Full Version: Cut Off in Chase Combat
Lets say my runners are in their GMC Bulldog and chased by a couple of gangers on scorpions. Lets also say that I rule as the GM that the bikes are not able to try a cut off stunt on the van (size differences etc.). But what if the van tries to cut off one of the bikes? The bikes have a better handling so they have a fair chance of surviving, I'm okay with that. But if they win the opposed vehicle test the van has to make a crash test. Hmm. I don't think that is a bit too much... Maybe I give the van a bit of bonus in the opposed vehicle test? Any suggestions?
Hmm, strange that there's nothing specifically mentioned in the rules about cutting off a "larger" vehicle. I have a feeling it'd be possible, just a lot more difficult. Here's an idea:
For the "Cut Off" test (and perhaps some similar tests), determine which vehicle has more Body. Then divide the larger Body by the smaller Body (round up). That vehicle (with the larger body) gets that many bonus dice to its Vehicle Test to avoid being cut off and the second Vehicle test (if it fails) to avoid crashing. These bonus dice represent the bulkiness of the vehicle, unwilling to yield to a smaller mass.
Example: For the Scorpion (body 8) vs the Bulldog (body 16), the Bulldog would get a bonus of 2 dice (16/8=2) to avoid being cut off by the Scorpion, or a bonus of 2 dice to actually cut off the Scorpion (and a bonus of 2 dice to avoid crashing after being cut off by the Scorpion).
If the bikes were less beefy Suzuki Mirages, the Bulldog would get 3 dice (16/6=2.6, round up to 3). If Dodge Scoots (wahaha!) tried to cut you off, the Bulldog would get a total of 4 bonus dice (16/4=4) to avoid being cut off and crashing.
For the "Cut Off" test (and perhaps some similar tests), determine which vehicle has more Body. Then divide the larger Body by the smaller Body (round up). That vehicle (with the larger body) gets that many bonus dice to its Vehicle Test to avoid being cut off and the second Vehicle test (if it fails) to avoid crashing. These bonus dice represent the bulkiness of the vehicle, unwilling to yield to a smaller mass.
Example: For the Scorpion (body 8) vs the Bulldog (body 16), the Bulldog would get a bonus of 2 dice (16/8=2) to avoid being cut off by the Scorpion, or a bonus of 2 dice to actually cut off the Scorpion (and a bonus of 2 dice to avoid crashing after being cut off by the Scorpion).
If the bikes were less beefy Suzuki Mirages, the Bulldog would get 3 dice (16/6=2.6, round up to 3). If Dodge Scoots (wahaha!) tried to cut you off, the Bulldog would get a total of 4 bonus dice (16/4=4) to avoid being cut off and crashing.
| QUOTE (prionic6 @ Oct 22 2005, 02:14 PM) |
| Lets say my runners are in their GMC Bulldog and chased by a couple of gangers on scorpions. Lets also say that I rule as the GM that the bikes are not able to try a cut off stunt on the van (size differences etc.). But what if the van tries to cut off one of the bikes? The bikes have a better handling so they have a fair chance of surviving, I'm okay with that. But if they win the opposed vehicle test the van has to make a crash test. Hmm. I don't think that is a bit too much... Maybe I give the van a bit of bonus in the opposed vehicle test? Any suggestions? |
Personally i'd just let the rule play as is and say that the bike's rider was able to fake-out the van, drawing the van into a situation where it might get itself wrecked up on surroundings.
P.S. If driven by a hardcore rigger the GMC Bulldog would often close or surpass the handling gap with the Scorpion since without the extra gyro equipment as per Rigger 3 i wouldn't let the motorcycle rider use VR.
thats the age old question realy. why cant the very invasive vcr work as a kind of basic skillwire so that when riding a bike as a rigger it controls the body.
yes, your consious mind is cutt of from controling the body unless you realy focus. but as we all know, even is sleep your body moves.
i will only require a bike to have a gyro if its going to be controled like a drone.
yes, your consious mind is cutt of from controling the body unless you realy focus. but as we all know, even is sleep your body moves.
i will only require a bike to have a gyro if its going to be controled like a drone.
Not to be rude, but...
... uh?
... uh?
| QUOTE (hobgoblin) |
| yes, your consious mind is cutt of from controling the body unless you realy focus. but as we all know, even is sleep your body moves. |
SR4 is changed in that manner from SR3. It specifically states that you can alter the sim module to disable the skeletal muscle safety override. It doesn't give exact rules for what happens, it just gives the impression that it is a bad thing because you body will generally act as though you are in the Matrix, not the meat world. Also you'd have to concentrate to switch your focus from VR to get any feedback from your limb's nerves, and even then a penalty to that.
still, if one can override one can allso insert controls. so one can allways argue that when rigging a bike there is a special mode the systems goes into that allows for balancing using body movements without the user is aware of him doing so. ie, it works as a filter, not a are simple cutoff switch. and it realy should be a filter as cutting all neural traffic from brain to muscles will basicly stop a persons heart...
| QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Oct 23 2005, 01:06 PM) |
| still, if one can override one can allso insert controls. so one can allways argue that when rigging a bike there is a special mode the systems goes into that allows for balancing using body movements without the user is aware of him doing so. ie, it works as a filter, not a are simple cutoff switch. and it realy should be a filter as cutting all neural traffic from brain to muscles will basicly stop a persons heart... |
However being in that mode isn't going to help you much because you'll be taking penalties since you don't get feedback directly from your limbs without forcing yourself out of VR.
