I thought that you could always buy power points. They cost 20 per level, or was that left out of first edition? I know that it was in second.

Before 3rd edition, you could not purchase power points; adepts had to increase their Magic rating to gain additional abilities.

My namesake character, Nightmare (a combat mage/hit man) has been played on and off since 1st edition and is "only" Grade 5 (530 karma when last played -briefly- in 3rd edition).

When 3rd edition came out, I put my players at the time on a fast track karma-wise for the express purpose of bringing their characters (a magician adept and a shaman) up to par with Nightmare so one of them could take over GMing and I could play him again. The magician adept made Grade 4 and the shaman made Grade 2 before the campaign ended - and I still only got to play Nightmare again as an NPC

*ahem*

That's only for Magician Adepts.

Shielding is good. Absorbtion does pretty much the same thing except that it is more offensive. You can drop the absorbed dice if you want to (treating it just like Shielding) or use them like an expendable power focus. If Shielding is rediculous, Absorbtion is totally ridiculous.

As for Invoking, it is pretty much a buy-one-get-one-free deal. If you have Invoking, you don't need to bother getting Divination/Cleansing. Just summon the Great form spirit, and ask it to do the Divination for you or Cleanse the crimescene while you scram.

I've always wondered where is the appeal in Centring? You get to invest karma into a performance skill of your choice which can serve no useful gaming purpose (unless it is something like playing music for a living (like you actually need a wage when you can Shadowrun)). Then you get to invest karma into your Centring skill. Then when you Centre you get to add half your successes... is it really worth it? Why not invest that karma into improving your primary skills, or get a Power focus, or something like that?

I agree that absorption is good, but it is nothing at *all* like shielding in terms of defensive capability. Let's say you're a grade six initiate:

Absorption works like spell defense in terms of the number of dice. Say you allocate 6 dice to it, and pick 6 people who you want to cover. A mage casts a spell at one of the targets, you use 4 of the dice defending. Then another mage casts a spell at another target, you use 2 of the dice defending. A mage casts a third spell, and you have no dice left.

Shielding doesn't work like spell defense. It adds a modifier to the spell resistance tests of the protected individuals until you reallocate. Say you allocate 6 dice to it, and pick six people who you want to cover. Anybody casting spells on them is now at +6 to their target numbers. Further, each of them has a spell resistance *bonus* of 6 until you reallocate your dice. A mage casts a spell at one of the targets, they get six dice defending (plus whatever the base resist stat happens to be). Then a mage casts a spell at *the same* target, and that target *still* gets six dice defending (plus...). Then a mage casts a third spell at the same target, and that target *still* gets six dice defending (plus...).

Totally, totally different beasts.

Shielding is clearly superior if you need to defend against multiple spell castings per combat turn, against area effect spells, and/or if the opposition is casting higher force spells (as increasing their target number is going to reduce successes more effectively than trying to roll the force of the spell).

Absorption is superior if you only expect a fairly small number of incoming spells per turn (1-2), with few successes, and that those spells are of reasonable force to actually hit the TN to absorb.

The only other case I can think of where it's superior is if you are in the middle of a bunch of enemies, you drop an AOE spell on your head, and use the absorption pool to absorb your own spell. Because absorption causes AOE spells to ignore *only* the protected individual, you don't get hit, everyone surrounding you does, AND you get an absorption pool for your next casting. And that there is a pretty nasty case.

(of course, with shielding, you do get a similar effect, because your TNs to hit yourself are higher, and you also get the bonus resistance dice... you just don't get the happy absorption pool bonus)

Ultimately, with absorption you get higher return, but you assume higher risk. With shielding, it's quite possible to just flat out stop any magical activity from negatively affecting your team.

Don't forget that you ideally want to be a shape shifter while you're at it. Or at least have a shape shifter in your party.

