 Shadowrun 4: Magic |
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 Aug 23 2005, 02:43 AM
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#76
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Free Spirit  Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920  |
There is obviously a typo or 2 because it should be 5 x 3 and there is a ( missing. It continues:
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Aug 23 2005, 02:48 AM
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#77
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
They get power points equal to their Magic attribute, which starts at one and can be bought up as stated elsewhere. Astral perception is half as much, the rest look about the same. Mystic Armor now counts as Ballistic and Impact and works against astral combat. |
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Aug 23 2005, 02:57 AM
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#78
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
Projecting magicians time is now linked to Magic not essence.
Astral forms no longer are able to pass through earth. Manifesting characters are vulnerable to mana-based effects on the physical plane. |
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Aug 23 2005, 03:11 AM
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#79
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Could be you can techinally cast them all you want, but they don't actually affect anything? They do say that Physical spells only affects things on the Physical plane? I'd see that as an oversight, but not so much for people that don't have a history of grounding (played SR2 or SR3 with grounding house rules). I wouldn't assume grounding is back based on that alone as that implies there is a conduit (especially for AoE spells) back to the Physical plane. It is just as easy to assume that you have LOS (with perception penalties) to the physical plane, and that physical plane only dwellers are at the complete mercy of astral only spell casting entities. Besides the obvious balance issues. P.S. Did you see anything about the old exclusive action restrictions i listed earlier such as sustaing a spell while going into or out of astral projection? |
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Aug 23 2005, 03:30 AM
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#80
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
I have not noticed any exclusive actions. |
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Aug 23 2005, 03:50 AM
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#81
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
Sustaining foci now cost 2*Force to bond.
Since there is not yet mention of exclusive actions, characters could use ritual magic to cast spells (increase hits) and use foci to sustain them. Could be quite useful with spells like Analyze device (rewritten to be useful as now each success over the object res. is a die while operating the device, like a gun, and can ignore defaulting modifiers), Increase Reflexes (where threshold 4 Gives +3 initiative, +3 passes) or Invisiblity. |
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Aug 23 2005, 04:15 AM
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#82
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 124 Joined: 7-February 05 Member No.: 7,063 |
Speaking of Ritual Spellcasting, how does it work now?
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Aug 23 2005, 09:15 AM
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#83
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Target Group: Members Posts: 22 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 385 |
Magical barriers/armor: how do they work? Does EXex/APDS and/or volume of fire affect them? Can I make a barrier like a bridge and walk on it?
Can I dikote my ally spirit(and what do I roll to have sex with it)? ;) |
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Aug 23 2005, 09:21 AM
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#84
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 124 Joined: 7-February 05 Member No.: 7,063 |
Come to think of it, I'm completely amazed that nobody has asked that yet. :wobble: I'll bet that we have to wait until Street Magic to get the full rules for pimpin' out the Spirit Harem™. |
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Aug 23 2005, 10:23 AM
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#85
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,546 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
Yeouch, magic is the only attribute without a cap, huh? Every character caps out at 15 dice in attribute and skill in their particular field of choice EXCEPT the mage, who can go on to 1500.
This is displeasing. |
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Aug 23 2005, 10:31 AM
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#86
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Ya, So although subdued, the old SR3 issue of caster demigods over the longterm is still around. They set it up so mages have to buy in two steps to raise each Magic point past 6. At 10 + 3*Grade to initiate plus the normal Attribute raising it costs a total in the mid-twenties for 6 -> 7, and an even 40 for 7 -> 8. The bad news is Magic Loss only occurs on a voluntary basis, with the implant of 'ware. |
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Aug 23 2005, 12:51 PM
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#87
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
Easier than before. Can do it solo. Hits on magic + ritual spellcasting determine success. Additional members of the team, same tradition, hits grant bonus dice to leader. Team must all know spell, size is limited to lower of Force of lodge or Lowest ritual spellcasting skill of the team. Still have targeting if out of LOS. I think you now have to make sure the spotter has enough time to stay astrally projected, but a bound spirits can be used as spotters. Spotter must be able to assense the target. The leader's Magic + Ritual Spellcasting forms the base dice pool. Spell Force is limited by leader's Magic attribute. If the force is higher than leaders Magic, the entire team resists Physical drain. Takes 12 hours minus leader's Magic, minimum 1 hour. Individuals may use foci to supplement their own tests. It isn't stated in the same place, but it mentions individuals may use foci or bound spirits who are not otherwise occupied to resist drain. So I assume a spirit could be used to Aid Sorcery. In fact, Ritual Sorcery is listed under the Aid Sorcery section. Note too, only one focus may contribute to a single dice pool, so no ritual focus + power focus + power focus. But dice pool + focus + spirit aid sorcery power seems legit for the ritual casting for each member and the same combo again for drain. |
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Aug 23 2005, 12:57 PM
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#88
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
you could allways do it solo. just as long as you dont need a ritual tracking to locate the target first ;) |
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Aug 23 2005, 02:13 PM
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#89
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Target Group: Members Posts: 15 Joined: 20-August 05 Member No.: 7,576 |
The new armor rules will probably make stun damage more widespread. Is it still impossible to heal stun damage with magic?
