Making the millions, Legally, for a change. Options Track this topic Email this topic Print this topic Download this topic Subscribe to this forum Display Modes Switch to: Outline Standard Switch to: Linear+

[Smiley]

My character plans to own an adult entertainment establishment in the near future and it got me thinking. Is there a game mechanic for how profitable a business is and how much (if any) money it rakes in? If not, and I suspect this is the case, how would you rule it?

[Capt. Dave]

Forget adult entertainment. The Trauma patch business is where it's at.
Mmmmm...Street Index...

[ES_Riddle]

[Syd]

Here's my initial idea: have your character invest so much every month into the business (salaries, marketing, advertising, improvement of the site, commissioning simsense stars for tours, etc). Without any effort, you'll make 90% of what you put into it (and thus, the business will slowly die over time). Every month, make a Small Business* (Adult spec.) test against a TN of 4, with Etiquette as a Complimentary. For every success, you get an additional 5%. Default to Intelligence until you can get some ranks. Thus a savvy businessman (6 ranks of Small Business + 4 Etiquette) will average 4 successes every month, for 500 nuyen profit on a 5000 nuyen expenditure. An average businessman (Small Business 3, Etiquette 3) will barely break even.

Once you quit putting money into it, you've either "sold it" (and will get money for your capital), or put everything in hock until you can fire it up again. If it doesn't seem like much, remember that if you did this full time (and got a good Small Business skill), and re-invested all your profit, it would grow exponentially. You'd be making some good money in a few years (just like very successful real businesses).

*No idea if this is a real Knowledge Skill. Seems like a reasonable one though.

[amadeus]

Quick question on a simular topic, how do people think these two situations should be handled (I will describe them and report how our groups handles it below)

1) The PC Rigger wants to be able to make some money doing shadow tech work, or working on other people's cars...

we have found rules for this (kinda), here are the apporpiate quotes from Rigger three, both on page page 124,

the mechanic contact describes it has shadowtechs charge 100 :nuyen: for an hours work. Also, in the do-it-yourself section it describes that a PC-Rigger can do his own shop work for 6 hours a day without causing problems with other aspects of his life.

Thus, for our group, the rigger (that's me!!) decides how many days I spend on doing shadow mechanic work, and roll 1D6 for each day; then add this up, and multiply by 100 :nuyen: for how much money is made.
(and sixes do not explode)
Thus say for 10 days, say I roll
6,5,5,5,4,3,3,2,2, 1 totaling: 36 x 100 = 3600 :nuyen: for those ten days.

Using 3.5 per day (the expected value of a D6 ) and 30 days in a month, this averages out to be 105, x 100 = 10500, dollars in labor work (or in our case profit), We do not inculde part costs because we assume those are paid for by the consumer...

This seems like a bit much to me, but hey I want to know what you guys think about this so... like I said this is what our group uses.

We also cap how much you can make in a month by adding up your B/R skills (in this case all of the vechicle ones) and that times a thousand is the cap. So say I have Car B/4 4, and hovercraft B/4 2, then my total would be 6 x 1000 = 6000 :nuyen: cap per month, so I could never make more then 6000 :nuyen: per month (with these skills) also It goes without saying the Rigger would need 1) space to work in, and 2) tools before he does this, I would say at least a Middle Space, and at least a shop if not a facility to do his work in. Also, he would probably have to set up some way to routinely get vechile parts for his shop.

I have a lifestyle with high space (as per SSG) which for me is a 3 car garage under an appartment, with a vechile shop.

2) say the PC decker wants to do the same with his computer B/R skills... we don't have a decker so we haven't discussed this in our group, ( plan on becomming a real Textpert, and branching out) so I have no idea how this would work, probably along the same lines as the rigger stuff.

3) also has an after thought, (kinda two questions really) what about a PC using say his instruction skill to teach others...

4) and fourth, (in the main book it says somewhere under learning new spells that a instructor cost 1000 :nuyen: per force of the spell) how much would it be for a PC to get an instructor for a more mundane task, such as martial arts or pistols ? still a 1000 per rating (the new skill rating that is).


And as a side note, to the decker question, it says in the programming section (don't feel like looking it up) that a PC decker can program for 8 hours without interferring with his other obligations. So why the difference between deckers and riggers/gunsmiths... (i don't know where the rule it but I have been told that PCs making their own guns can only work 6 hours in a day.)

so yea, thoughts?

amadeus


[edit] forgive my bad spelling [/edit]

[hahnsoo]

Typical Instruction skill fees are found on p50 of the Shadowrun Companion:
Instruction Skill 1 = 40 nuyen/day
Instruction Skill 2 = 50 nuyen/day
Instruction Skill 3 = 75 nuyen/day
Instruction Skill 4 = 100 nuyen/day
Instruction Skill 5 = 200 nuyen/day
Instruction Skill 6 = 400 nuyen/day
Instruction Skill 7+ = 400 (+ 100 per skill point above 6) nuyen/day

Trainee is Learning Skill Rating of 2 or 3: -25 nuyen/day
Trainee is Learning Skill Rating of 4 or 5: No change
Trainee is Learning Skill Rating of 6 or 7: +25 nuyen/day
Trainee is Learning Skill Rating of 8+: +50 nuyen/day

This assumes 4 hours per day of instruction.

