Dun Fe'Ran
Oct 14 2005, 11:37 PM
Ok, so I'm getting ready to start a short series of runs here, and I'm an overly paranoid player. (Is there really such a thing as too paranoid?) I am a mage and due to certain...intuitive warnings...I believe that a little extra paranoia is justified. I have my spells pretty much all fetished, but the danger of not being able to cast spells has prompted me to tuck away some spares for a rainy day. I have one set of spares at my house in the basement and one set hidden in a compartment in the hilt of my katana. I was kind of wondering what other measures people took when they were feeling especially 'gunned-for' - what else would it be prudent for me to prepare for?
Velocity
Oct 14 2005, 11:58 PM
Dead-man's drops: data packets stashed in quiet corners of the Matrix which, unless fed a 'lullabye' password every 12 hours (or 24 or 48 or whatever), automatically unravel and begin disseminating themselves across the virtual landscape. Naturally, all of the data is highly incriminating to your enemies (and allies, if you're a fan of 'slash-and-burn' tactics).
Read the bolt-holes thread; lots of good ideas there. Start stashing small amounts of
, weapons and ammo in discreet spaces across the city.
Get a vehicle (or two or three if you've got the resources), gas it up, fill the trunk with food and a couple jerrycans of fuel so you don't have to stop for a couple of days. Hide them in case you have to leave town.
Get some currency that doesn't depend on matrix connections or credstick readers: scrip and precious metals. You may have to bribe someone who doesn't have a credstick handy.
If there's time, talk to your cyberdoc and get a fake tooth with a transmitter; it shouldn't cost any Essence and it can allow your allies to get you out of a tight spot.
Find out what a last-minute plane ticket costs and have that much money easily available (like, in your fraggin' pocket).
Stay out of any borough with a security rating higher than C: keep your face off cameras (which are ubiquitous in higher-security areas).
Do you have contacts in the Ork Underground? Why not?
Astrally perceive often: every few minutes is a good guideline. Why? It costs you nothing, doesn't hurt--as long as you're not in combat, natch--and might save your life.
I could go on, but I hope this helps.
Dun Fe'Ran
Oct 15 2005, 12:08 AM
Thanks much! I still have tome to prepare, so it should help.
caramel frappucino
Oct 15 2005, 01:19 AM
Rule #1: Never have all your spells fetished.
If you can't fight naked, you're not paranoid enough.
Fix-it
Oct 15 2005, 02:41 AM
Keep your Laser Handy!
Trust No One!
The Computer is your Frie-
sorry, what were we talking about?
Siege
Oct 15 2005, 03:07 AM
Damnit, I knew this was a seven clone mission!
Don't forget counter-surveillance techniques...do you boobytrap your boltholes?
Do you have pre-paid accounts with street docs that specialize in cosmetic surgery?
-Siege
hahnsoo
Oct 15 2005, 03:31 AM
Ack! You are ALL commie mutant traitors!
Siege
Oct 15 2005, 03:37 AM
Commie, Commie, Commie chameleon...
-Siege
Slump
Oct 15 2005, 07:35 AM
When you do change your face, don't forget to tip hansomly, and give the dock an "after" picture of someone that you really, really don't like.
Just because you're a mage doesn't mean you don't need an assault rifle. Looking dangerous is often as effective as being dangerous, plus you don't really need much skill for supressive fire.
Pack grenades. If you can't hit the broad side of a barn, use something non-lethal, so it won't kill *you.* Grenades of any type tend to cause people to scatter. ("Is that another smoke?" "I don't know, and I don't care, I'm out!")
Dead hookers are a great source of quick cash. If you can't find one, make one.
hyzmarca
Oct 15 2005, 07:43 AM
QUOTE (Slump) |
Just because you're a mage doesn't mean you don't need an assault rifle. Looking dangerous is often as effective as being dangerous, plus you don't really need much skill for supressive fire. |
If you're the mage, it is a good idea to get an old datajack, cut off the electronic parts, and superglue the port to your head. Then, get an empty deck casing and carry it around with you. No one ever says "geek the decker first".
caramel frappucino
Oct 15 2005, 07:58 AM
Although geeking the decker just might get all his buddies to abort if completing the job absolutely requires his abilities. This is often the case when the team finds it necessary to bring their decker along with them in the meat.
