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6thDragon
post Aug 23 2005, 10:39 PM
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QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
Is it possible to have multiple Mentor Spirits?

has already been asked and answered elsewhere on this thread: NO
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Demonseed Elite
post Aug 23 2005, 10:49 PM
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Mentor Spirits, like girlfriends, aren't fond of sharing!
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mfb
post Aug 23 2005, 10:54 PM
Post #128


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[menage a trois-charged innuendo]
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JongWK
post Aug 23 2005, 10:56 PM
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But, uh... how would Gaf qualify?

:silly:
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Demonseed Elite
post Aug 23 2005, 11:10 PM
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QUOTE (mfb)
[menage a trois-charged innuendo]


What you do with your ally spirit is none of my business. 8)
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Rotbart van Dain...
post Aug 23 2005, 11:14 PM
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Oops, sorry, missed that - thx anyway. :twirl:

Well, I thought more of it like a small angel on one, and a small devil on the other shoulder...
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morlock76
post Aug 24 2005, 08:10 AM
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QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
Oops, sorry, missed that - thx anyway. :twirl:

Well, I thought more of it like a small angel on one, and a small devil on the other shoulder...

Well, why not create your own Mentor Spirit with this two voices. Each grants a bonus but as drawback it always takes time to listen to the two rant at each other and till you make up your mind.

As in every rule, this can be crafted to your needs, given the GM approval.
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nick012000
post Aug 24 2005, 08:48 AM
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Can you summon your mentor spirit?

Any rules for ally spirits?
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Demonseed Elite
post Aug 24 2005, 12:45 PM
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No, you can't summon your Mentor Spirit, but he or she might decide to make an appearance of some kind. But you shouldn't have Mentor Spirits dropping in to do some ass-kicking when a run turns sour. They are very abstract beings, much like the old Totems.

I don't think info on ally spirits is in the core book.
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elbows
post Aug 24 2005, 01:49 PM
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How does Spell Defense work now that there's no Spell Pool?
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6thDragon
post Aug 24 2005, 01:57 PM
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QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
Oops, sorry, missed that - thx anyway. :twirl:

Well, I thought more of it like a small angel on one, and a small devil on the other shoulder...

Make a mentor spirit with multiple personalities. That would make for an interesting character. :scatter:
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 04:09 PM
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QUOTE (tisoz)
QUOTE (blakkie @ Aug 22 2005, 09:11 PM)
P.S. Did you see anything about the old exclusive action restrictions i listed earlier such as sustaing a spell while going into or out of astral projection?

I have not noticed any exclusive actions.

Just for the record "Exclusive Actions" are gone at this point in time in the game across the board.
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hahnsoo
post Aug 24 2005, 06:03 PM
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QUOTE (elbows)
How does Spell Defense work now that there's no Spell Pool?

You add Counterspelling dice (one of the skills in the Sorcery Skill Group) to any hostile attempt to cast spells on yourself and any protected individuals. All magicians are always considered protecting themselves with Counterspelling dice, and it takes a Free Action to designate others as protected. You can only protect those within your line of sight.
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blakkie
post Aug 24 2005, 06:08 PM
Post #139


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QUOTE (NeoJudas)
QUOTE (tisoz @ Aug 23 2005, 03:30 AM)
QUOTE (blakkie @ Aug 22 2005, 09:11 PM)
P.S. Did you see anything about the old exclusive action restrictions i listed earlier such as sustaing a spell while going into or out of astral projection?

I have not noticed any exclusive actions.

Just for the record "Exclusive Actions" are gone at this point in time in the game across the board.

I had seen that, i just wanted to make sure all the limitations that they implied are gone as well or if any of the limitations remain under different wording.
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6thDragon
post Aug 24 2005, 06:12 PM
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QUOTE (hahnsoo)
QUOTE (elbows @ Aug 24 2005, 08:49 AM)
How does Spell Defense work now that there's no Spell Pool?

You add Counterspelling dice (one of the skills in the Sorcery Skill Group) to any hostile attempt to cast spells on yourself and any protected individuals. All magicians are always considered protecting themselves with Counterspelling dice, and it takes a Free Action to designate others as protected. You can only protect those within your line of sight.

Does counterspelling count as an action or does it work like the old spell defense? How will the shielding metamagic work into the counterspelling, or will it work differently?
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hahnsoo
post Aug 24 2005, 06:21 PM
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QUOTE (6thDragon)
Does counterspelling count as an action or does it work like the old spell defense? How will the shielding metamagic work into the counterspelling, or will it work differently?

It's passive, in that it doesn't take an action to use (except for the Free Action to extend protection over your friends). Shielding adds your Initiate Grade to your Counterspelling attempts for the purposes of spell defense only (There are other ways to use Counterspelling, and Shielding doesn't help with that).
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 06:48 PM
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QUOTE (Magnus Jakobsson)
The new armor rules will probably make stun damage more widespread. Is it still impossible to heal stun damage with magic?

QUOTE (Bull)
Initiation gives you access to a metamagic ability and raises your Magic Attribute Cap, but does not raise your actual Magic Attribute, as noted by others.

Does this mean that after earning his first 6 power points (the ones he started with in SR3), the adept must pay 34, 40, 46 etc. karma for more powers?

Sorry for nitpicking, but I just wanted to be clear on this.

- Magnus

Initiation is 10 + ((Target/Would-Be) Grade x 3).

As for the Adept, it would be 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, etc... if I've read the book correctly.
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hahnsoo
post Aug 24 2005, 06:52 PM
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QUOTE (NeoJudas)
Initiation is 10 + ((Target/Would-Be) Grade x 3).

As for the Adept, it would be 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, etc... if I've read the book correctly.

