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Blustar
Hey guys,

I'm new to SR and there are so many supplements and adventures, versions, etc...ahhh! Anyways, I've decided on sticking to SR3 after reading the pros and cons of the system and the support material available. A couple questions...

1. What would you recommend, besides "First Run" would be a good published campaign to go with? There are so many. Which ones are GM friendly? Or is it better to wing it most of the time? Which resources do you use for winging it?

2. For some veteran GM's, how do you run your sessions? Do you use specific books?

3. Are the Matrix rules in the "matrix" really that difficult? Can you slip in the Matrix rules from SR4 into a SR3 campaign with ease? (without having to rewrite all the peripheral rules?

4.What other rules would you recommend stealing from SR4? Someone mentioned contact rules? What are they?

5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)


Sorry for so many questions...

Blue

ps. Any of the SR novels any good?

Platinum
QUOTE
1. What would you recommend, besides "First Run" would be a good published campaign to go with? There are so many. Which ones are GM friendly? Or is it better to wing it most of the time? Which resources do you use for winging it?


I recommend the "missions downloads for third ed. Available here.
http://www.shadowrunrpg.com/missions/downl...R3Archive.shtml
This give you a solid base to work from, along with maps and contacts to use.
There are several different options to include in there. Simple, effective and fun.

QUOTE
2. For some veteran GM's, how do you run your sessions? Do you use specific books?

Main rules, shadowrun companion, cannon companion, magic in the shadows, man and machine will cover almost all your needs.

QUOTE
3. Are the Matrix rules in the "matrix" really that difficult? Can you slip in the Matrix rules from SR4 into a SR3 campaign with ease? (without having to rewrite all the peripheral rules?


They are not difficult, the problem and complains come from "pizza time" That is when you are running the decker portion and everyone else is off doing something else because they are bored. The trick, is to keep the decker and the team together, using the decker to continually interacting with the matrix and the team. so pulling off the cover and bypassing maglocks, hijacking the elevator, etc. If a decker can crack the cover of the elevator circuits or maglock then they can try and directly take over that node without having to try and sleeze their way through the front of the system, and navigate around the system.

QUOTE
4.What other rules would you recommend stealing from SR4? Someone mentioned contact rules? What are they?


I like the idea of AR, I think it has merit but it not the complete omnipresent layer all over the world. Think of the spam and the problems relaying traffic. Also everything being wireless and hackable is pretty silly, and overcomplicates things. I think that if you had glasses, and gloves you can interact with local wireless in establishments, and see the "extras" would be nice to get a menu when you want, order water... etc without having to wait on the staff. It also adds some atmosphere to an establishment. But I do not think it would go beyond that.

QUOTE
5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)

listed above.
might want to add matrix and rigger3....

ps. Any of the SR novels any good?

yeah .... many of them. Anything by nigel findley, and tom dowd are good. When you get into trilogys make sure you remove your brain before you read them. It makes digesting the metaplot alot easier.
eidolon
First off, welcome to SR and to Dumpshock.

QUOTE (Blustar)
1. What would you recommend, besides "First Run" would be a good published campaign to go with? There are so many. Which ones are GM friendly? Or is it better to wing it most of the time? Which resources do you use for winging it?


Honestly, I've never really liked any of the published SR modules. A lot of them have good ideas for yoinking and adapting, but for me, they tend to be a little too campy. Later ones are much better than earlier ones. Keep in mind that I can't claim to have read every page of every one of them. Lots of people like them from what I've seen, I just prefer to run less linear games.

For winging it, nothing beats a decent knowledge of the SR world as set out in the main books. You don't have to know everything about the whole world, but when you're running a game set in Seattle, it's good to know about Seattle, etc. Also, skimming through the books enough to know where something is is always a good thing. I might not know exactly who the leader of the Red Hot Nukes is, but I know that I can bust out New Seattle and find the answer quickly if need be.

Also, dose yourself up on popular "cyberpunk" fiction. Read Neuromancer by Gibson for sure. Phillip K. Dick and Bruce Sterling are good too. Other folks can chime in with their faves. This will mostly help to give you a "feel" for the atmosphere of the game. If you do a search for books, movies, and music that "is" Shadowrun, you'll find tons of threads to give you ideas.

