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It seems to me that starting Technomancers have a bit of an issue with being a bit lower on the scale than starting Hackers, who can upgrade all their stuff, don't have to spend karma for programs and various other nifty advangtages, such as not worrying about essence.
For one thing, why not get wired 2 and deck in AR. Only thing you lose is 2 dice for Hot sim, and a point of initiative. In exchange, you never have to worry about anything other than being crashed, and it is an easier matter to disconnect, and not be lying around limp.
They are also not as limited in how many programs they can have.

However, there is nothing stopping a technomancer from getting a nice commlink, and even having a sprite use it for him for extra assistance when needed.
Technomancers get a bonus to perception tests in the matrix, and eventually get all sorts of scary good.

What are the downsides?

How do technomancers really compare to Hackers, in game. They both seem to have some edges, not sure which one wins out.
From what I've seen, Hackers make better hackers. Hands down. The amount of Karma required for a Technomancer to get even nearly as good as a starting Hacker in Matrix Fu is astonishing.

Technomancers however, seem to make better Riggers. It's relatively light on required programs (which means that it fits inside your very small amount of allowed Complex Forms), and it plays to Technomancer's strengths of being able to get a lynch mob of Sprites and Overclock themselves to 4 IPs while jacked in.

Your observation with Hackers and wired reflexes is spot on (even though VR reduces the time interval for some matrix actions). Hacking is relatively cheap in terms of build points, so most Hackers should also be able to do something else. As such, most Hackers are going to be halfway decent street sams or Adepts in addition to their Hacking powers. Technomancy is not, and you're lucky if your Technomancer is much more than a spunky teenage girl aside from her technomanctic powers.

Hackers cap with their equipment at rating 6. Technomancers can after time/karma and submersion can easily surpass this cap. Threading allows a techno off the bat do everything a hacker can, at a price (eg. fading and concentration modifiers).
But on the other hand hackers are harder to physically hurt and have 0.1 essense with out it effecting their ability to hack. Where as Technos feel every little code attack.
Sprites are cool but Agents have their uses as well, for starters they are more flexible with program loading against the sprite set CFs and powers.
If the Technomancer grabs a Commlink and starts 'hacking' whats the point in being a Technomancer.
I think in the end the choice between a Hacker and Technomancer is the flavour of the character you are going for, just like choosing between a Street Sam or Physical Adept.
Hm. I also noticed they can thread their forms above what they have them learned at.

They can actually be pretty decent at combat, I suppose.

Register a sprite to aid armor, adding its rating to your complex form, while you thread your attack form to boost it up by 3-4 points not limited to 6. Pretty tricksy to get by, especially when another one can boost your stealth.
They would be pretty much forced to target your sprites, as you pounded them.
Technomancers are so poorly explained in the rules, I assume there will be things they cannot do that hackers can and the other way around. I simply donīt buy the "organic commlink" thing. I think itīs a simplification.

I have a feeling they do not leave datatrails and are not vounerable to tracking by non-technomancers for example. Mostly because they do leave a resonance signature that other technomancers and sprites can follow, and because that kind of distinction would be mysterious and dangerous in a way that fits the concept. I think their powers, and sprites are really as beyond regular hackerīs reach as spirits and spells are for mundanes.
They can thread form their do not know, but there are limits, the total threaded form above their resonance gives physical fading and to maintain that CF gives a -2 modifier to all other actions.

But with some planning a Technomancer could storm through a target node biggrin.gif

I simply donīt buy the "organic commlink" thing. I think itīs a simplification.

I agree, I think its a way to 'explain' the technomancer without adding their own chapter.
Ooh! I like that! I want to not leave a data trail....

I wonder if my GM will go for it?

It may be overpowered. But consider the amount of points they pay for their abilities. Then compair to magicans, and how their activities are totally untracable and unaccessable to mundanes. If it gets to be too much of an advantage, I will throw in another techno for the oposition. Bottom line is the techno player needs to feel there is something that truly separates him from other hacker characters.
I think I would slice it this way. It adds to the mystery but does not make it so ridiculous that it is unbeatable by any non techno, it just takes some luck and a lot of effort. Which I think makes a good story, a LS hacker trying desperately to put together the clues to find the rogue technomancer that has been doing X to their systems.

I would say that you can see what a technomancer has changed, and under the log where you would normally find the datatrail, it instead says something like ACCESS ID INVALID.

For instance, the log might say something like
12:01:03 PM 12/27/2073 - Account accessed - ACCESS ID INVALID
12:01:04 PM 12/27/2073 - Edit - Erase Criminal SIN 4556798400487655 - ACCESS ID INVALID.

The LS hacker would then go search all the connecting nodes, just like the groundpounders have to do their legwork, seeking other logs with INVALID ACCESS ID problems.

He may or may not be able to eventually get close enough to figure out who the technomancer is, or may be able to develop a pattern based on what he is doing and when. It would be very much like any other cop on a serial homicide or repeat grand theft auto cases.

Of course, the techno can erase their signature, and can also erase the logs, which is what hackers can do either way. It just gives them an extra layer of protection and makes them harder to trace without even having to spoof the datatrail.
Rotbart van Dainig
Without an Access ID, there is no communication.

But, spoofing one isn't that hard, so any hacker and technomancer worth his salt will do so on a regular basis.
I didn't say no Access ID. I said ACCESS ID INVALID.

You could say something like this instead.
Normal use - 460424604304561648604
Normal Use - 456047894564560730407
Normal Use - 145604778045608946043
Technomancer - sdfajf;[U]pxsur83902hjdxhdfsayr803j f

Say what?
Rotbart van Dainig
It would be rejected by any device... thus being similar to none.

Additionally, breaking standards only makes you suspicious - the clever intruder always looks like he's perfectly normal.
QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
It would be rejected by any device... thus being similar to none.

Additionally, breaking standards only makes you suspicious - the clever intruder always looks like he's perfectly normal.

I don't think that would be an invalid example. Technomancers are the ghost in the machine so the system would just accept the garbled ID code as an actual ID code, albeit without proper access, and allow its use.

Technomancers are slightly underpowered compared to hackers at first because the technomancer can ONLY hack whereas the hacker can do much more (ie street sam or techno/social adept). However, a starting technomancer can make up for that with sprites. Sprites make them absolutely sick in the wireless world and with imagination can make them or the rest of the party sick in the physical world. You should see what a sam with two cyberlegs that have a rating 6 machine sprite with maneuver and defense in them can do.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (Cheops)
Technomancers are the ghost in the machine so the system would just accept the garbled ID code as an actual ID code, albeit without proper access, and allow its use.

An Access ID is the equivalent of an MAC address: Wrong format, no talking.

It's not about the Technomancer not being able to generate one, or even accept one - most hackers could do that... but the rest of the world would discard the garbage.
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