I don't think it's unreasonable for a rigger who is doing repair work during downtime to earn a little cred for it, especially since monthly upkeep for vehicles can get pretty expensive (1% of the drone/vehicle cost of ALL vehicles isn't trivial). However, a rigger would be hard-pressed to do that and do other meaningful things with his/her downtime.

[fistandantilus4....]

Make deckers work for it. If they get some good programming skills and equipment, and spend their down time writing programs to sell, they might as well retire if they can get their computers (or prog spec) to say...8 (which is NOT hard w/ specialization) they might as well retire. Checked the street index for programs lately, especially say around 9? Sell that stuff, can cover your time for a run, especially if you buy a permanent life style. That's why writing programs takes so damn long. BUT, you divide it by your successes.

[Westiex]

And the lovely thing about programs is you can sell them, not once, not twice, but as many times as you want ...

[Edward]

The problem with selling programs is that they are reproducible, write once sell 50 times over the next 3 months. To easy and in no way balanced.

the reason programmers can work for 2 extra hours a day is that after woods they need a light shower before they can go and meet a fancy contact at a restaurant. If you where working on a vehicle it will take that extra time to get properly clean. It doesn’t work for people that lie low lifestyles and have street contacts but its the best I can come up with.

Edward

[hahnsoo]

[nezumi]

[amadeus]

hmmmm, lots to think about on the decker side, and I can see your point about the two extra hours, and thx hahnsoo for the reference to SR Comp, I haven't read that book yet... I guess I need to.

But, to jump back to my orginal question, what do you guys think about the rigger mechanic rules we have been using, (this is more like providing a service, instead of selling a manufactured thing...)

amadeus

[Smiley]

To jump back to MY original question, does anybody else have ideas that won't automatically be losing money? I wrote up the custom lifestyle stats for the building using SSG and I can afford to pay the 100 month's rent required to own the building. I was just wondering about balancing employees' salaries, etc. Maybe some variation of tha day job flaw?

[lorthazar]

Easy make the dancer's work for tips, put a cover charge on the door.

There is no easy way out of it to tell the truth.

[Capt. Dave]

Well, the Day Job flaw works out to 100 :nuyen: per hour for 10 hours/week, and 125 :nuyen: an hour for 20/40 hours a week. This might need to vary depending on various positions. Waiters, IMHO would make less, and dancers more.

You'll probably need to get some security, bartenders, wait staff, dancers, a light/sound/tech guy, and maybe a manager for some of the everyday stuff, to take a lot of the burden off you, the owner. If you want to serve food, add in cooks/chefs and assistants. It all depends on how big you want the place to be and what "services" you wish to provide.

Also, business require licenses, you might want to go with a variation on the rules for licensing a clinic or hospital. A thing to remember regarding other costs is that if you set up shop in organized crime/gang territory, protection money might be required. Also, bribes to the police may be needed if you want to run prostitution/drugs/BTL rooms/Bunraku parlors/etc.

All, in all, I think it's a great idea, and can easily provide plot hooks and runs.

[Smiley]

No prostitution, no drugs, no Mafia. My place is clean, classy, and legitimate. No kitchen, so no cooks or anything, just a few bouncers, a few waitresses, and some talented entertainment providers. The wait staff and talent I can probably get reasonably cheap because they mostly work for tips. It's the bouncers that will cost me, assuming I want some that are any good. Which I do. I'm sure I can find DJs for cheap, who wouldn't want to get their name out there while staring at booties in g-strings?

Where are the licensing rules?

[Capt. Dave]

[Smiley]

Kinda steep. The liquor license at my place of employment was only a couple thou.

[Charon]

[Aku]

hehe, i think i might use that tactic and invest in docwagon :D

[Capt. Dave]

[Nikoli]

Also, for teh rigger mechanic, Connected (Vehicle parts, purchase) is almost a must. You're markup would be huge as you get to sell the parts at street index.

[Edward]

The problem with running a business is it is complicated and requires a wide variety of skills. Your strip club will require
Knowledge music
Knowledge strip clubs
Knowledge finances (small business)
Knowledge beverages
Knowledge food
Negotiation
Etiquette
Intimidation
Interrogation

Some of these you can default on but not all.

Also running such a business is a full time job (I have known people that run clubs 12 hours days 7 days a week is common) when will you run the shadows. You could hire a manager but he doesn’t have the same drive to see the place succeed you do and you have to pay him.

If you really want to do it take the day job flaw at a high value

Personally I would say list it as a retirement goal.

Edward

[Rory Blackhand]

[weblife]