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The Jopp
What is a SIN? A piece of code? A chip?

Ok, I now have a few fake SIN’s, and they have to be connected to a commlink, and it’s connected personal information…Where is it?

Is it a piece of software? If so then I should be able to upload the SIN I need in the commlink of my choice. What if I have a legal SIN and get myself a new commlink?

Could it be a long access code like a copy protection code (12B6-11FG-44FG-ZZ77) or a social security number? Let’s assume it is a digital version of the social security number.

What’s your opinion folks? I’d aim for a social security number of some kind, and here’s where it gets tricky.

Imagine you cracked a personal database, a smallish one from a minor company’s accounting database to keep track of the employees insurances and paychecks. You get a hold of 10 SINcodes and upload them to your Commlink.

Whenever some automatic system checks your SIN code it would probably first check the SIN, as long as the number checks out there should be no problem – I have a hard time believing that every drone/ID scanner would check against facial features unless a deeper scan would be required. There might be a problem if it finds two SINs at once that are identical.

Might be useful if you want to impersonate someone else while doing some shady business, like a burglary and you are wearing a helmet so they cant identify your face.
Guye Noir
A SIN is simply a string of numbers dervied from certain personal data, and each one is unique. For all intents and purposes, it is the 21st century version of an SSN.

The actual numbers that compose a SIN are generated by a complex formula from several pieces of personal data. What this means is that law enforcement officials can determine your birthdate, state or country of origin, citizenship, and initials from your SIN.

-SR4 core rulebook pg. 259

A person's commlink contains their SIN, but it doesn't always transmit it, even when in active mode. Constantly transmitting one's SIN on open unencrypted frequencies is a security and privacy risk. I'd be willing to bet every commlink has a simple "transmit SIN" function for when Lone Star or CorpSec gives you trouble, and even then, it's only transmitted at a very short distance (regardless of the commlink's signal rating), in only one direction, and is encrypted (according to RAW, personal data like SIN, bank account info, etc has a base encryption rating of 5). Of course, it can probably only transmit one at a time.

I'd have to agree with you on the facial recognition thing, no need to do it unless circumstances call for it. Same goes for making the check to see if the SIN is valid. Otherwise, cops would constantly be running background checks 70-80% of which returned nothing worth spending any time on.
A SIN is basicly a social security number on crack. While your comlink can transmit a SIN or it can be stord on a credstick, both are unnecessary. You could just remember your SIN and input it manually everywhere it is required.

What makes a SIN so darn important is that it is used as an identifier in practically every database on the planet across the world. A person who knows your SIN also knows your back account numbers, for example. What makes SINs difficult to fake is that SIN scanners will check these databases which often include things like picture ID, fingerprints, and DNA profile. The cheapest SIN checkers only go for the local or international SIN registeries but the high rating ones will check hundreds of databases.
Creating a fake SIN requires inserting false data into countless systems worldwide which is why they come at a premium. There is always a chance that someone will check a database that your hacker didn't mess with and then you're fake SIN is useless.

I wouldn't expect to be harrassed by cops for a SIN. Plenty of people are SINless because the government doesn't want to give them one. Harressing these people could only result in arresting them and giving them criminal SINs which the goverment doesn't want because then they wouldn't be SINless anymore.

The real problems with SINs come when you make a purchase. Every time you buy anything your SIN is checked. Retail terminals will have a low rating and thus would be easy to fool. They only care about getting th emoney after all. But still you never know when one will check that singe database that your buddy didn't cover.

The Jopp
Well, there is a problem here then. If someone cracks a database with personal SIN numbers they can just upload them to their commlink and use it for making basic purchases.

That’s the problem, how do they store them? Or do they just have an access code to the employees bank account? The SIN number contains everything and most corps probably have an ID scanner to see who’s allowed inside, and would most likely have their SIN identification number on file.

Crack the files and you can use other peoples SIN while running to cover your tracks.

It wouldn't even be a fake SIN..
In my fluff text I ruled the following:

SIN is NOT bank account. It is closely connected, but you can not pay with your SIN only, you need a bank account.

