anti-gun lobby's propaganda from Government publications.
Though, NRA does have one thing right. Just hiding a weapon or scaring the crap out of your kid will not stop them from playing with the weapon 100% of the time. you have to teach them to respect firearms, not fear them. There is a not so subtle difference many people forget there. |
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Mar 15 2005, 06:55 PM
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#35
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
No, it was a cry for help.
Go ahead! Throw your vote away!
The NRA is a weird organization. Purely looking at their stances on most things, I should love them. I agree with most of it. And then I start to look at their rationalizations, their arguments, and I'm a little uncomfortable. Then I look at their membership, their leadership, their public tactics, and I really, really dislike them. But, yes, I'd take them over the fear mongering gun control lobby. |
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Mar 15 2005, 07:09 PM
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#36
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
I thought I said that.
At least i didn't vote for Kodo |
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Mar 15 2005, 07:39 PM
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#37
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The Ghost in our Machine Group: Retired Admins Posts: 166 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Unlisted Datastore Member No.: 52 |
Keep it on-topic and civil, people. This is not the place for discussion about current day politics.
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Mar 16 2005, 04:21 AM
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#38
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
Raygun has covered this already but just to repeat,
To own a gun legally you must obey the laws of your state of residence. You cannot buy a gun in a state in which you do not live. If someone legally buys the gun in their state and then brings it to your state to sell it to you without the proper ppwork, that is gun running and is illegal. If you visit a friend in another state and that person legally buys a gun and then hands it over to you, even if you provided the friend with the money, that is a straw purchase, and is illegal. In short you want the toys, you gots to change the laws where you live or move to a state where the laws are more lax, like Pennsylvania, where there is no waiting time for a hand gun, assuming you are a resident who does not have anything in your past to prevent you from owning a firearm-like a fleony conviction. this is why in SR weapons have legality ratings. |
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Mar 16 2005, 04:34 AM
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#39
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
the assault weapons ban was a lovely piece of legislation that did nothing. Since it expired there has not been a big rush for such weapons and when it was in place, one of the defining elements of an assault rifle was having a lug where a bayonet could be attached. Until the law was jiggled a bit, this ratted historical re-enactor's muskets, you known flintlocks, as assault rifles.
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Mar 16 2005, 05:36 AM
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#40
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 120 Joined: 3-May 04 Member No.: 6,298 |
Communism is an economic system which promotes the elimination of private property and promotes group ownership in the interest of group welfare. I'm hardly a fan of communism, but it has nothing to do with an argument about gun control. The ridiculous generalization I believe you were looking for was "fascist", which describes a person who promotes a strong and dictatorial government. |
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Mar 16 2005, 05:41 AM
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#41
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
In no way do I agree with Solstice's communist comment, but had he instead called JaronK a fascist, I would not consider that to have been at all a ridiculous generalization. It would, in fact and in many ways, have been fairly accurate, even if JaronK himself would have very much disliked the association.
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Mar 16 2005, 05:58 AM
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#42
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 227 Joined: 18-August 03 Member No.: 5,513 |
Hey, if you're interested in a game about Communism....
Virtual Kremlin Otherwise, what exactly does this stuff have to do with Shadowrun? Smells like politics to me... |
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Mar 16 2005, 06:16 AM
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#43
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 942 Joined: 13-May 04 Member No.: 6,323 |
Grrr... trying to avoid getting further into this. I'll leave it as: if you don't like the safety laws of this state, you can go somewhere else. There's plenty of states where you can buy plenty of concealable firearms... bringing them back here is illegal.
And since the right to privacy that's been knocked around in the supreme court lately essencially gives constitutional rights to do what you like in your own home so long as you don't effect anyone else, drugs in the home are looking pretty similar to illegal firearms in the home, generally speaking (and I know that's a roughcut arguement). JaronK |
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Mar 16 2005, 06:23 AM
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#44
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Resident Legionnaire Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,136 Joined: 8-August 04 From: Usually Work Member No.: 6,550 |
Who cares if it's concealable? Maybe if I was a criminal that would matter to me....
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Mar 16 2005, 06:33 AM
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#45
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 619 Joined: 27-May 03 From: Detroit Member No.: 4,642 |
Because, in Michigan at least, if you want to carry a firearm on your person for protection it has to be concealed and you must have a CCW (Carry Concealed Weapon) Permit. Gratefully, Michigan is an "at will" state and will issue a CCW to anyone who can prove (with a noterized letter with 2 signators) that they've taken the class, can shoot resonably well (done at the class), and they have no criminal record. Michigan also honors CCW equivilent from almost every other state in the U.S. |
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Mar 16 2005, 06:38 AM
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#46
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 619 Joined: 27-May 03 From: Detroit Member No.: 4,642 |
Don't you mean "anti-saftey laws"? 'Cause I'm a lot safer from attack armed with a weapon than I am without. Pistols have been banned in Washington D.C. for decades and that place is only marginally safer than Iraq right now. Pardon the slight sarcasm. |
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Mar 16 2005, 06:49 AM
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#47
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 227 Joined: 18-August 03 Member No.: 5,513 |
Hey I was from Michigan and never knew that Pthgar... Learn something new every day. I was living in Colorado for about 5 years and learned from a neighbor they'll let you carry any single-, double-action, or semi-auto pistol you want to as long as it's in Plain Sight. Different state, different philosophy behind their laws I suppose. To carry one concealed you have to get a letter from the Sheriff of your county and you have to explain why that's necessary. From what I heard, they pretty much take any cogent reason as a good reason...
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Mar 16 2005, 06:59 AM
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#48
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 619 Joined: 27-May 03 From: Detroit Member No.: 4,642 |
Plain sight makes more sense to me because it would be more of a deterrant. Michigan has only been "at will' for about 7ish years, I think.
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Mar 16 2005, 07:09 AM
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#49
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Moving Target Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 870 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Idaho Member No.: 5,960 |
Your wrong. Anyone can do what they want with a firearm they have purchased. As far as I know (and I live in Idaho which has pretty liberal [in a good sense] gun laws) a person can buy a gun in NV and give or sell it to someone in another state. Paperwork and background checks do not govern the sale of normal weapons between private individuals, nor does it govern a persons ability to give someone a weapon as a gift. As long as it's legal for the reciptient to posses such a weapon it is perfectly legal. So...while I'm not an expert on CA gun laws (in fact I choose to ignore the festering cancer of a state), as long as you can posses a pistol legally then there is nothing illegal about recieving a gift from someone, or buying it from a private individual. *DISCLAIMER* Gun laws vary from state to state so the best thing to do would be to visit your state website or call your local Sheriffs office for info, but I would advise against giving your name or any other information |
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Mar 16 2005, 07:18 AM
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#50
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
How is it an "anti safety law" that prevents people in California from having a handgun that (they think) can penetrate armor? You can still pack a .45, and I like to think that could handle any random mugger that comes your way. Theirs was a knee-jerk reaction (the armor piercing thing), but once you think it's a highly concealable weapon capable of poking clean through the vests your cops wear (and is many times more concealable than most other weapons capable of doing so), it sort of makes sense that they not want the FN on the streets. The primary assumption of theirs is incorrect -- the armor piercing thing -- but the logic thereafter sort of makes sense. I don't see why someone would need an armor piercing handgun (which I know, I know, it's not, but they think it is) for home defense? How many random burglars sneak around in full on tac gear (outside of Shadowrun)? |
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