But you'd still have to pay for the Karma cost of the increased Magic attribute, so it would be an additional 21, 24, 27, 30, etc. So really, to get powers above Magic 6, it would be a total cost (including Initiation and buying the Magic attribute) of 34, 40, 46, etc., adding 6 each time.
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 07:06 PM
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QUOTE (Kesh)
Not sure if this is the right thread but, are their rules for playing a Ghoul or other humanoid in the critters section? BP cost?

It was mentioned at the "Whats Up with FanPro" seminar that rules for alternative character types such as Ghouls (I heard Rob say "infected" and had to ask "what the....?" myself), Shapeshifters, etc... *MIGHT* be in an upcoming book (Running Wild??? did I hear that right?).

The rules for such are not currently in the SR4 Core book.
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 07:08 PM
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QUOTE (hahnsoo)
QUOTE (NeoJudas @ Aug 24 2005, 01:48 PM)
Initiation is 10 + ((Target/Would-Be) Grade x 3).

As for the Adept, it would be 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, etc... if I've read the book correctly.

But you'd still have to pay for the Karma cost of the increased Magic attribute, so it would be an additional 21, 24, 27, 30, etc. So really, to get powers above Magic 6, it would be a total cost (including Initiation and buying the Magic attribute) of 34, 40, 46, etc., adding 6 each time.

Ah yeah, I keep forgetting that about the new rules. This is one that we are "House Ruling" out of existance, or at least altering pretty quickly for ourselves. It is of interest that the Core Book does not mention the ability to buy additional Power Points with just Karma as in the 3rd Ed rules.
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 07:17 PM
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QUOTE (6thDragon)
QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig @ Aug 23 2005, 07:14 PM)
Oops, sorry, missed that - thx anyway. :twirl:

Well, I thought more of it like a small angel on one, and a small devil on the other shoulder...

Make a mentor spirit with multiple personalities. That would make for an interesting character. :scatter:

Sounds a lot like the "Loa Spirits" of 3rd Ed with their Standard/Petro paths.
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 07:20 PM
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QUOTE (hahnsoo)
QUOTE (elbows @ Aug 24 2005, 08:49 AM)
How does Spell Defense work now that there's no Spell Pool?

You add Counterspelling dice (one of the skills in the Sorcery Skill Group) to any hostile attempt to cast spells on yourself and any protected individuals. All magicians are always considered protecting themselves with Counterspelling dice, and it takes a Free Action to designate others as protected. You can only protect those within your line of sight.

I have to admit something here, I keep looking for "limits" to how many targets can be defended using the new rules. I realize the "within LOS" limitation exists, but let's say for instance the magician is trying to protect a whole crowd of people that are immediately in front of him from being negatively influenced by a <insert fave evil bad guy with mental manipulations here>. Does this mean one magician can protect 100 people as evenly as s/he can protect one provided they are in LOS?
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blakkie
post Aug 24 2005, 07:22 PM
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QUOTE (NeoJudas @ Aug 24 2005, 01:08 PM)
QUOTE (hahnsoo)
QUOTE (NeoJudas @ Aug 24 2005, 01:48 PM)
Initiation is 10 + ((Target/Would-Be) Grade x 3).

As for the Adept, it would be 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, etc... if I've read the book correctly.

But you'd still have to pay for the Karma cost of the increased Magic attribute, so it would be an additional 21, 24, 27, 30, etc. So really, to get powers above Magic 6, it would be a total cost (including Initiation and buying the Magic attribute) of 34, 40, 46, etc., adding 6 each time.

Ah yeah, I keep forgetting that about the new rules. This is one that we are "House Ruling" out of existance, or at least altering pretty quickly for ourselves. It is of interest that the Core Book does not mention the ability to buy additional Power Points with just Karma as in the 3rd Ed rules.

No, that defunct patch in SR3 didn't make it.

Before you go off and seriously drop the cost of Initiating you might want to reconsider. Remember the only way to lose Magic [at this point] is implanting 'ware. So there is even less check on Magic than in SR3. Also SR4 had a big reduction in karma spent on Spells as you increase Magic. You spend no karma there unless adding new spells, and even those only cost 5 karma each.

Maybe it wouldn't be as bad for Adepts, but cheapening Magic that much for all awakened characters is just asking for mage power to overwhelm your game.

EDIT: As an intermediate step you could remove the cap from Magic for Adepts only (but not MW Adepts). They could then raise at attribute costs w/o having to Initiate. But if there is a metamagic power they want they have to initiate to get it, but get no Magic increase for Initiating.
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NeoJudas
post Aug 24 2005, 07:23 PM
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QUOTE (Milo Simpkin)
Hmmm....all sounding interesting so far. Just a couple of further questions:

Ritual Sorcery: Can you still withhold dice to git the ritual to sustain the spell for you?

Increase Body: If you cast this on someone do they get more wound boxes? Just thinking that might be a quick way to get someone who has a full condition monitor up and about to hobble out for better healing later.

Thanks.

I have to admit, this (ritual rules) is something I hope has more expansion for "alternative rules" in the upcoming Street Magic book, because quite frankly if these are the new rules ... wow, I know I'll be using them a LOT for villains in upcoming games.

As for that Increase Body to stave off a person's from dying ... what a neat trick. My next question would then come with "does the new Body Attribute also get to resist the wounds suffered already?" My personal answer would be "of course not for wounds currently suffered from" but the question is likely to be asked.
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apple
post Aug 24 2005, 07:26 PM
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QUOTE (blakkie)
You spend no karma there unless adding new spells, and even those only cost 5 karma each.


Only? Many Spells in SR3 were very useful just with force 1-4.

SYL
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