Does this mean that after earning his first 6 power points (the ones he started with in SR3), the adept must pay 34, 40, 46 etc. karma for more powers? Sorry for nitpicking, but I just wanted to be clear on this. - Magnus |
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Aug 23 2005, 02:20 PM
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#90
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Yes, you still cannot heal stun damage. It even specifically says so in the Spell catalog (along with Psychological illnesses).
An adept may not necessarily start with 6 power points in SR4, since Magic is bought just like any other attribute. Your other assessment is correct. An Adept, once they hit the Magic Attribute 6 cap, must Initiate first, then purchase the next point of Magic to hit 7 and get another point of powers. Note that you don't have to wait until then to get your first Initiate grade... as long as your Initiate Grade (in this case, 0) is less than your Magic Attribute, you may Initiate.
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Aug 23 2005, 03:18 PM
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#91
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
Doing it solo wasn't part of the easier, but now you can do it solo and have a bound spirit do the tracking, (though I thought you could have an elemental do it in SR3. Not sure, rarely played hermetic.) Easier was everyone being able to use foci and bound spirits. And no longer mention of it being an exclusive action so can be combined with other strategies to make it easier and more useful - like I said about using it for casting sustaining foci spells. |
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Aug 23 2005, 03:47 PM
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#92
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 669 Joined: 25-May 03 Member No.: 4,634 |
Is there a limit on how many Mentor Spirits a magician can ally himself to? I don't personally think it would be a problem to have more than one (like a dark mage having made several pacts with powerful spirits), as long as you can find a logical way of stacking bonuses/penalties (i.e., you can't have a mentor who requires blood sacrifice and a mentor who requires pacifism).
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Aug 23 2005, 03:50 PM
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#93
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 266 Joined: 16-April 02 From: DC Member No.: 2,605 |
I noticed in the other tread that combat spell formulae are Forbidden (as far as availability goes) How will this affect learning a spell at character creation or during gameplay? Will you still be able to write your own spell formulaes? Will the elemental manipulation spell be included in this too?
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Aug 23 2005, 03:57 PM
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#94
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
planing to pull a constantine are we? :rotfl: (didnt he have so many contracts on his soul with beings downstairs that if he ever died he would start a war?) |
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Aug 23 2005, 04:12 PM
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#95
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Only one. p79
As long as the availability is 12 or below, you can purchase it at character creation. Thus, combat spells can be learned at character creation. I think the reason they are Forbidden is not because they don't exist legally, but because any act of magic used for hurting others is automatically considered Assault, and any death is considered premeditated murder, but this is just speculation. "Elemental Manipulations" are now considered Indirect Combat Spells instead.
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Aug 23 2005, 05:25 PM
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#96
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 778 Joined: 6-April 05 Member No.: 7,298 |
Can you magically heal physical damage taken from drain?
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Aug 23 2005, 05:30 PM
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#97
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Good question! I can't honestly say. I've not seen anything under the Magic section (specifically, the Heal spell description) or the Health and Damage section to say with any certainty. From what I've read so far, you can heal damage from drain using Magic, but I could very well be wrong (and I'm looking as hard as I can here). |
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Aug 23 2005, 05:32 PM
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#98
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 778 Joined: 6-April 05 Member No.: 7,298 |
How about healing the same set of wounds more than once?
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Aug 23 2005, 05:35 PM
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#99
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Not with Magical Healing. You can heal any single "set" of wounds once with First Aid and once with Magical Healing (in that order). First Aid is a very icky roll now (I think it's something like a Threshold 2 with net successes determining how many boxes are healed), but there is a new skill called "Medicine" that allows you to augment long-term healing (finally! Separating First Aid from Medicine). Very similar to the way it was in SR3. |
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Aug 23 2005, 05:56 PM
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#100
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 778 Joined: 6-April 05 Member No.: 7,298 |
Okay. I forsee a lot of one- and two-box physical wounds from spellcasting being healed completely and nearly immediately by first aid and/or more spellcasting. In fact, with only a one-die penalty to worry about, I'd probably recommend always overcasting, since the penalty's not bad and you'll be back on your feet sooner.
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