Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: first aid and drain?
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
ruvidan
can first aid be used against drain? Also, can a mystic adept assist another mage with counter spelling if all of their magic points were allotted to adept abilities? What I mean is, let's say i have a mystic adept with 5 points, all in adept abilities. I can still take skills, like counter spelling and dispelling, right or do I need to put at least 1 point in the spell side of things?
jervinator
1) No, unless you overcast and tkae physical damae from the drain.
2) No.
Rooks
for the drain depends if its physical or stun, stun no can't heal stun damage save resting physical depends on how the wounds are manifested if theirs lacerations and open wounds on the surface then I can't see why not if its internal like a nosebleed then I would rule you can't but a heal spell might work
TinkerGnome
... Have either of you read the first aid section of the SR4 book?

Yes, you can patch up stun and physical drain with first aid.
Thanee
LOL, yeah, First Aid can reduce both Physical and Stun Drain to a degree (same as normal damage, Drain is no different there).

Bye
Thanee
mdynna
I'm thinking of house-ruling that Drain is not "first aid-able". I understand where they're coming from with the rule. If you're in a fist fight (or have good armour) then you would have bruises and such that could be treated with first aid. However, I don't see how First Aid can help the mental exertion/exhaustion that is taken from casting spells. I see how Stims help that, but Stims have they're own downside.

I might have to differentiate between "physical" stun and "pure mental" stun damage.
hyzmarca
This depends on how one interperates drain. Personally, I don't believe that drain is a form of mental exertion any more than being struck by lightening is. Mental exertion gives dice pool penalities. Drain causes actual damage. I see unresisted drain as being akin to stigmata. The magician can't fully control the mana being channeled through him so the excess causes apparently spontaneous wounds which can range anywhere from a migrane headache to a deadly aneurysm to classic bleeding from the hands to a giant fountain of blood spurting from the nether regions.
TinkerGnome
The only change I make is that drain can't be healed with magic. If you don't make that change, then it's actually to a mage's advantage to overcast as much as possible when in a relatively safe environment.

The thing about first aid is that it doesn't help you a whole lot (though it does help). Most tests to fix drain are made at -3 (average conditions, awakened subject) leaving most people with about 9 dice (rating 6 medkit + stat/skill of 6). That, on average, heals one box of drain. A dedicated medic can roll 12 or more dice after modifiers, healing... two boxes of drain.

Not really as broken as it sounds on the surface.
Jaid
medkits add dice to a trained user.

thus, a dedicated medic could be throwing up to 18 dice quite easily (6 logic + 6 skill + 6 attribute). assuming they have, say, logic-enhancing bioware (up to +2) or increase logic in a sustaining focus (which isn't quite so likely as i believe it requires a force 6 focus), they could go even higher.

assuming they are adepts who specialise in medical skills, again it goes even higher.

i would say a 'dedicated medic' character could quite easily be throwing 5 dice from logic, 4-5 dice from skill, and 6 dice from the medkit though... so figure 15-16 dice at least. still not all that amazing, but hey it's not bad either. if you should happen to have the fast healer quality, that adds another 2 dice as well.
hyzmarca
Logic 6 (9) + First Aid (drain) 6 (9) (+2) + Medkit 6. A dedicated human medic should be rolling 26 dice before edge, 28 with exceptional logic and first aid aptitude. The maximum possible is 36 exploding.
TinkerGnome
Well, the best possible is obviously 29 31 dice (10 stat, 10 skill, 6 kit, 3 assitants [edit]2 spec[/edit]). However, you're rarely going to see that. Even the more common case of 15 dice isn't that overpowering when you consider that a) healing is limited by skill and b) you're almost always at -3 dice (-2 for an awakened patient, -1 for conditions) or worse.

So your common situation is going to average 2 boxes of reduction in the damage. A lot better with edge (theoretically up to 39 dice), but that's edge. Probably a bit less if you're going to be self-applying on significant damage.
Thanee
QUOTE (TinkerGnome)
A lot better with edge (theoretically up to 39 dice), ...

With 31 dice initially and average rolls, you would have 52 dice total. wink.gif

Bye
Thanee
tisoz
There is that threshold 2, too.
TinkerGnome
Keep in mind that few people would ever feel the need to stretch the bounds of reality with a medic character and NPCs shouldn't have the ability. That kind of dice pool might be claimed by one person on the planet.

PCs will stretch most aspects of combat, magic, and hacking... but first aid just isn't worth it in the end because it's not something you can rely on being able to perform.
BlackHat
QUOTE (TinkerGnome)
... 31 dice (10 stat, 10 skill, 6 kit, 3 assitants ...

Why only 3 from assistants? Or was this just a number you chose?

I didn't think the "teamwork" dice were capped anywhere...
TinkerGnome
QUOTE (BlackHat)
Why only 3 from assistants? Or was this just a number you chose?

I didn't think the "teamwork" dice were capped anywhere...

QUOTE (SR4@p244 @ Healing Modifiers)
Assistance      +1 per skilled assistant (max +3)
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012