 Ares Slivergun - Variations on a Theme, Creative players plaguing Gamemasters |
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 Sep 9 2005, 05:57 AM
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#26
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 458 Joined: 12-April 04 From: Lacey, Washington Member No.: 6,237  |
Can you give us the make and model of that airgun?
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Sep 9 2005, 06:21 AM
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#27
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
Good luck delivering anything but a superficial wound with your paintball gun (given you're not jamming the muzzle in someone's eye). |
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Sep 9 2005, 06:41 AM
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#28
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
If you made it pointy you could do something.
Granted it'd be a weak something, but you should never underestimate the power of pointy things. ~J |
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Sep 9 2005, 09:16 AM
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#29
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 596 Joined: 18-February 03 Member No.: 4,112 |
Paintball gun, you mean. Stop confusing me, or I'll start crying. |
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Sep 9 2005, 01:03 PM
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#30
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 404 Joined: 22-June 05 From: Canada eh! Member No.: 7,455 |
Where does it say that? In BBB it says, This pistol fires flechette ammunition (which is already factored into its Damage Code). It has the range of a heavy pistol and features a built in silencer. It holds twice the ammo, and has a better concealment rating. I remember hearing about the ceramic disk that shaves off needles before. I am most certainly sure that it doesn't use standard HP flechette rounds. |
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Sep 9 2005, 01:07 PM
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#31
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 404 Joined: 22-June 05 From: Canada eh! Member No.: 7,455 |
Any electric airsoft gun will be almost silent. There is some minor clicking. |
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Sep 9 2005, 01:42 PM
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#32
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Electric airsoft guns are an order of magnitude less powerful than BB guns. At the high end we're talking about something like a 4.5 grain projectile launched at 450fps, 2.02ft-lbs at the muzzle, while 3.1gr @ 300fps = 0.62ft-lbs is more common. Many mid-price airguns can easily manage an 8gr projectile at 850fps, 12.84ft-lbs, while more powerful ones can fire 14gr pellets at 1300fps, 52.55ft-lbs. As far as I can figure, paintball guns can generally be expected to launch a 45gr ball at 280fps, 7.84ft-lbs.
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Sep 9 2005, 02:17 PM
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#33
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,548 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
To get back to the topic at hand, I can't imagine the splinter rounds working too well (I believe they've been mentioned elsewhere). There are an assortment of problems with shooting with something like that. You're better off with a crossbow. Can't say much on the ice rounds.
However, the tracker rounds would make sense, assuming the bullet is big enough and the electronics pricey. It wouldn't have much range, though, and odds are against it working once it hit something (bullets tend to deform and break). But if you're lucky... I suppose one could decrease the muzzle velocity by cutting down onn the amount of cordite in the bullet, which would in turn give you more space for the equipment and cause less damage to the bullet, but penetration would be bad and it would be ungood at longer ranges (presumably its lighter and has less force behind it, so its more at the whims of other factors). But I haven't had enough experience to say that's more than just a semi-informed opinion. |
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Sep 9 2005, 03:25 PM
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#34
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
Cordite hasn't been used for over 50 years.
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Sep 9 2005, 04:28 PM
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#35
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Traumatizing players since 1992 Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,282 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Las Vegas, NV Member No.: 220 |
Dude, the pellet fired in that instance contained Ricin. One of the deadliest compounds known. That's what killed the target, not the BB. |
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Sep 9 2005, 05:22 PM
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#36
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
I believe that's why he referred to it as 'a kind of narcojet.'
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Sep 9 2005, 05:39 PM
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#37
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,548 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
Would you believe it's because I'm running a 1920's gangster game? Actually, doing a quick search on Wikipedia shows guns currently use Cordite N. Is this incorrect? |
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Sep 9 2005, 06:38 PM
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#38
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
the lady was shot at what? 40 yards? yes a airgun can be deadly at that close a range. but at that range i may well use a handgun as its much easy to conseal so that i can get so close to the target. a nice rifle on the other hand i can be up on some roof several 100 yards away and still be deadly, no matter where i hit the person. allso, there is no talk about the woman instantly dieing from said wound. by the text it sounds like a cut that didnt even penetrate the skull. the lady may as well have died from some internal bleeding inside the skull or maybe some infection of the wound. allso, the same text talks about the owner himself being shot in the buttocks by the same gun. no range given tho. thing is that he didnt get so much hurt that he wasnt able to arm himself with anything within range. and i think ill follow rayguns request on this now :P allso, yes. i was fully aware that the pellet was used to deliver ricin. and thats why i called it a kind of narcoject. |
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Sep 9 2005, 07:41 PM
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#39
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
Cordite N is used for medium and large caliber (naval artillery) munitions, not small arms. It's a triple-base propellant. Since there are cheaper ways of making more efficient propellants (single and double-based powders) and considering the way it's extruded (makes it difficult to pack a case efficiently), Cordite N generally isn't used as a propellant for small arms munitions. I'm pretty sure the UK is the only nation still using Cordite N in quantity. When you hear someone on TV talking about "smelling the cordite" in relation to small arms (for example, one of the crime scene investigators in Collateral) it's pretty much a case of the writer attepting to write something gun-sounding without generalizing as much as saying "gunpowder". Cordite is just one kind of propellant, and one that is not widely used at that. |
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Sep 9 2005, 07:54 PM
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#40
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,548 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
So what is the term used now? Gunpowder? I thought gunpowder referred to black powder, which we were way past.
(And I have to say yay that I'm not COMPLETELY wrong, just wrong in most cases) |
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Sep 9 2005, 08:35 PM
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#41
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 295 Joined: 10-July 05 Member No.: 7,492 |
I believe we're still on Smokeless Powder (so named because of the distinct lack of a choking black cloud when you fire)
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Sep 9 2005, 09:34 PM
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#42
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
*shrugs* Why not just propellant?
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Sep 9 2005, 10:07 PM
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#43
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
"Gunpowder" pretty much covers everything we use in small arms these days, both black powder, and more commonly, smokeless (nitrocellulose-based) powders. Cordite is a nitrocellulose-based propellant, but it is not made in powder (granular) form, rather it is extruded in long rods or cords cut to specific lengths, hence "Cordite".
This picture shows a sectioned round with cordite propellant inside (13.9x99B = .55 Boys). Compare to the others. |
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Sep 9 2005, 11:24 PM
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#44
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
On page 279, where it says all weapons of one class use the same ammo. |
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Sep 9 2005, 11:44 PM
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#45
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
The weapon description on p 277 doesn't count as canon as well? |
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Sep 9 2005, 11:46 PM
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#46
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
All it says on that page is that it fires flechette ammunition, which you can get for an Ares Predator.
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Sep 10 2005, 12:25 AM
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#47
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
Does that mean that if my Ares Predator is using EX-EX and my opponent's Manhunter is using APDS, one of our ammo must magically change into the other? :D
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Sep 10 2005, 12:27 AM
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#48
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
No. What it does mean, however, is you can take the flechette ammo that you loaded into your AVS and put it into an Ares Predator.
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Sep 10 2005, 06:15 AM
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#49
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 404 Joined: 22-June 05 From: Canada eh! Member No.: 7,455 |
I remember in one edition or source book that it stated, the silvergun had its own ammo type. It explained some kind of ceramic wheel. It might say that as a blanket rule, but there are some exceptions. The slivergun is an exception. |
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Sep 10 2005, 06:17 AM
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#50
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Yup, along with the Raecor Sting and the Barret Sniper Rifle. Too bad the writers of SR3 failed to make that distinction with the Viper Slivergun in the Core rulebook. I guess everyone overlooks something along the way. |
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