JongWK
Oct 15 2005, 02:03 PM
QUOTE (Siege) |
Commie, Commie, Commie chameleon...
-Siege |
I knew Dumpshock would eventually jump the shark, but ... Boy George? Urk!
toturi
Oct 15 2005, 02:34 PM
You should be paranoid. But even the paranoid have enemies. If you let your paranoia to paralyse your PC then it is time for chargen again.
Lenice Hawk
Oct 16 2005, 09:53 AM
But if there are two or 3 decker like people, and no obvious mage,hopefully the enemy will *hopefully* just go after the tank who is more prepared to deal with bulllets.
Also, if imitating a decker, make sure you are a bit unkempt, as deckers aren't known for taking care of their meat bodies. (Stereotypes! EEEK!)
I find that when the runs quit being fun because your worrying what the GM has got planned, then your too paranoid.
hyzmarca
Oct 16 2005, 10:22 AM
QUOTE (caramel frappucino) |
Although geeking the decker just might get all his buddies to abort if completing the job absolutely requires his abilities. This is often the case when the team finds it necessary to bring their decker along with them in the meat. |
When is a Decker integral to a run, really? Paydata? Just blow a bunch of crap up, break into the networking closet, and rip the nonvolitile memory right out of the Host. If you can't do that then just take the whole thing with you.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 16 2005, 11:16 AM
My usually hidey places are in either the ork underground ( I 'bribe' them regularly with loads of food, 'specially from the local Stuffer Shack), or a little bolt hole near Glow City. The place is dangerous on it's own, making it a risky proposition for anyone to follow you in. Plus, with wards in your bolt hole, along with the background, makes astral tracking a task.
I also find that having an ally spirit (or two) and some watchers, and some spirits/elementals (greatform) in your doss on gaurd (behind masked wards) is also good ofr the piece of mind.
Never, ever require anything to cast a spell. No fetish modifiers are that important. You can always use an expendable one anyways. While it's more expensive, you're also a lot more flexible.
Get drones. Get a rigger buddy. Get a machanic buddy. Get some skills to ocmmand them. Then get some drones to guard yer butt. Then install a tinsy bit of CXII and a radio detonator on some important circuit boards onthem, or better yeta cell phone detonator, so you can disable them is some jerk of a rigger should take contorl of them. Give 'em some dumpshock to boot!
Get a big doss. Some place without a lot of entrances, but a lot of space. My personal fave is abandoned factories in the barrens. usually have a few entrances in the same places. Then set traps. With monowire. And ultraviolet trip beams. And more monowire. And for the love of god don't forget where the monowire is (windows would be good).
Get a pet. Like a hell hound. Raise it if you have to (MTC sells 'em through Parashield). Once you get one and train it, get two more. Barghest's work good too, although nothing is more intimidating than a cerebrus hound (although the corrosive saliva is hell on your carpets).
Pay people. Pay street people. Pay store owners near you. Pay the mob. Pay them some more. Then tip everyone. It's expensive, but they'll be more likely to watch your back or give you some warning if they're forced to sell you out. Why go for one payout from a tough guy, when your buddy down the street Mr. Tough is asking about keeps paying you.
Get to know some other runners. Get to know your fixer well. If you get the cash for it, hire some runners for something, to get into the practice of it. Then put a team on retainer to save your bacon incase you should need it. Pay them well (assuming you can afford to). Just consider it part of you saving-your-life-style.
Get the symbolic linking metamagic, then get good at some form of art. Then make a symbolic link foci of anyone that might threaten you. Then make another one.
Get to know some other street mages, or even better, runner mages. Found a magical initiatory group, then make sure that you include the fraternity and secrecy strictures. That way no one else will know that you're all working together. Plus they can't attack you, and have to help save your butt due to the fraternity. it wll take some work, but will be worth it in the long run. Especially if oyu can make your over-sized doss their group headquarters, so that they all contribute to it's/your security. Worried still about whether or not you can trust them? Well that's what symbolic linnking is for silly!