(we have one in ours, and on more than one occasion when he's recklessly endangered the team's lives, I've threatened to set up layered wards in our domicile and suddenly revoke his permission while he's sandwiched in them... for the sole purpose of holding him there while I sell him to Azzie ;p)

Yes - that is what I like doing. I wanted a spell like Flash from Diablo (a short-range high-damage ring of energy comes out from the character). I can use Powerball at ground-zero and use my Absorbing dice to boost the Powerball next turn, etc. Nice when goons think the mage is easy in melee. The only problem with Powerballing is I can't affect enemies behind me since I can't see them. (If I cut off my nose I wouldn't be able to see myself either, unless I blinked at the wrong moment.) The only other alternative is to use an elemental area spell (and then you get to add knockback and things) since that will affect targets I can't see. Only problem then is if I succeed in absorbing all the damage I would otherwise be subjected to, the spell gets womped and doesn't affect any of my enemies.

And yes you're right about the differences between Shielding being more defensive and Absorbing being more aggressive; Shielding does pay off if you come across enemies who have two mages in their ranks. Especially if, as you said, they both target the same character.

I guess this would be the case if you are applying your Centring to a large number of active skills like a Magicians Way Driving-Adept who has Sorcery and Conjuring and Enchanting, etc. Especially as Power foci can't help with Enchanting and Driving etc. On the other hand, I would be surprised if the Centring route was more karmically economic for, say, an aspected conjuror who only uses it for one skill. At what point does Centring gain the advantage?

Additionally, the skills listed in MitS p72 all seem to be Active skills (well Meditation is hardly active... but it's not really Knowledge either. And what is Arcane Languages? Centring can only use Active/Knowledge skills). If you could take a Language as your creative skill, that would reduce the karma cost considerably... Active skills are rather expensive.

Good point about the Power focus being destroyed or stolen whereas Centring cannot (though gagging, tying up etc might prevent centring while you can still use a focus touching you). In which case, replace Power foci with ally spirits; using 5000Y for 1kp cash-for-karma you should be able to get a decent force ally for cheaper than buying and bonding a Power focus of the same force. They can't get stolen very easily. As a bonus they'd be able to supply their own Spell defence... but that is getting a bit off-topic. Also, while projecting you Cannot centre, but you still keep all the benefits of having a power focus.

Don't forget Reflecting, the ultimate passive-aggressive metamagic...which is always funny to watch when someone tries to do Reflecting and Absorbing at the same time.

The exact break point depends on how your character is scoped out, but if you don't institute Karma-saving measures it generally comes around the 14-15 skill mark for sorcerors and conjurers.

Check the second paragraph under Centering Skills, same page.

An arcane language is a language, usually obscure or mystical, that you recite in while performing your centering ritual. Generally, the language depends on your culture/tradition (examples include Gaelic, Hebrew, Latin, Nahuatl, and Sperethiel), but it may also include "mystical" languages like Enochian.

I think that's exactly what they plan to do.

I'm looking where it says

So you could have sculpting or metalworking as a creative skill (since you're creating something artistic) and centre using it while enchanting, but it would be hard to do on the fly out in the field.

I was thinking Ancient Languages was an active skill that lets you actively chant and gesticulate etc in one of the languages you know (and don't use in every day speech). But if your creative skill can be Active or Knowledge or Language, then chanting some language is definitely the way to go to save karma. I am still unsure what Knowledge skills could be considered creative. "I know about Elven Fine Wines so I will think really really hard about them, and mystically now be able to hit the goon with partial cover..." I just don't see how knowing about some field can be creative.

So that's the point at which buying two levels of an Active skill (Centring) plus two levels of an Active/Knowledge(/Language) skill (your chosen creative skill) costs less karma than buying one level in each of your magical (or if Adept then Stealth/Athletics/Other) skills that you plan to use Centring with? If your creative skill is Active, and you could apply Centring to four skills, advancing via either route would cost the same (if your linked attributes were equal). So Centring is the cheaper route if you (a) use a Language creative skill and/or (b) can use Centring on four or more skills.