Transactions worth less than 20 Euros (Nuyen) can be made without any check that involves human interaction (for convenience, you dont want to enter you pass number everytime you just buy a burger at stuffer shack, when you are used to only walk up to the counter and grab the ready made burger, because you made your order 1 minute ago when you were on your way to the shack, via wifi). So if you steal some other guys bank account data and passcodes (by simply hacking his comlink, everything must be there to make it work the way I described) you can use it for 20 Euro transactions. Maybe restrict it to a sum of 100 Euros a day if you want.
For more than 20 Euros you need his PIN number (which isnt stored in the comlink if the owner has any sense of security). For more than 1000 Euros you need fingerprint. Higher sums come with voice recognition, retina scan or even DNA check.

BTW: In my world, there is a difference between a SIN check, and just a verification. To buy a 50,000 Euro car, you might need to do a retina scan at the shop, to verify whether your data and the data stored in the SIN database agrees, but this is NOT a SIN check. A SIN check probes for the integrity and consitence of certain databaes whith each other, that contain information connected to the SIN. The level of acces rights to databases the SINchecker has, and thus how deep it can probe, depends on its level.
Guye Noir
In my fluff text I ruled the following:

SIN is NOT bank account. It is closely connected, but you can not pay with your SIN only, you need a bank account.

That's how I always assumed it worked, much like in the real world. Yes, a SIN is required to create a bank account, but more than just a SIN is required to access it. Probably the account number (which is different from the SIN) and PIN, which no moderately intelligent person would actually record or store anywhere. In addition to biometrics for the real big purchases.

Crack the files and you can use other peoples SIN while running to cover your tracks.

It wouldn't even be a fake SIN...

This is different than stealing money and a whole lot easier. Once you have that SIN in your commlink, just set it as your own and start transmitting. Of course, some people may get suspicious when the same SIN starts being detected in two places at once. The cops would just arrest anyone transmitting that SIN and release the person who looks most like the picture on file.
The Jopp
Hmm, very good pointers there. But aside from purchases there are very good reasons to use some other guys SIN ID. Yea, this could probably backfire on a runner but the odds would probably be slim. If you have access to some poor fools SIN ID you could probably use it live while running and use the commlink for limited communication.

The first thing would be that Lonestar talks to the guy who owns the SIN and then they have to start tracking from there. Even better would be if you got hold of some persons SIN ID who actually works on the site that one might have to gain access to since local gates and such might be tied to SIN verification and thus opens doors for you.

Yea, it might work, but it might also backfire. Its no fun being the wiz streetsam with highly illegal gear when lonestar knocks on the door with guns drawn when having your SIN connected to a string of burglars the night before… dead.gif
hte SIN is the unique identifier that should indicate that a person listed in the bank database, the drivers licence database, the passport database and any number of other databases, is the same person.

if your familar with relational databases then its a two way relation that connects all these diffrent databases...

any numbeer of people can be named joe smith and live in seattle, but only one person have the sin 1234567890 wink.gif (that is until you start messing with the databases that is silly.gif )

the SIN can be seen as the first step towards a totalitarian system. the second step is the linking of manner of private and goverment databases so that a police officer or whatever can input the SIN and get any time and place where you used the SIN (or anything connected to the SIN), and what you used it for...
The development of a SIN also sounded like those 'geek code' things you have on the net right now. The code is personalized since its made from your own data, which in a way makes it harder to 'fake' since I think it means you have to have data that looks like it might fit you. Kinda like how those who can read the geek code can understand what all the various sections means, it also could be like your SIN.

Sorry if I'm muddling through this, I'm kinda chewing on the thought as I type. Right now, our SSN is a 9 digit number, that at face value doesn't mean anything (as far as I know). You can't just look at my SSN numbers and go "Ah Voran is a dude who was born in hawaii in 1973" kinda thing. You could USE my SSN to find out that info, but it doesn't spell it out for you up front. From what I read on SIN, they sorta do. So I imagine that's why cracking or faking a SIN is so difficult, you'd have to be able to 'fit' the ID the face value reads. So an Orc will have to use a SIN that has the 'orc' component built into it, or its going to definately raise flags, for example.
James McMurray
SSNs do contain some rudimentary info. You can tell what state they lived in when they applied for the card by the first three digits. That's about it though.
Ooh I just did a wikipedia check. Heh yeah my SSN can tell you I'm from Hawaii nyahnyah.gif Scary.
James McMurray
Even scarier, now that I know you're from Hawaii I can tell you your social security number. It'll take me a few (hundred thousand) guesses, but you narrowed the field. wink.gif
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