Assense everyone and everything. And once you've done that, do it again.
Teach you ally spirit detect enemies, armor, health, and give it sorcery (for spell defense). Also teach it to use a sniper rifle, then give it one. Easy way to cover your back. Heck, if your GM will let you, make two ally spirits, then give one a form as a rifle.
If you're feeling a bit ruthless, make a weak (Force1-3) ally, then let it go free (this can be dangerous) then bind it as a free spirit. Then feed it karma to make it more powerful. That wealth power could sure help you pay for some other things too.
My gargoyle shaman has done just about all of the above, and some other things that I can't tell you, becuase I don't trust you.
Finally, don't do any of the things I just told you to do. You can't trust me. I'm leading you astray, and trying to distract you from the real enemy. The Drop-bear-IE-Fraggle-Oompa-Loompa World Domination Cabal (DBIEFOLWDC - DIEFOCers for short). Don't believe me? You shouldn't. So do everything I tell you. You can trust me.
Fortune
Oct 16 2005, 02:22 PM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
Plus, with wards in your bolt hole ... |
I
always Ward my bolthole!
caramel frappucino
Oct 16 2005, 03:45 PM
QUOTE (hyzmarca) |
When is a Decker integral to a run, really? Paydata? Just blow a bunch of crap up, break into the networking closet, and rip the nonvolitile memory right out of the Host. If you can't do that then just take the whole thing with you. |
Anything computer-based that can't be done through the Matrix and requires more skill than any other member of the team has. Although I'm speaking, of course, of pure deckers only, and not deckers who can fulfill other roles.
In this case, whether or not your mage in decker disguise is actually integral to the run is immaterial - if the security team thinks he is, it all amounts to the same thing.
caramel frappucino
Oct 16 2005, 04:00 PM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
Get a big doss. Some place without a lot of entrances, but a lot of space. My personal fave is abandoned factories in the barrens. usually have a few entrances in the same places. Then set traps. With monowire. And ultraviolet trip beams. And more monowire. And for the love of god don't forget where the monowire is (windows would be good). |
Do you have something against bums?
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 19 2005, 03:42 AM
yes. I usually set my hell hounds against the bums. Why do you ask?
QUOTE |
n this case, whether or not your mage in decker disguise is actually integral to the run is immaterial - if the security team thinks he is, it all amounts to the same thing. |
Remeber that in a fire fight, the sec team is trying to "ruin your run". They're trying to "kill you". And the geek with a computer in his hands is less a threat then the guy with a ball of fire generally. They can alwasy shoot the computer geek after the guy with the ball of fire and the guy with the LMG are bleeding on the floor. Then your runs is still ruined.
caramel frappucino
Oct 19 2005, 03:58 AM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
And the geek with a computer in his hands is less a threat then the guy with a ball of fire generally. |
Which is precisely why you, as a security team, should execute him first. He's the easiest target to wax, and if you pull it off, you might not have to contend with the rest of the team for much longer.
brohopcp
Oct 19 2005, 04:52 AM
QUOTE (caramel frappucino) |
Which is precisely why you, as a security team, should execute him first. He's the easiest target to wax, and if you pull it off, you might not have to contend with the rest of the team for much longer. |
or... piss the troll (who just had F6 armor cast onto him) into bull-rushing your position with a 10 ft. pickaxe.
caramel frappucino
Oct 19 2005, 04:58 AM
Right on! Then you can introduce his face to a full-auto burst from your high velocity assault rifle.
FlakJacket
Oct 19 2005, 03:30 PM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
Yes. I usually set my hell hounds against the bums. Why do you ask? |
*Adds fistandantilus to the List of people to go up against the wall when his hobo army takes over.*
You seriously don't want to get on the wrong side of them. I mean, who's got a better reason to hang around on the streets or wander around the neighbourhood without looking suspicious? A small amount of cash spread around every so often gives you a very good early warning net or barometer of what things are like on the streets.
nick012000
Oct 20 2005, 12:02 AM
My street sam owns a nuclear fallout bunker in the Redmond Barrens. Its reinforced metal door at the surface is at the end of an alleyway that is filled with gravel, other than a winding trail of pavestones. The gravel is mined. There are two smart sentry guns mounted on either side of the door. If anyone other than me walks down the alleyway when I'm not home (and when I am home, and I'm not expecting visitors), the sentry guns open fire, and monowire thats strung from one wall to the other get pulled taut. The bones and rotting corpses of the assorted bums who thought that this was a good place to camp out attest to the lethality, and serve as a better warning sign than any sign ever could.