Other than that, just remember that learning to wing it takes time and practice. Don't think you're bad at it just because the first time you run off the cuff, you forget some NPC's name or something. It happens. The best thing you can do when winging it is to take copious notes (there was a thread on this recently), and run the game with confidence.

QUOTE (Blustar)
2. For some veteran GM's, how do you run your sessions? Do you use specific books?


This will get all kinds of different answers, as GMs develop their own style over time, which rarely matches that of another completely. (Which is a good thing.)

I tend to do as much prep as possible, usually dependent on either how much notice I have that I'll be running, or how much time I have left after inspiration finally strikes. (GM's block sucks. The best way to work around it is to plan for it. When you have ideas, write them down so that you can prep them for the future.)

During prep, I tend to use these heavily: New Seattle, Shadows of North America, Loose Alliances, Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book, Matrix (and the main book of course)

During a game, I always have the following books nearby: Shadowrun 3, Shadowrun Companion, Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book, Rigger 3 Revised, Magic in the Shadows, Man & Machine, Cannon Companion, and any setting books related to what I'm running at the time.

QUOTE (Blustar)
3. Are the Matrix rules in the "matrix" really that difficult? Can you slip in the Matrix rules from SR4 into a SR3 campaign with ease? (without having to rewrite all the peripheral rules?


Platinum pretty much nailed this. The rules aren't difficult to run, especially if you have the Decker learn them instead of constantly relying on you (not that you shouldn't know the rules, but it can slow down the game having to play half of his/her character for them). Doing Matrix stuff can involve significant amounts of prep work if you aren't comfortable running it on the fly (systems, security sheafs, responses, etc.). However, there are various tools around the net that can help with this, and eventually you'll be able to run systems off the top of your head.

More than the rules being difficult, I think it's the perception that the rules are difficult that makes for so much grumbling. I say this, because I used to be a grumbler. Once you get past the idea that they're hard and actually start using them, you'll realize that they're no more difficult to grasp or use than the rules for combat or magic.

Also, on the note of "pizza time", it too can be mitigated. Do this by learning how to engage the decker on runs (on-site overwatch, for example). Platinum mentioned something along the lines, but in my last game the decker hacked into an elevator panel and ran security overwatch on an entire building. It was tough, but he was good, and the player enjoyed it a lot more than he would have sitting "at the safehouse".

QUOTE (Blustar)
4.What other rules would you recommend stealing from SR4? Someone mentioned contact rules? What are they?


I can't really speak to this, as I don't play SR4.

QUOTE (Blustar)

5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)


The ones about Shadowrun. wink.gif If I had to pick a top 3 though, it would be
1. New Seattle
What more can you say? It details Seattle.

2. Shadows of North America
Same reason, but bigger.

3. Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book
I don't know what the community reaction to this one is/was, but I find it immensely useful. It
has a decent stockpile of ready-made NPCs, lots of "fluff" on Mr. Johnsons in general, and a
really cool "runs on the fly" chart that has provided my group with tons of last minute runs
While not enough to use alone, it can really help when you need to throw together a run when
your players go "so, wanna play today?").

All of them are useful to one degree or another, especially if you have somewhat limited time to devote to running a game. Sure, I could take two weeks to detail out what's going on in Scotland. Or I could grab Shadows of Europe.

On the novels, I recommend the "Secrets of Power" trilogy, Changeling, and 2XS. I read other good ones, but the titles are escaping me at the moment.
Platinum
QUOTE

Honestly, I've never really liked any of the published SR modules.  A lot of them have good ideas for yoinking and adapting, but for me, they tend to be a little too campy.  Later ones are much better than earlier ones.  Keep in mind that I can't claim to have read every page of every one of them.  Lots of people like them from what I've seen, I just prefer to run less linear games. 

For winging it, nothing beats a decent knowledge of the SR world as set out in the main books.  You don't have to know everything about the whole world, but when you're running a game set in Seattle, it's good to know about Seattle, etc.  Also, skimming through the books enough to know where something is is always a good thing.  I might not know exactly who the leader of the Red Hot Nukes is, but I know that I can bust out New Seattle and find the answer quickly if need be. 