The only way to even remotely know what your body was actually doing would be a sensor mesh on the rider to that you'd have to feedback through. That would still be inferior to the body's nervous system unless it was invasive into the body (you do feel inside your body what you are doing). But to be helpful that feedback would squeeze out a lot of the vehicle VR aspects.
Not only that, but should you really be getting the IPs of VR since you are relying on your body's nerveous system again?
Nope, all in all i'd say best you could hope to get out of it is basically what you'd get in AR. You sure as hell wouldn't want to flip over and try to do some other Matrix actions lest you let go of the handlebars or fall off the bike.
you got a point about reaction speed.
still, if the body basicly goes totaly soft the moment you jack in. whats stopping you from falling of the bike the moment you enter a curve?
basicly rigging a bike can be a very messy subject given how little data we realy have on how the rig is supposed to work.
thing is that we have a perfectly good working balance sensor inside our head. use it properly and a gyroscope is redundant.
thing is that your not trying to balance your body independently of the bike. your trying to balance the whole thing thru the rig and the rig is what talks to the body about shifting the weight around. it may even be doing so without your input on a regular basis.
the other option is that now the gyro mod from rigger3 is a default option inside any bike given that most vehicles seems to have self guidance ability all the way from the factory. or do the bikes not have pilot? i dont have the book so i cant check.
still, if the body basicly goes totaly soft the moment you jack in. whats stopping you from falling of the bike the moment you enter a curve?
basicly rigging a bike can be a very messy subject given how little data we realy have on how the rig is supposed to work.
thing is that we have a perfectly good working balance sensor inside our head. use it properly and a gyroscope is redundant.
thing is that your not trying to balance your body independently of the bike. your trying to balance the whole thing thru the rig and the rig is what talks to the body about shifting the weight around. it may even be doing so without your input on a regular basis.
the other option is that now the gyro mod from rigger3 is a default option inside any bike given that most vehicles seems to have self guidance ability all the way from the factory. or do the bikes not have pilot? i dont have the book so i cant check.
I don't think he's talking about getting feedback, at least conciously. I interpret his suggestion as staying in full VR, completely unaware of your body except maybe as a weight on your (the bike's back). Thus, you would retain full VR init. Part of the Control Rig would be dedicated to directing your muscles in such a way that you stay on the bike, lean into the turns, etc. This way you could do full VR on the bike and not slide off like a sack of potatoes.
I don't think the Control Rig is really set up for that kind of body control, however. You'd almost need a skillwires system and a specialized autsoft to "rig" your body while you become the bike. I wouldn't be opposed to it, given that a bike nut is basically buying a minimum rating skillwires + custom autosoft just to be able to rig their bike.
I don't think the Control Rig is really set up for that kind of body control, however. You'd almost need a skillwires system and a specialized autsoft to "rig" your body while you become the bike. I wouldn't be opposed to it, given that a bike nut is basically buying a minimum rating skillwires + custom autosoft just to be able to rig their bike.
| QUOTE (hobgoblin) |
| the other option is that now the gyro mod from rigger3 is a default option inside any bike given that most vehicles seems to have self guidance ability all the way from the factory. or do the bikes not have pilot? i dont have the book so i cant check. |
Yeah, all vehicles appear to come with a Pilot - which would indicate they're all capable of some degree of autonomy (and self-stabilization for bikes and flying vehicles). Or, if nothing else, it's likely the rigger adaptation box for motorcycles would either come with the gyro-stabilizer and/or part of the interface system includes software that allows the installed gyros to compensate for the extra weight of the driver.
Staying on the bike while in VR trance is a bit trickier. Though I imagine the rig would be capable of locking the muscles in a set position as easily as a standard RAS cutout would make someone go slack. It's likely it'd have to be designed to do so since, unlike Matrix VR, rigging VR actually requires the ability to send and read muscle impulses - something that it probably couldn't do if it were the standard "cut the strings" mode.
Though I suppose one could always go with "it just works, ok?" Over-analyzing the hows and whys behind a game mechanic generally leads nowhere. Why can checkers only move diagonally? That's just how the game works.
| QUOTE (TonkaTuff) |
| Though I suppose one could always go with "it just works, ok?" Over-analyzing the hows and whys behind a game mechanic generally leads nowhere. Why can checkers only move diagonally? That's just how the game works. |
those are words of wisdom if i have ever seen some
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.