The stairway down to the bunker is loaded with smart sentry guns. Two can see every point on it.
The bunker itself has a Force 4 Background Count thanks to a former owner who was your stereotypical evil-mage-torturing-people-then-sacrificing-them-for-power.
He sleeps in a bed that has folding armor plates, so it resembles a box when deployed. It also has a smart sentry gun and an air filter.
Ah... luxury security...
ShadowDragon8685
Oct 20 2005, 01:08 AM
Wow. Paranoid much?
FlakJacket
Oct 20 2005, 02:03 AM
QUOTE (nick012000) |
Ah... luxury security... |
Riiight. I think you play in a much more...
extreme, high powered setting than in many of my games. Half the characters I know would probably consider hitting this place on general principle- mainly to grab the sentry guns and stuff as salvage to sell on.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 20 2005, 03:33 AM
QUOTE (FlakJacket @ Oct 19 2005, 10:30 AM) |
You seriously don't want to get on the wrong side of them. I mean, who's got a better reason to hang around on the streets or wander around the neighbourhood without looking suspicious? A small amount of cash spread around every so often gives you a very good early warning net or barometer of what things are like on the streets. |
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
Pay people. Pay street people. Pay store owners near you. Pay the mob. Pay them some more. Then tip everyone. It's expensive, but they'll be more likely to watch your back or give you some warning if they're forced to sell you out. Why go for one payout from a tough guy, when your buddy down the street Mr. Tough is asking about keeps paying you. |
besides, there's always the loyal army of Drop Bears on hand.
Perhaps I should have clarified that when I 'run my dogs' I do it in a different neighborhood. Which, not suprisingly, is the territory of the Yak clan that is against the Yak clan I pay protection to in my area.
I also have a doss with the 'haunted' flaw, as well as the flaw that attracts malevolent spirits. And have quickened a Forboding spell to the building (well, it's a big building, so a few spells, as well as pumped up the background count with the virtuoso metamagic , making stone gargoyle sculptures. So the place is a big nasty spot on the astral. Luckily, Virtuoso aspects it to the caster, or in this case the group, since we've also used the geomancy metamagic on the area. That along with home ground edge, really makes it so that my shaman doesn't really like to leave the comfort/over-board security of his doss. He's walked out more than once to a sniper waiting for him. That's why you always have an ally spirit and a GF City spirit scout for you first.
Tziluthi
Oct 20 2005, 11:09 AM
QUOTE (caramel frappucino @ Oct 19 2005, 11:58 AM) |
Which is precisely why you, as a security team, should execute him first. He's the easiest target to wax, and if you pull it off, you might not have to contend with the rest of the team for much longer. |
If I were in a fire fight and I had two targets in front of me, one, a geeky, otherwise non-threatening techie with a pistol, and the other, a chromed, border-line psychotic toting a heavily-modified assault rifle, all things being equal, I would fire at the latter. I'd say that sec- and police-teams are more interested in neutralising the greater threats than scoring easy kills. Just my opinion. But I can see what you're saying.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 20 2005, 11:21 AM
thank you. I don't see any logic in why you 'wouldn't have to contend with the team any longer'.
Again, the sec team isn't trying to "ruin your run" . They are trying to "kill you before you kill them ", hence why they would shoot at a more dangerous target. If you were in a fire fight your self, would you shoot at the guy wearing glasses with the .22 shotting wildly form behind a desk (a bit extreme, but you get the idea), or the Goldberg (as in the 'wrestler') - look - alike with the AK-47?