Also, dose yourself up on popular "cyberpunk" fiction.  Read Neuromancer by Gibson for sure.  Phillip K. Dick and Bruce Sterling are good too.  Other folks can chime in with their faves.  This will mostly help to give you a "feel" for the atmosphere of the game.  If you do a search for books, movies, and music that "is" Shadowrun, you'll find tons of threads to give you ideas.

Other than that, just remember that learning to wing it takes time and practice.  Don't think you're bad at it just because the first time you run off the cuff, you forget some NPC's name or something.  It happens.  The best thing you can do when winging it is to take copious notes (there was a thread on this recently), and run the game with confidence.


While I agree with eidolon about not using adventures, they really help you out when you first start to GM. They do all of the tedious stuff for you. I would like to add that you do not have to adhere to them. Never debug an adventure, just go where the players direct. They will ALWAYS do things you cannot anticipate. The missions modules are not huge adventures with metaplot, they are just small runs that are easy to whip off and finish in 1 session.

And reading is important. It gives you ideas and a feel for the game.

As for the rest it depends on the type of person you are, I seldom use location source books, but incorporate a great deal of tech. When I was GM'ing all the time, I would read the books in my off time, and never had to reference them in the game sessions. eidolon operates differently but the books he mentioned are good as well.

Wounded Ronin
QUOTE (Blustar)
Hey guys,

I'm new to SR and there are so many supplements and adventures, versions, etc...ahhh! Anyways, I've decided on sticking to SR3 after reading the pros and cons of the system and the support material available. A couple questions...

1. What would you recommend, besides "First Run" would be a good published campaign to go with? There are so many. Which ones are GM friendly? Or is it better to wing it most of the time? Which resources do you use for winging it?

2. For some veteran GM's, how do you run your sessions? Do you use specific books?

3. Are the Matrix rules in the "matrix" really that difficult? Can you slip in the Matrix rules from SR4 into a SR3 campaign with ease? (without having to rewrite all the peripheral rules?

4.What other rules would you recommend stealing from SR4? Someone mentioned contact rules? What are they?

5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)


Sorry for so many questions...

Blue

ps. Any of the SR novels any good?

I humbly submit to you an introductory SR3 adventure I wrote.

http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...l=mullet+police

Take a look at it and decide if you'd like to run it or not.
eidolon
How did I miss that the first time around??

Awesome. biggrin.gif
Catsnightmare
QUOTE (eidolon)

3.  Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book
I don't know what the community reaction to this one is/was, but I find it immensely useful.  It 
has a decent stockpile of ready-made NPCs, lots of "fluff" on Mr. Johnsons in general, and a 
really cool "runs on the fly" chart that has provided my group with tons of last minute runs 
While not enough to use alone, it can really help when you need to throw together a run when 
your players go "so, wanna play today?").


MJLBB also has the quick-decking optional rules.
eidolon
Ah, good point. Those didn't really suit me, but another guy in our group that occasionally GMs uses them and loves them.

IIRC, it also has the quick vehicle combat rules, doesn't it?
SuperFly
QUOTE (Blustar)
1. What would you recommend, besides "First Run" would be a good published campaign to go with? There are so many. Which ones are GM friendly? Or is it better to wing it most of the time? Which resources do you use for winging it?


Make it up yourself. Why run something that's published when you can create your own game goodness?

QUOTE (Blustar)

2. For some veteran GM's, how do you run your sessions? Do you use specific books?


It's better that I show you than tell you. You can find a lot of logs from my games at the #S-Run Community Homepage as well my A-Team campaign, which is COMPLETELY documented from start to present gametime.

QUOTE (Blustar)

5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)


I personally use SR3 as the only 100% applicable rulesource. As all our games are done over IRC ( the best way to play in my book), using too many rulesets slows the game to a crawl and makes it no fun for anybody. I also accept CC, MitS, and M&M for the most part -- with a few exceptions. The Companion is a waste of space, and rigger3/Matrix are only useful for new gear.

QUOTE (Blustar)
ps. Any of the SR novels any good?


Some are, some aren't. I own every (English-published) one and have read almost all of them except for the most recent incarnations and a few of the final FASA SR works.
If I were to suggest 1 book/group of books it would be the "Secrets of Power" trilogy. They were the first novels and are still the best. The trilogy consists of "Never Deal with a Dragon", "Choose Your Enemies Carefully", and "Find Your Own Truth".
nezumi
QUOTE (Blustar)
1. What would you recommend, besides "First Run" would be a good published campaign to go with? There are so many. Which ones are GM friendly? Or is it better to wing it most of the time? Which resources do you use for winging it?

