 What does levitate specifically do?, Anti-grav, point-to-point, what? |
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 Jul 1 2005, 02:19 PM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538  |
I understand that levitate allows the caster to move an object at a set speed limited by force every turn.
How does it do this? It can't be applying a vector force otherwise the target object would accelerate. What happens when the object is moved through a medium other than ground-ish level air, say underwater or from the top of Everest? |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:22 PM
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#2
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
It's magic.
Then you could probably up or down the meters per turn that the spell allows someone to move. Or leave it the same, and say "Hey, it's magic!" |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:25 PM
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#3
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Maaaaaagic. :silly: [EDIT: Doh, slow on the draw]
I don't remember the exact spell wording, but as a GM i would likely rule that Levitate works fine in water. P.S. Commercial airplanes regularly fly higher than Mount Everest, so you are still dealing with air. Just not as much. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:26 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
Err, Bigity, why'd you bother putting a reply up.
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Jul 1 2005, 02:24 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
Yeah, but very thin air. A jet can fly at that altitude, but a helicopter can't.
So in your view levitate moves a weight and not a mass? |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:28 PM
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#6
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
Because I was answering your questions?
I just answered them in a sarcastic manner, which is my way. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:26 PM
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#7
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
So, either rule that it works better, worse, or not at all. There's no canon rules covering any of this. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:33 PM
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#8
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
My fault for skipping the "don't bother answering if the answer is flippant" blurb.
I just like getting a bit of online-concensus on house-ruling, it smoothes the waters round the table when somebody disagrees. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:36 PM
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#9
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
Because it was a reasonble response from his perspective?
I would argue that wherever you are in the manasphere, the spell functions normally as described. Except of course if you can't move through the matter in your way (i.e. through the mountain is a no, over it is a yes). The acceleration at the beginning of the first phase of movement may be astronomical, but the spell affects you based on your interconnectedness to the mana and, well, its magical. And the speeds listed are not that fast that it is unreasonable for a metahuman to survive the initial bump of takeoff. People walk away from high speed crashes if they are sufficiently restrained, so I could see the magic cushioning your aura and you as it moves you. Might yo ube shaken up? Sure, but you won't be messed up necessarily. I don't think we want vehicle acceleration rules brought into this, do we? |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:38 PM
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#10
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
I'd just either leave it alone, or cut the movement in half for thick environments (water, sewer sludge), and leave it the same for any type of atmosphere someone could breath in.
Or..I wouldn't let it work at all in anything like water or beer or anything besides air/gases. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:40 PM
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#11
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
Basically (from physics 101) the viscosity of the fluid you are traveling through has a large impact on maximum speed. Drag from air at a vehilce's cruising rate may be based on Velocity^4 or more for a car. Since you are moving through a much higher viscosity medium I could see the affect of the spell mitigated by the ratio of the viscosity of the medium to that of air as a scalar reduction.
Obviously someone with more hydro and flow theory than I could write this up more coherently than I just did, but I think my point stands. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:46 PM
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#12
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
People walk away from high speed crashes if they are given enough distance to deccelerate, quite an important distinction. 70mph-0mph in 2 feet will mess-up your insides no matter how good the restraints. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:50 PM
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#13
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
But probably meaningfully less if the acceleration is (magically!) applied to every particle in your body, as opposed to letting all sorts of bits get thrown against each other.
Actually, would you even take damage in that case? Can someone more versed than I am in impacts chime in? Seems to me you'd eliminate bruising, excessive changes in blood pressure, bone breakage, and pretty much all other negative effects of it, but I could be dramatically wrong (especially since I haven't had caffeine yet today). ~J |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:49 PM
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#14
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
So? Not sure how that would significantly influence the effects of a Levitate. If you are worried about weight over mass you'd have to start taking into account the gravity decrease from the mountian effect + gravity decrease from altitude. :silly: The speed increase from reduced friction of the thinner air (why the airliners fly that high) isn't going to be much either.
I was thinking mass actually, weight you could lift more than normal in water. Resistance to movement might play a factor if you tried to move very quickly, but i'd rule that more an influence on the subject being move than on an actual speed reduction. |
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Jul 1 2005, 02:59 PM
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#15
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
Yeah, thats what I was thinking precisely, but since the "Its Magic, woooooo" answer wasn't appreciated, i thought I'd avoid it. As for the acceleration occuring over a small and finite distance, sure, but jet fighters take off at massive accelerations without killing the pilots becuase they are supported. Think about it like being scooped up by a big acceleration couch and all your worries go away. |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:03 PM
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#16
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
Sorry, typo attack switched mass and weight around. What do you suggest the spell uses to move the target around. Gravity displacement or vector thrust don't seem to cope with levitate. |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:03 PM
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#17
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
Now that has to be an SR must. The magical air-bag, all of a sudden that 100mph crash is now only a 40mph crash. |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:07 PM
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#18
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
That isnot it at all. If all your bits are moved at the same time in the same directin at the same rate, then you aren't going to notice the accelleration as such...
No impact, no cry. :silly: |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:19 PM
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#19
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Maaaaaagic. :silly: It is here, then it is there. So force was applied on the mass. Whether this was a redirect or influence on gravity? *shrug* I'd say nah, just some sort of force applied. What do you mean by vector thrust doen't work? You mean a single vector acting on one part of the subject and the rest gets pushed along for the ride? |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:18 PM
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#20
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 102 Joined: 13-March 04 From: Apparently in front of a computer. Member No.: 6,153 |
Ok, it states that the spells tn is increased by 1 for every full 100 kgs of mass being lifted. therefore it is mass dependent. since a human or other being is not an aerodynamic object and cannot fly IRL and also wouldnt, unless moving at crazy speeds, be effected (in a manner that would lend to flight) by bernoullis principle we can rule that, if a human or like subject is indeed flying, then bernoullis principlwe must have been evaded somehow. Second the amount of air or liquid probably doesnt affect anything but visibility due to the fact that, magic spells like this generate the effect by getting the target to vibrate on a specific man frequency much like a radio. thus the magic cant be interfered with due to lack of air etc. sounds confusing i know but if your curious about where I got the idea read the theory page in SR3 magic section. |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:20 PM
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#21
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
But if they were wearing an heavy armor suit that would push on them, no? A SMG in their hand would be subject to inertia that would lead to it being hard to keep hold of during acceleration/deacceleration. I mean the stuff they are carrying isn't part of he subject or there would be an OR (which would be a real pain in the butt to overcome at times). |
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Jul 1 2005, 03:23 PM
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#22
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
But the mass of the subject is accounted for in the TN of the spell. I would rule that the mass includes carried gear and therefore the gear is affected by the maaaagic, wooOOoo!
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Jul 1 2005, 03:58 PM
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#23
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
It's magic.
It's also Levitate - not Buoyancy. Now these answers might seem flippant, but Since there are distinct elements in magic, maybe Levitate only works in the air. :) |
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Jul 1 2005, 04:38 PM
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#24
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
Then the drain code should reflect that limitation based on the spell design rules in MiTS. I haven't checked (at work), does it? |
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Jul 1 2005, 05:07 PM
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#25
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
That sort of thing only applies if the logic proposed in the creation rules was held to in the creation of the published spells.
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