One is obviously a bigger threat to your continued ability to suck air into your lungs. I think in this case, you'd be 'metagaming', making the secuirty gaurds think "If I do this, maybe I'm ruining their chance to get a paycheck and they'll just leave" as opposed to something more like "Oh @#$@ I don't wanna die tonight! Watch it Jim! Oh @#$#@! Get those @#%@#%@#$ @#%@#% @# @!"
besides, back to metagaming, if you were in a shoot out with a bunch of corp guards on a run, and htey killed your decker, who was essentail to your run, would you
a) cut and run then and there
or
b) trust that once you turn your back, the guards are pretty likely to
1a) put more lead in to it
1b) chase you, and put more lead into your back
1c) call for back up, then give chase, taking pot shots form a distance.
Critias
Oct 20 2005, 11:34 AM
QUOTE (Slump) |
Just because you're a mage doesn't mean you don't need an assault rifle. Looking dangerous is often as effective as being dangerous, plus you don't really need much skill for supressive fire. |
You, uhh, you do know Suppressive Fire isn't really all that scary, right? Without an adept who's remarkably enhanced his assault rifles score, or an actual heavy weapon, suppressive fire's not all that scary ("Oh no, I have to soak 7M if he gets really lucky!").
Fix-it
Oct 20 2005, 01:46 PM
QUOTE (Critias) |
QUOTE (Slump @ Oct 15 2005, 02:35 AM) | Just because you're a mage doesn't mean you don't need an assault rifle. Looking dangerous is often as effective as being dangerous, plus you don't really need much skill for supressive fire. |
You, uhh, you do know Suppressive Fire isn't really all that scary, right? Without an adept who's remarkably enhanced his assault rifles score, or an actual heavy weapon, suppressive fire's not all that scary ("Oh no, I have to soak 7M if he gets really lucky!").
|
that would be because suppressive fire is meant to keep their heads down until your chummer with the automatic shotgun puts a few slugs through the armor.
Critias
Oct 20 2005, 01:58 PM
Right. I know what it's supposed to do. I'm just pointing out that a mage lugging around an assault rifle 'cause he thinks he's gonna assault rifle things to death (all by himself, without a skill because suppressive fire is so dangerous!) is just gonna get his ass kicked.
Sicarius
Oct 20 2005, 02:01 PM
QUOTE (Critias @ Oct 20 2005, 06:34 AM) |
You, uhh, you do know Suppressive Fire isn't really all that scary, right? Without an adept who's remarkably enhanced his assault rifles score, or an actual heavy weapon, suppressive fire's not all that scary ("Oh no, I have to soak 7M if he gets really lucky!"). |
Also, who (NPC,PC or RL) is thinking oh no a Strength M hit? They are thinking.. "Even if it doesn't kill me, its going to hurt like hell." Now if its 'get up and go and risk getting shot versus sitting still and definetely dying,' people will risk it, but i don't mind going on record and saying I personally would be afraid of suppressive fire.
edit: I can see this was covered... NM
caramel frappucino
Oct 20 2005, 09:11 PM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
thank you. I don't see any logic in why you 'wouldn't have to contend with the team any longer'.
Again, the sec team isn't trying to "ruin your run" . |
Yes, they are. That's their job.
I'm taking the liberty of assuming that you consistently deal with security people that can see more than one move down the board; if this isn't the case, then you're right, my argument holds no water.
QUOTE |
besides, back to metagaming, if you were in a shoot out with a bunch of corp guards on a run, and htey killed your decker, who was essentail to your run, would you a) cut and run then and there or b) trust that once you turn your back, the guards are pretty likely to 1a) put more lead in to it 1b) chase you, and put more lead into your back 1c) call for back up, then give chase, taking pot shots form a distance. |
A while taking B into consideration. They aren't mutually exclusive. While I may not just drop my guns and run, my main objective would've changed from eliminating the opposition to finding an opportunity to escape. If I'm more skilled a fighter than Bob Security Guard, forcing that shift in objective is the only thing Bob needs to do to drastically increase his chances of seeing another day.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 03:20 AM
My point is that anyone with a bit of sense if going to go for the target that is actually threatening their life, not their paycheck. If you can drop one guy and
possibly ruin their objective, swell, but that doesn't mean that the extra few seconds that takes will make any difference at all when the samurai with the assault rifle shoots you because you were shooting the decker. Bear in mind that just because there is a decker present does not mean that the mission objective is contingent upon his continued survival any more than a mage or rigger being present. It's possible yes, but certainly not guaranteed. Especially in 4th edition.