I would *NOT* recommend First Run. At least not without tweaking. There's a combat scene where the party faces off against 8 red samurai and a cyberzombie. They then go on to meet Miles Lanier and whoever that other fellow is. A bit too high powered for most higher level characters. But with some tweaking it can work.

There are plenty of other modules which are simpler and require less altering. I ran Dragon Hunt and am now running Dark Angel, both of which are SR1, but because there's relatively little combat, the stats aren't a huge concern (and updating stats is reasonably easy). But looking at:

http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/shadowrun/7300.html

For a general idea of what runs will be neat to go with.

QUOTE

2. For some veteran GM's, how do you run your sessions? Do you use specific books?


Hopefully you won't be referencing the books too often. It may be best to stick just to the main manual until you're comfortable with it, then introduce other books one at a time into game play. I do find myself referencing the main book regularly, but the other books (Cannon Companion and Magic in the Shadows mostly) come up when I have specific situations during game play. Things like what the cyberware does may be best written on something else for quick reference (both for yourself and the player).


QUOTE

3. Are the Matrix rules in the "matrix" really that difficult? Can you slip in the Matrix rules from SR4 into a SR3 campaign with ease? (without having to rewrite all the peripheral rules?


The matrix rules aren't difficult, they just aren't well described in the book. I would recommend either avoiding the matrix until you're ready for it, or playing through a few runs on yourself until you know how everything works. The big problem people complain about with the matrix is that it doesn't match current computer theory (which can be easily remediated without changing the rules), and that when the decker does his thing, everyone else zones out (which can be fixed through liberal use of the fast decking/data searching rules and by putting the decker on the same initiative as the rest of the group, so his actions are mixed in during their actions.)

Matrix stuff more than anything has required creativity on my part and 'seat-of-the-pants flying'.

QUOTE

4.What other rules would you recommend stealing from SR4? Someone mentioned contact rules? What are they?


*whew* I have a list of rules I'd grab from SR4 or just add in...
-Allow PCs to 'buy' successes on their etiquette test to acquire equipment through the expenditure of normal money (money talks)
-An aim reaction is required to make use of a weapon's scope (SR4)
-Contacts both have numbers representing how much they like you and also how useful they are (SR4)
-Limited spell grounding rules (SR2)
-Changing the prices of particular bits of gear (cyberlimbs, headware memory, headware comm equipment)
-Stage down the damage from AV ammunition like normal (a pred with AV ammo does 9L against a car, not 9M) (custom)

QUOTE

5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)


This depends mostly on your players. I've found Magic in the Shadows and Man and Machine are the ones I reference the absolute most. Cannon Companion has a few useful rules. The SOTA books are nice because they're mostly focused on particular fields of work, so they may be in line with your particular campaign. The Companion book has edges and flaws, which people like, but for the most part I don't use it much.

QUOTE

ps. Any of the SR novels any good?


Yes
Shrike30
I'm going to counter nezumi's suggestion about spell grounding... stay away from it like it's the plague, unless you like things on the astral plane dropping fireballs out of the astral and into the mage's pocket, killing everyone nearby.
Platinum
Grounding keeps your mages humble and aware of the astral plane. I cried when I saw it dropped in 3.
Shrike30
... and makes the rest of the group stay the hell away from the mage...
Platinum
Only if the mage is running around with active spell locks or active "force 1 sustaining foci."

If you have a foci.... you should get shielding. helps things out.

How many people actually popped spell locks?
Not very many.... it just helped out balance the mages running around with 50 locks.
Catsnightmare
Well, which is worse grounding or no foci whatsoever.
Platinum
No foci would be worse. I mean no power foci, no weapon foci. etc... that would be bad. They traded grounding for focus addiction, which I think is a step in the wrong direction.
eidolon
QUOTE (SuperFly)
The Companion is a waste of space, and rigger3/Matrix are only useful for new gear.


A waste of space...unless you want to use the standard points buy system, edges and flaws...alternate character types...or if you want to miss a bunch of information that's pretty handy to a starting GM.