Ah yes - to clarify my previous post, I want to cast a Powerball that will affect all combatants in melee range to me but I don't want to nuke myself. Powerball only affects targets I can see. Theoretically I could carry a discoball with me everywhere, Levitate2 it up in the air with a spell-lock, quickly cast Invisibility, intentionally fail to resist my own spell, and then Powerball ground zero safe in the knowledge I won't affect myself (can't see myself) and I will affect all my enemies (can see them all).

But that's munchy. Whereas cutting off my nose to spite my face (sic) - that's just stupid.

It sounds to me like the lyricist of this song was clearly not thinking laterally enough when using their creative skill Songwriting(Cha). Ought to play more RPGs with mages who point out that even though they're tied up and blind-folded they can still target themselves with a touch spell.

My understanding was always that the LOS requirement could be satisfied by touch, but touch could not be satisfied by LOS.

After reading SR3 spell targetting passage, I'm not sure where I got that impression, though.

Possibly SR4, whihch specificly says that LOS can be satisfied by touch instead.

Please correct me if I am wrong, (no doubt you all will) but can't you just research and develop a spell formula that will do just that? You can take away the LOS requirement, lower the drain code by 1, then just make yourself exclusive so it radiates outward, (for that customization, I would rule the drain code goes back up 1)

Do you mean by this that if I am staring intently at the newspaper and a pigeon poops on me as it flies past I can fry that sucker with a manabolt without even looking up, simply because it is potentially visible to me if I were looking in the right direction?

It's souper, isen't it?

Is that an Active skill use?

Well that's just my point. As Kremlin suggested, you only have to have Line-of-sight from (some part of) your body to (some part of) your target for you to be able to target them with a spell. This may be why in the rules it always speaks of mage "having LOS" to a target rather than simply "seeing" them.

If facing does not affect LOS, then that means I can land a Powerball on myself and affect all targets within range, in front of me, beside me and behind me; they don't get "total cover" from my cranium / hair / hat. It also means I can read a newspaper while I manabolt a pigeon flying behind me without ever having to actually see it at all. It also means I don't need a makeup mirror to send a spell around a corner in a hallway - I just have to poke my pinky around the corner and hey-presto I have LOS to them despite being unable to see them. Come to think of it, if spells start shooting out of an array of fibre-optics, all I have to do is plant my palm across them and cast: as long as the mage on the other end isn't wearing reflective sunglasses, I have LOS to him.

I have always thought you needed to be able to see part of your target, ie there is direct or reflected LOS from one of your pupils to any part of the target's body. But if it's not meant to be so restrictive as that after all... hmmm...

What's your ruling Ancient History?

Since you ask - and this is only my opinion, nothing official - I would suggest that LOS refers to exact physical or astral perceptions, which most commonly means sight (and thus, facing does come into consideration), but which in certain cases may refer to other senses - however, such senses would have to be supermetahumanly accurate to directly pinpoint anything beyond a small radius. In all circumstances, a magician who is "firing blind" should receive a modifier to their target number based on their inability to see the target, which would cause the spell to miss or fail.

Going by that measure:

Hearing - Exactly locating someone with hearing is possible, but they must be close - no more than a meter or two away - and with low ambient noise to confuse the issue.

Smell/Taste - The human senses of smell and taste, which are interrelated, are not normally sufficient to locate anyone beyond the immediate vicinity - a 1 meter radius centered on the magician, 2 if they are extremely foul.

Touch - The magician should, by rights, be able to target anything he can locate by touch at the moment. If he touches a wall, he could cast urban renewal. If a mosquito is biting him, he can cast a slay mosquito spell, or erect a bug barrier around himself. Vibrations transmitted through the ground or another medium are less helpful unless the magician has a supermetahuman degree of perception, or the direction of the source is very obvious (this is known as the "Magician laying on the train tracks" example).

Adept/Cyberware Sense - Ultrasound, natural sonar, and thermographic sense can all be used to cast spells with little difficulty.

For a Sustained spell, I'd agree. For an Instant spell such as Powerball though, I've used the notion that it affects everyone you can see at the instant you cast it (so not including the list of people seen in the preceding 3 seconds).

But spellcasting is a process that takes 3 seconds unless you have reflex enhancements. It isn't really instantaneous.