Perhaps we should just agree to disagree. We just have different points of view it seems.
toturi
Oct 21 2005, 04:38 AM
What are the odds of the better fighter saying,"Frag it!" and kill the sec guard for killing his paycheck? What are the odds of Bob surviving the change of objective? If I am not going to be paid by my employer, then all semblance of discretion goes out of the window and NOW I want to kill as many guards(given that I have already kill some guards) as possible and collect their guns/armor/cyberware/cold dead bodies for salvage. Shooting the decker will earn Bob a burial without a body, even if I am talking in SR3 terms.
caramel frappuccino
Oct 21 2005, 04:45 AM
Yeah, well, I'm assuming that your runners have some semblance of professionalism.
Which may not be true.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 05:03 AM
you know what they say about assumptions....
Besides, there's a difference between professionalism and just not caring. Say thet were a long standing team for example. Good frineds, compadres, amigos and all that. You think Scary George the Troll Sammy isn't going to get upset that his 'little buddy' Lenny the Decker just got cacked by Eagle Security? yeah, the run might be fragged, bu that doens't mean hes just going to walk away. There's a difference between 'professional' and 'cold hearted to the core'.
toturi
Oct 21 2005, 05:11 AM
Professionalism simply boils down to "I wanna get paid". If my Johnson isn't going to pay me, maybe someone will pay me good money for Bob's body. Assuming that you are assuming that the runners have some semblance of professionalism.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 05:22 AM
What was this thread about again.....
I assume someone knows....
caramel frappuccino
Oct 21 2005, 05:27 AM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
you know what they say about assumptions....
Besides, there's a difference between professionalism and just not caring. Say thet were a long standing team for example. Good frineds, compadres, amigos and all that. You think Scary George the Troll Sammy isn't going to get upset that his 'little buddy' Lenny the Decker just got cacked by Eagle Security? yeah, the run might be fragged, bu that doens't mean hes just going to walk away. There's a difference between 'professional' and 'cold hearted to the core'. |
Despite how much the sourcebooks seem to disagree with me, I still maintain that shadowrunners as a whole are generally not buddy-buddy with their teammates.
Player groups are frequently an exception to this rule, but most criminals tend not to have the necessary traits nor the incentive to forge lasting bonds with others of their kind.
QUOTE (toturi) |
Professionalism simply boils down to "I wanna get paid". If my Johnson isn't going to pay me, maybe someone will pay me good money for Bob's body. Assuming that you are assuming that the runners have some semblance of professionalism. |
That's not true at all. Professionalism is a thousand different things, one of which is taking the most cost-effective course of action under a given set of circumstances. Putting your life on the line for longer than you have to just so you can jack Bob's armor vest is generally not the smartest thing to do.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 05:30 AM
but his cyber arm, which you can hock for 20k, or his cyber deck....
caramel frappuccino
Oct 21 2005, 05:36 AM
The more expensive Bob's combat equipment is, the greater the risk you need to take to attempt to relieve him of it.
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 05:39 AM
not true. The best thing to try and snag would be his deck, which is likely on a shoulder sling. Unless of course, it's a cranial deck. In which case, bring a monowhip.
Weren't we talking about mages somewhere?
caramel frappuccino
Oct 21 2005, 05:39 AM
Why the hell would a security guard be carrying a deck with him?
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 06:11 AM
said target decker, not the security guard.
oh hell, never mind
caramel frappuccino
Oct 21 2005, 06:25 AM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
said target decker, not the security guard.
oh hell, never mind |
Lies! Lenny is the decker, Bob is the security guard. Get it straight, dammit!
Siege
Oct 21 2005, 08:05 AM
Well, not to mention that leaving a body behind gives any investigative agency a place to start looking.
Known associates of "Bob the Decker" include...
-Siege
fistandantilus4.0
Oct 21 2005, 08:13 AM
Ted the rigger, Harry the mage, Dick the .. .well he isn't very nice