It's all about taste, to be sure, but calling a book with several highly campaign enhancing things in it a "waste of space" seems a bit off. Especially when it's coming from someone that is openly a SR minimalist.

And "only good for new gear" isn't exactly true either. They also contain expanded rules for just about anything you think of. It's all about what you enjoy doing.

Also, on the note of using books, I should piggyback on what nezumi said. Hopefully, your session goes well without actually doing much book referencing while playing. I interpreted the question "what books do you use?" as "what books do you keep handy when running a game". Usually, we only have to go to the books a few times over the session. The less you need to flip through books, the better.

In that vein, it usually is best to get comfortable with running a "standard" (BBB only) game before beginning to branch out into other sources. It serves to provide you a solid foundation on which to build your repetoir later (adding in rules and concepts from the library). After you feel like you've got the BBB game down, for example, you can start allowing stuff from say, MiTS, and get comfy with that. So on and so forth.

SuperFly
Meh, he asked for our opinions as GM's of our own games so that's what I gave him in hopes that it would better aid him. You're right, though, I am an advocate of SR minimalism. It's good to see my reputation still precedes me. =P

I personally dislike the point system and Edges/Flaws because they are too easily abused by players wanting to create a combat monster. The meta-variants are also a laughable addition to Sr and completely ignored by most everyone I've played with. As for the Matrix and Rigger3 materials, they're only useful if you have PC playing someone who decks or rigs... I was saying that otherwise they ARE only useful for pulling up information on gear when someone's buying a new vehicle/aircraft, getting attacked by someone in one, or snatching some brain-dead fool's deck as loot. biggrin.gif
Wounded Ronin
QUOTE (SuperFly)

Make it up yourself. Why run something that's published when you can create your own game goodness?

For fear of doing it wrong since as a new GM you don't really have a frame of reference.


Eidolon: thanks very much for your kind complement. smile.gif
SuperFly
QUOTE (Wounded Ronin)

For fear of doing it wrong since as a new GM you don't really have a frame of reference.

That can be an intimidating thing, for sure! However, it is a barrier every GM has to cross at some point.

If he lacks frames of reference to write his own material, he might want to try burying himself in the lore for a while before beginning his game. Maybe run a few short missions to test his strengths and weaknesses, gauges his players' aptitudes and deficiencies (fighting, thinking, planning), then work off of that into his actual campaign.

Nobody picks up a gamebook and becomes God's-Own-amemaster overnight...it's a craft that takes a while to master, and everyone has their own way of doing it.

Personally, my introduction to SR was a bit ass-backwards: first I played the SNES game, then started on the novels, the Genesis game, bought and read through all the sourcebooks I could find cover-to-cover since I had no one to play with, then finally found a group on IRC and got to play a game. This gave me a unique perspective on Shadowrun because I had a much broader understanding of what was going on in the game world; how things were; and what caused things to be. It definately allowed me to create much richer and more compelling characters.

Something I thought was a shame was how SR3 ditched a lot of awesome factual info on the different races and focused on a more touchy-feely "personal perspective" on them -- which doesn't give much perspective on just how different they can be, what their lifestyles are like, and why racism is so intense. Also, with the ditching of the 20 questions and other design changes, it seemed like the game focused more on how powerful a character could become -- rather than how interesting and "real" they could be. SR3 had a superior ruleset by far, but the ability to give new players a broad level-of-understanding dropped significantly.

I played for years before finally trying my hand at GM'ing -- and JESUS, was my first run a stinker! Every badguy had thermographic cybereyes, the terrain was there in such a manner that only served to hinder the players, and NPC's possessed a magical sixth sense and always seemed to put the runner in the wrong place at the wrong time. The team lived, but just barely.

When I continued GM'ing, I decided to focus on the NPC's. Who are they? Why are they? How do they function outside of a set of stats? What motivates them? The aesthetics of the setting are of GREAT importance -- without them there would be no Shadowrun -- but nothing breathes life into a game more than every NPC having their own motivations, attitudes, and ideas. There will always be mooks to gun down with relative ease, yet even they can be given some semblance of personality.

Who's the alpha dog of the group? Who's the meanest? Who's the most likely to panic; do something stupid and risky; fight with the most skill? These are all relatively easy traits to apply to groups of thugs, and adds a whole lot of depth when it comes down to the nitty gritty of combat.

For major NPC's who'll be hanging around, try giving them not only numbers; but backgrounds, histories, wants and desires, vices, personalities, motivations, and feelings. Make them walking, talking, breathing people. I find that when you do this, they take on a life of their own and 'do their thing' with minimal prompting from myself or my players. They respond to the world and interact with/adapt to it -- much like the players themselves -- which keeps me on my toes and enjoying the games even more.
eidolon
It's not that your reputation precedes you, so much as

"we're SR noir...gritty....etc etc etc.."

+

"I only use the core book"

pretty well = minimalist style of play.

Which is cool, but worth mentioning before you bash a bunch of books without mentioning anything what they can be good for. smile.gif

I understand completely. I play (and DM) a very minimalist D&D 3.5 game when I can be assed to bother, and much for the same types of reasons you give for minimalist SR. But I wouldn't go to a D&D site and say "the monster manual sucks because I don't use it."

I personally agree on the metavariants. (We do use ghouls occasionally, but the rest are absurd, IMO.) But they are in the book.

Oh, and good advice on NPCs too by the way.
SuperFly
QUOTE (eidolon)
Also, dose yourself up on popular "cyberpunk" fiction. Read Neuromancer by Gibson for sure. Phillip K. Dick and Bruce Sterling are good too. Other folks can chime in with their faves. This will mostly help to give you a "feel" for the atmosphere of the game. If you do a search for books, movies, and music that "is" Shadowrun, you'll find tons of threads to give you ideas.

Amen.
nezumi
I would recommend AGAINST doing your first few missions on yourself. You'll have enough to keep in mind just runningn a scripted one. Make your life easier.

Also, Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book was pretty much written exclusively for people in your place. It's a handy book. If you have the money, it may make your life significantly easier.
Brahm
QUOTE (Blustar @ Jun 7 2006, 07:54 PM)
4.What other rules would you recommend stealing from SR4? Someone mentioned contact rules? What are they?

Barring the whole damn thing? wink.gif The whole of the Matrix and likely the vehicle stuff because in SR4 the Matrix and vehicles are really the same system. Although at this point SR4's vehicle combat stuff isn't the greatest either, at least it is an improvement. There were even less people that used SR3's vehicle rules as written than the SR3 Matrix ones. So bets are pretty good you are going to replace them with something anyway. smile.gif

The wireless everywhere thing isn't really a problem, in fact it is the solution to the "pizza time" and detachment from the team that PC Deckers run into. Just don't get too hung up on it. There is apparently lots of good examples in On The Run of how to handle the SR4 Matrix but I haven't read it myself, I'm not the GM and we haven't played it, and that is an SR4 adventure book.

QUOTE
5. What are the essential non-rule books ( Rigger3, CC, MiTS, etc...) for SR3? (books as a GM you couldn't live with out)


BBB is "big black book", a traditional name for the core book even though you'll not be buying it with a black cover. You can get by with just the base BBB. Not quite as much as in SR4, since the SR4 BBB includes a number of things in the core book that used to be located in the SR3 supplimental books, but you are going to have plenty of stuff to worry about learning in the core book to start with without mixing in everything else.

I know that those extra books are part of the reason of why you are picking SR3 over SR4. Which is why I question that choice. By the time you are ready for the SR4 supplemental books they'll be there. There is lots of territory to cover first.

But that aside the ones that you eventually are going to need are CC, MitS, and Man & Machine. Mr. Johnson's Little Black Book is likely a great pickup if you aren't going to patch in SR4's Matrix because it has a different slimmed down replacement for the Matrix rules. smile.gif Shadowrun Companion has some nice things in it.

In some ways Rigger 3. But it is a wierd one because it is a crunchie rules book that I would highly recommend against using a significant portion of the rules from. Just treat it like a fluff book, which it isn't, and it's a great book. smile.gif The Matrix book is sort of that way too. It really depends on whether you find yourself actually using PC Deckers with the core books rules.

Where are you planning on running? Because picking up at least one setting book is going to be helpful too.
Shrike30
Our group never upgraded from Rigger 2 to Rigger 3. It didn't ever end up being necessary. 2 may have been kind of on crack when they put some of the rules together, 3 was like crack on speed cyber.gif
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